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Author
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Topic: the positives of a Venus Square Saturn
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carlfloydfan
unregistered
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posted August 08, 2006 02:58 AM
 
I know this has been said to be one of the worst aspects in synastry. It is an aspect that points towards lots of problems in relationships bacause of ulterior motives, especially if saturn is in a sign like scorpio. But I really don't see that as a problem in mine, and that is an aspect I have. I have no desire to be manipulative and sense that in people, but not my gf. Maybe it also makes talking about problems difficult? If so, maybe that is a negative energy we get from this placement. Or we are to involved (head in the clouds) in love to be practical and detach ourselves and look at the relationship objectivly. If that is a problem attributed to venus square mars, than it may be like us. what are some of the good qualities of this aspect and what aspect tend to mute venus square saturn or water it down? I am sure we have because the description just does not sound like us. Unless my guesses at what else it could mean are right. IP: Logged |
Glaucus
Moderator Posts: 5228
From: Sacramento,California
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted August 08, 2006 03:53 AM
That aspect can indicate loyalty,stability,security,stability,responsibility,obligation,duty,practicalness,seriousness between the two of you.Also..what is the orb of the aspect? Orbs do matter. I don't care what some people say. The closer the orb,the stronger the aspect.
Aspects involving Neptune can definitely water it down. hehehee.....Neptune water down..hehehe
Aspects involving Jupiter can modify too due to its optimistic,enthusiastic,expansive nature. IP: Logged |
Dulce Luna
Newflake Posts: 7
From: The Asylum, NC
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted August 08, 2006 08:48 AM
It also depends on the maturity of the two people involved, Carl. You said it yourself, that you have no desire to manipulate your gf. I have the opposition both ways with my father and it's pretty bad but my father, emotionally, isn't mature. He's very self-centered. On the positive side, venus square saturn could mean a strong commitment and I've also read that it can be very karmic.
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carlfloydfan
unregistered
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posted August 08, 2006 12:01 PM
I am thinkingNeptune Trine Ascendant
Neptune Sextile Pluto
Jupiter Sextile Saturn as you say, maybe those could act as a cushion for the harder areas of venus square mars and magnify the positive qualities. not sure what to make of jupiter square asc.
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Glaucus
Moderator Posts: 5228
From: Sacramento,California
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted August 08, 2006 12:19 PM
Neptune sextile Pluto is not it...that's a very generational aspect.Jupiter sextile Saturn is somewhat...that's a social planetary aspect
Neptune trine Ascendant is definitely a good one for empathic,spiritual,compassionate,idealistic connection. Neptune is a generational planet..unless it's stationary...I wouldn't use more than 1 degree orb. That's what I use for Neptune,and Pluto. I use 2 degree orb for Uranus. I use 3 degree orb for Chiron. This is just for synastry.
Jupiter square Ascendant can be an optimistic,enthusiastic,expansive connection
BUT it can be judgmental issues. There can be overindulgence.
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Glaucus
Moderator Posts: 5228
From: Sacramento,California
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted August 08, 2006 12:25 PM
Carl,this is from solar fire. Venus hard aspect Saturn in synastry The planet Saturn is an important ingredient in any committed relationship. On a positive note this planet indicates the commitment and security needed for a long-term association. However, in this case the path to love is rocky and there are likely to be obstacles which require hard work if this relationship is to be lasting. On the one hand both %1 and %2 love each other and want to form a successful and loving bond. However, on the other hand they have to strive hard to overcome their misunderstandings of each other. %1 wants fun and pleasure. [He/She/1] has a lot of love to give, but has difficulty finding avenues through which to communicate [his/her/1] feelings to %2. %1 believes that %2 may be blocking any progress in their relationship, inadvertently spoiling the fun. At times %1 fears that [he/she/1] will be stifled as the relationship continues. %2 does take this relationship seriously, perhaps a little too seriously. [He/She/2] has difficulty overcoming [his/her/2] concerns about how the relationship should progress. %2 may be a little too rigid in [his/her/2] beliefs, fearing true intimacy. The challenge for both %1 and %2 is to face their fears and find a path forward. With hard work and determination they can build a secure partnership based on mutual respect and love. While this combination of planets can indicate a serious personal relationship, it can also depict a partnership formed for the purpose of an artistic or creative project requiring both inspiration and hard work. IP: Logged |
Glaucus
Moderator Posts: 5228
From: Sacramento,California
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted August 08, 2006 12:31 PM
This from Psyche and Eros ReportVenus in hard aspect to Saturn
Sometimes ~ puts too much pressure on you which can be a turn-off -- especially when that pressure becomes too demanding, too jealous or, in some way, too inhibiting of your pleasure. A natural response to withdraw only makes it worse. ~ secretly longs for your approval.
Cosmo compatibility report
Venus square Saturn Feelings of estrangement, distance, coolness, or lack of appreciation and affection characterize your relationship from time to time, and Venus person in particular feels inhibited or criticized by Saturn Person. You take your commitment, responsibility, and obligations to one another seriously and you may depend heavily on one another financially or emotionally, but you tend to become too formal and rather joyless if you spend too much time together.
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elsaelsa
unregistered
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posted August 08, 2006 05:03 PM
>>It is an aspect that points towards lots of problems in relationships bacause of ulterior motives, especially if saturn is in a sign like scorpio>>>No, no, no, and no. My man has Venus exactly conjunct Saturn in Scorpio and he is the best man I have ever had. And I have had some very good men! Way more than my share! He is an artist, a painter specifically and does tend to paint old style. His tastes run to the classical (ballet, not modern for example) and he is loyal and committed. Further, he’s old but he looks young! Go Saturn!!! This aspect pays later in life! He knows what real (Saturn) love (Venus) is.
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http://elsaelsa.com IP: Logged |
carlfloydfan
unregistered
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posted August 08, 2006 09:20 PM
um, re-read my post. you are talking about venus conjuct saturn and I am speaking of venus square saturn, so...yes...yah
Thanks Glaucus! Very informative. I figured all aspects have positives and negatives, thats why I posted this topic, I simply was not sure of the positives of venus square saturn. Just like a venus/saturn conjuct having some negatives too, venus/saturn square has its positives, I knew it.
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astroleolady
Newflake Posts: 6
From: in the ether
Registered: Jul 2009
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posted August 08, 2006 09:51 PM
It's going to depend on how the Saturn and Venus play out in your own natal charts: what signs they are in, house placements, positive or negative aspects and the house cusps Venus and Saturn rule.If they are well aspected and expressed in a more positive fashion natally than that is then applied to the Synastry. And the same thing if they are expressed negatively natally. My parents have that aspect in their synastry. It's been expressed as loyalty, duty and commitment. They will have been married 45 years this fall. Good luck to you, Carl.  IP: Logged |
carlfloydfan
unregistered
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posted August 09, 2006 02:10 AM
thanks astroleolady!You gave me a new outlook on "tougher" aspects in synastry. After looking at my own chart I found that I likely DO take from the positive side of the venus square saturn aspect because I have: A Conjunction between Sun and Saturn. This would lead to a more ordered life, one of honesty and faithfulness. Sun is in scorpio in 9th house or 10th house, depending on site, though 9th house sounds more like me and saturn in scorpio in 10th. A Conjunction between Venus and Uranus points towards an unusual or different approach (in a good way) towards a relationship, would it not? Something rather innovative in how I work with my gf. My venus is in sag in house 11 and uranus in sag in house 11. A Conjunction between Venus and Neptune points towards a dreamer. my gf is sensitive so this works well in our synastry and venus square saturn. It also makes me a bit of a charmer and maybe even romantic  . again venus sag house 11 and neptune sag house 12. A Conjunction between Saturn and Midheaven. Which would make me rather methodical in my approch to love. or lover of consistency. which I think works well with aspect in question. Moon Trine Venus: a good one for charm . moon in aries house 3. this alone should be able to make me work through difficulties of venus square saturn and other squares we have in synastry like Sun Square Saturn. Mars Sextile Saturn I also have and Saturn Sextile Ascendant. and oddly enough I really only have 7-8 other major aspects. most of my major ones seem to include venus and saturn. IP: Logged |
Peri
Knowflake Posts: 1848
From: 49N35 34E34
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted August 09, 2006 03:01 AM
You have great synastry aspects, so this Venus/Saturn square should not bother you very much, but you definitely must be aware of it. I don't think it is possible to be in an ideal relationship where everything runs smoothly and perfectly; Why would we need it then? We enter relationships to learn and grow and it is stressful aspects that urge us to grow, they are necessary whether is it a natal chart or a synastry; quote:
...Squares (where two signs are ninety degrees apart, e.g. Gemini and Virgo or Pisces), on the other hand, are just plain difficult to deal with. They are often called challenges, instead of problems, but trust me: They’re problems!
...Saturn, on the other hand, is the karmic planet. It’s the one that says “you did me in in an earlier life, you dirty so and so”. Or... “We were once passionate lovers... Remember?” It has been said, that when comparing two people’s charts (for any kind of relationship), check the relevant placements of Saturn. There will almost always be a connection, in that if there is no Saturnian connection, the odds are extremely good that the two people will never have stopped long enough to even chat. Saturn appears to be a critical factor in first bringing two people’s attention to focus on one another. It’s even been said, that without a Saturn connection, two people cannot stay together. It’s as if we relish the... you know: challenges of a relationship... more than the comfort. This therefore implies that the main reason for relationships is to meet the challenges and undergo the transformations that come with that particular package.
http://www.halexandria.org/dward327.htm
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astroleolady
Newflake Posts: 6
From: in the ether
Registered: Jul 2009
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posted August 09, 2006 03:10 AM
You're welcome, Carl.Tough doesn't mean impossible! Squares can indicate tension, but also challenge and accomplishment. Yes, you do sound like you have a really good handle on your Saturn, and it's being expressed maturely in your chart. Just the fact that you are concerned about it and your relationship, speaks volumes and shows your maturity to me - Saturn conjunct Sun and the MC. From what I have read, the harder aspects in synastry are necessary for growth in the relationship. Synastry with all trines and sextiles would get pretty boring after awhile. Paul Newman and Joanne Woodward have a couple of hard aspects (one which involves Saturn and Mars), and they have been married for years. Have you done the compatibility analysis on Cafe Astrology before? It may interest you.
http://www.cafeastrology.com/synastry.html Some scoring examples: A couple that lasted 10 months, the last 5 months of which were very challenging, no commitment: +39 -28, for a score of 11. One Weight 4, two Weight -4 factors. A couple married for 15 years, difficult divorce: +56 -20, for an overall score of +36. Four Weight 4, one Weight -4 factors. A couple married for 2 years, easy divorce: +26 -29, for a score of -3. No Weight 4 factors, one Weight -4 factor. Paul Newman and Joanne Woodward, long-lasting marriage: +82 -23, for a score of +59. Two Weight 4 factors, fourteen Weight 3 factors, two Weight -3 factors, one Weight -4 (Red alert) factor. Generally, the higher the positive score, the more that binds the couple together in the long term. However, even many Weight 4 factors do not always save a couple from divorce (as can be seen with example 2). When numbers are high in the + category, and the couple does eventually break up, the more potential for a challenging break up, perhaps because the bond was strong in the first place. For example, if we compare the scores of the two divorced couples (examples 2 and 3), even though there was a higher negative score for the couple in example 3, there was a weak showing in the positive score as well. This likely accounts for the easy divorce—it was a quick marriage and easy divorce, as if the couple pretty much accepted that it was perhaps a "mistake" in the first place, so there were few hard feelings. Example 4 is a famous couple often used as an example in relationship astrology. One of the reasons is that the birth data is accurate, and another is because the couple's marriage has been long-standing, which isn't very common with celebrities. Here we see an extremely high positive score, and a rather high negative score. They have two Weight 4 (Strongest Compatibility) factors, and a whopping fourteen Weight 3 (Very Strong Compatibility) factors. They have one Weight 4 (Red Alert) factor, and a rather low number of Weight -3 (Challenging) factors.
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carlfloydfan
unregistered
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posted August 09, 2006 03:38 AM
oh wow that sounds scary, i shall do it just for fun. I am not sure I even have all the aspects possible so it may not be accurate. I notice venus square saturn is a -4.IP: Logged |
carlfloydfan
unregistered
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posted August 09, 2006 04:07 AM
well I got a 9 but there must be something I am missing. there is something very positive about this relationship. what else did I not see?sun opp sun 2
Sun Conjunct Venus 3
Sun Conjunct Mercury 2
Sun Square Saturn -2
Sun Sextile Uranus 2
Sun Square Pluto -2
Moon Sextile Ascendant 3
Moon Square Mars -3
Moon Opposition Neptune -3
Moon Trine Pluto 2
Mercury Square Ascendant -1
Mercury Conjunct Venus 2
Mercury Conjunct Jupiter - 3
Mercury Square Pluto 1
Venus Square Saturn -4
Venus Sextile Uranus 2
Mars Sextile Jupiter 2
Mars Trine Saturn 1
Mars Square Neptune -2
Jupiter Square Ascendant 1
Jupiter Sextile Saturn 1
Jupiter Square Pluto -1 negative total -18
Neptune Trine Ascendant ?
Neptune Sextile Pluto ?
Pluto Opposition Ascendant ?
Your Saturn and Sun conjunct her South Node 3 for a total of 27
Her South Node conjunct your Sun.
Your North Node conjunct her Mar
Her Northnode quindecile your Pluto
for comp chart with midpoint method:
sun in 10th house
Moon in the Second House
mercury in house 10
Saturn in the Seventh House
Pluto in the Seventh House
Uranus in the Eighth House
Jupiter in the Ninth House
Venus in the Tenth House
Mars in the Eleventh House
neptune in 8/9 house
true node in 1st house
asc in aries
 what aspect(s) I am missing? There is something big I know it. IP: Logged |
Glaucus
Moderator Posts: 5228
From: Sacramento,California
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted August 09, 2006 04:39 AM
I don't think that the number system is all that great. It doesn't talk about the orbs that the aspects should be also. Another thing is that tight orbed aspects can really make up for a small amount of certain aspects. I also feel that Ascendant oppose Ascendant should be rated a 4 and not 3. After all,it's the same as Ascendant conjunct Descendant both ways. there were other aspects that I disagreed with weighting. There is so many ways to do compatibility. Definitely near exact aspects can make up for lack of medium orbed aspects. I feel that all Midheaven Aspects should be included. After all, they involve the IC for that is 4th house cusp and the unconscious,domestic is important factors in relationship. Maritha Pottenger even has her own system Stairway To Love.
The main thing is just to believe in your relationship and just make it work regardless of what Astrology says.
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astroleolady
Newflake Posts: 6
From: in the ether
Registered: Jul 2009
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posted August 09, 2006 05:41 AM
Carl,Have you included all the aspects for you and her? You need to tally from both perspectives. For example, her Venus is square your Jupiter, but I don't see it listed. Her Moon is square your Uranus is also not listed. And you also need to include each person's Sun/Moon midpoints in the analysis as well.
http://www.noendpress.com/pvachier/midpoints/index.php I also don't see any Vertex connections. As for orbs, I use 7° and if the Sun, Moon, or Asc are involved, I use 8°. Everyone has their own preferences for orbs though. See what works for you. Do you have any Synastry books? If you are looking for some good Synastry books, here's some that I recommend. Synastry by Davison
The Only Way to Learn About Relationships by March & McEvers
The Astrology of Human Relationships by Sakoian & Acker
Relationship Analysis by Blaschke is another good one.
Skymates by Steven and Jodie Forrest As always, please remember no matter what the results are, you do have free will as does your partner. IP: Logged |
ErickaF
unregistered
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posted July 14, 2007 12:47 AM
I prefer the composite method I like it better. what about venus-saturn squared in a composite chart? even worse? would the description apply also for opposite venus-saturn in composite too?!?!? i had this with an old boyfriend and it was a HARD relationship!IP: Logged |
annaf
Knowflake Posts: 25
From:
Registered: Jun 2009
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posted July 16, 2007 02:56 PM
ErickaF,you mentioned that you experienced the venus-saturn opposition in the composite as 'hard'. Would be grateful if you could elaborate. What was so difficult about the relationship? (I have this in the composite with someone and it seems EXTREMELY difficult to get the relationship even off the ground. But who knows might be due to the double whammy venus-saturn opposition in synastry.) I have no experience with the square between venus and saturn, only with the oppostion. But generally I'm convinced it does provide a strong link between two people, sometimes even a karmic feeling. Whether the positive outweigh the negatives I think really depends in how far people are used to saturn based on their natal charts. I really dont mind saturn in synastry because I have so much saturn in my natal chart. But I could imagine that someone who isnt that familiar to saturn could experience this connection differently. IP: Logged |
ErickaF
unregistered
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posted July 16, 2007 09:08 PM
Okay well I experienced this venus-opposed saturn in composite, I had venus squared his saturn. It was a frustrating relationship. I eventually fell out of love. I don't know if both parties feel this aspect in synastry. But I am sure in the long run both would feel it, I guess. Good thing about Saturn it keeps people together though thick and thin...but sometimes couples are togther too long and thats bad. I was lucky I got out when I could. I know this couple who were together ten years and they had venus-opposed saturn in composite, Moon opposed Saturn in composite too and venus-saturn squared in synastry. and I heard that uranus squared saturn is as bad...they had that too. Why are the most difficult relationships the hardest to get over even if there were more bad times than good lol.
In my old relationship I felt I had to be with him...some kind of karmic feeling...like I have known him forever yet it was very painful to stay...for both of us.
We have some SN conjunctions too, SN to his Sun. So we are for sure soul mates but just not meant to be ;-(
Hope this asnwers your question.
To me there is nothing positive about venus sqaured saturn...this is a difficult aspect but that doesn't mean a relationship is doomed! Other aspects must be taken in to consideration.IP: Logged |
alanabelle86
Knowflake Posts: 40
From: Somewhere over the rainbow
Registered: May 2009
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posted July 16, 2007 09:35 PM
Venus square Saturn = a love that will force you to grow indefinitely...IP: Logged |
jane
Knowflake Posts: 1277
From:
Registered: Jul 2009
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posted July 18, 2007 03:55 PM
Amen to what alanabelle said. My bf and I don't have any venus-saturn aspects in synastry, but in our composite we have an exact Venus square Saturn. I've read that with squares, each planet plays its own role. So Venus and Saturn don't harmoniously merge. Our relationship was so Venusian, it was impossible for me to envision it weighted down with Saturnine responsibility, seriousness, and limitations. But now we both have a much healthier view of love as incorporating both Venus and Saturn. It certainly was not easy getting to this point though (or cheap--it took some counseling ). I do think there is a positive to hard Venus Saturn aspects in synastry and composites. It makes you consciously aware of what your Venus and Saturn needs are in the relationship. If both of those needs can't be met, then the relationship will probably end, but if both can be met, you'll both have a deep, honest understanding of what your needs are in a loving, committed relationship. IP: Logged |
alanabelle86
Knowflake Posts: 40
From: Somewhere over the rainbow
Registered: May 2009
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posted July 19, 2007 05:00 PM
There's a positive and negative to everything. There are always two sides to story, two faces to a coin. Venus-Saturn matures you in a relationship. Saturn isn't the bad guy out to ruin what could be a good thing.
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ErickaF
unregistered
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posted July 20, 2007 12:27 AM
Yeah Saturn is mean! Squares are good in relationship...but not too much ;-( IP: Logged |
cristiname
Knowflake Posts: 66
From: Earth. Welcome!
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted July 20, 2007 11:59 AM
I sure wish ppl would be more careful to specify it's a matter of natal OR sinastryIP: Logged | |
Lindaland
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