posted May 09, 2008 11:30 AM              

while posting in another forum here, I got fascinated with IQ`s rules again.
For those who don`t remember, he said that your TWinsoul would have very close double whammies with your ASC.

I would even like to include include the IC here - actually I think both axis`s are important.

I scanned some celebrity couples (the major planets, Karma, Valentine, Amor, Juno, Eros and Psyche):

Antonio Banderas - Melanie Griffith:
His Mercury conjunct her IC -
Her Mercury squares his IC

Mercury is the ruler of his 7th and her 5th house, and therefore relevant in this particular case.

Brad Pitt - Angelina Jolie:

His mean Lilith trine her ASC
Her mean Lilith square his ASC

His Vertex conjunct her ASC
Her Vertex conjunct his ASC
- whatever will happen between them, they surely changed each others life!

Johnny Depp - Vanessa Paradis:
no dw with ASC or IC as far as I can see it
at least not with a 2° orb.

Paul McCartney - Linda Eastman:

His NN sextile her ASC
her NN conjunct his ASC (3°)

His Mercury conjunct her MC
Her Mercury trine his MC
- Mercury rules his 1st, 10th and 12th house, and it also rules her 8th house (8th and 12th house are highly karmic)

Paul Newman - Joanne Woodward

his Venus conjunct her ASC (3)
her Venus sextile his ASC
- Venus rules his IC and her 5th and 10th house

(there are some more dw`s with ASC, but they are wider orbed)

Richard Burton - Liz Taylor

his Moon square her ASC
her Moon trine his ASC (3)

- Moon rules his 5th and her 8th house

Some other very random "collection":

Antonio Banderas - Madonna:
nothing

Jude Law - Kate Winslet:
nothing

Leonardo di Caprio - Kate Winslet:
nothing

Charles - Camilla:
nothing

Ewan McGregor - Jude Law (they are friends after all):
E`s Jupiter conjunct J`s ASC (3)
J`s Jupiter trine E`s ASC (3) - a bit wide I guess
- Jupiter rules Jude`s ASC and Ewan`s IC

Orlando Bloom - Madonna (I`m sure they never have met, or have they?)
as expected - nothing

That little comparision shows that these double whammies with ASC or IC are indeed rare, and appear quite often in relationships, that have at least high soulmate-potential.
Also, those double whammies seem to involve planets, that rule the important relationship houses (1st, 4th, 5th, 7th, 8th) or MC.

So if that sais anything at all - rulerships-, then I probably should look out for someone with whom I share doublewhammies of ASC / IC and Jupiter (1st house ruler), Aries (4th), Venus (5th), Mercury (7th) or Moon (8th).

And if that works also for equal (have to check the celebrity charts for that), then I would have to look for Jupiter (1st), Neptune (4th), Mars (5th), Mercury (7th) and Moon (8th).

posted May 09, 2008 11:43 AM              

Antonio - Melanie:

Mercury / IC:
Mercury rules his 4th and 7th house
and her 5th

Brad and Angelina:
No rulerships applicable, but

Brads Lilith falls on the end of her 4th house, conjunct her 5th house cusp
her Lilith falls in his 4th house
- no wonder they are so obsessed with having children, adopting them, raising them...

Also, their Vertex falls onto each other`s ASC, highlighting the relationship axis

Paul McCartney - Linda Eastman:

Mercury / MC:
Mercury rules
his ASC and MC
her 8th house

Paul Newman - Joanne Woodward:

Venus / ASC:
Venus rules
both 5th houses and MC`s

Richard Burton - LIz Taylor:

Moon / ASC:
Moon rules
his 5th house
her 8th house - can someone else feel the heat?

Ewan McGregor - Jude Law (had to check them, too, since they had one hit )

Jupiter / ASC:
Jupiter rules
Jude`s ASC and
Ewan`s IC

This seems to ACTUALLY work!
In Brad`s and Angelina`s case it even works better with equal than Placidus, cause according to Placidus Angelina`s Lilith would be in Brad`s 3rd house instead of his 4th.

DD

posted May 09, 2008 04:44 PM            

Quick question...

In order for it to be a DW to an angle, does it have to be the same angle? For example, Mercury trine MC of one/Mercury sextile AC of another could count or no?

posted May 09, 2008 04:53 PM              

it doesn`t matter which angle. But I only used conjunction, opposition, square, trine and sextile.

Mmh, maybe I should look in my "list", if someone meets those requirements.

posted May 09, 2008 05:11 PM              

My boyfriend and l have these aspects:

jupiter sextile AC
jupiter square AC

neptune square AC
neptune conjunct AC

lilith conjunct AC
Lilith opposing AC

Sun sextile IC
sun square IC

mercury sextile IC
mercury sextile IC

juno trine IC
juno opposes IC

karma trine IC
karma quincunx IC

all within 2 degrees

posted May 09, 2008 05:35 PM              

this IS a lot!

What houses are ruled by Jupiter, Neptune, Sun and Mercury?

EDIT:

I share a mutual Neptune-ASC-conjunction under 1° with a certain actor, and Neptune both rules our 4th houses (equal). Funny, isn`t it?

posted May 09, 2008 05:44 PM              

This is the same guy l have all those draco aspects with and the Valentine conjunct AC in Composite that VenusdeIndia said was AMAZING! lol

OK

his jupiter in 11th ruled by venus/libra.
my jupiter in 12th ruled by sun/Leo (my jupiter is conjunct my AC/Regulus)
his jupiter in my 3rd and mine in his 9th.
Sag is the ruler of my 5th house too!!

his neptune in 1st ruled by scorpio
my neptune in 4th ruled by scorpio
so his in my 4th and mine in his 1st

his sun in 9th ruled by Leo/sun!
my sun in 9th ruled by taurus/venus
his sun in my 12th and mine in his 6th

his mercury in 10th ruled by virgo
my mercury in 9th ruled by taurus
his mercury in my 1st and mine in his 6th

posted May 09, 2008 05:51 PM              

The jupiter aspects are 1 and 0 degrees
The neptunes are the same
The suns are the same
The mercurys are just under 2 degrees apart

so they are pretty darn close !!!

Is it good though?

posted May 09, 2008 06:00 PM              

my AC is in his 4th

posted May 09, 2008 06:12 PM              

What I meant was what HOUSES the planets rule.
For example:
Your Jupiter rules your 5th house, because Sagittarius is on the cusp of this house.

Well, it IS all interlinked. Just another hint that this guy is your soulmate.

posted May 09, 2008 06:21 PM              

so

jupiter rules his 2nd house
jupiter rules my 5th

neptune rules his 4th house
neptune rules my 8th although my 7th is 29'aqua so don't know if you count that

sun rules his 9th house
sun rules my 12th/AC

mercury rules his 10th and 8th
mercury rules my 2nd and 11th

posted May 09, 2008 06:41 PM              

In your case, it`s a Neptune aspect involving 4th and 8th house, so if I had a wild stab at guessing, I`d see this is a connection, that runs extremely deep and highlights themes of home, belonging, transformation, depth and maybe working on some psychological issues, and with Neptune involved, it gets really spiritual here. Of course Neptune could under certain circumstances also indicate that one or both persons are not always available or try to evade and slip away, because the emotional intensity might get too strong at times.
Dunno, it was only a wild guess.

Which housesystem did you use btw?

And I agree, I tend to get fired up about some threads, too, just like now, when I got fascinated by my own observations. And I really should be in bed now, for it`s past midnight and I have had a rough week.
But I can`t tear myself away...

posted May 09, 2008 06:53 PM              

That is absolutely spot on DD !
We see saw taking it in turns at backing off from the intensity... it really gets so intense sometimes. It is very spiritual and he is so into all of this stuff. We have had to work out lots of past emotional wreckage though... the synastry has made us look at it. I am dealing with my issue of trust at the moment !

I used Placidus which is weird cos l am an equal girl myself

In equal, the only differences are:

neptune rules his 5th house

sun rules his 10th house
sun rules my 1st

mercury rules his 11th and 8th

It makes sense because neptune is natural ruler of 12th isn't it, and his sun/mars are in my 12th conjunct my valentine and Jupiter.

In fact in our synastry my moon/venus/saturn/NN (in his 5th) trines his sun/mars (in my 12th) and his moon (in my 4th) to make a grand trine in fire.

posted May 09, 2008 07:03 PM              

And in your charts applying equal houses emphasize the relationship houses even more.

The Neptune / ASC: 5th and 8th
Sun / IC: 10th and 1st

BTW I like the combination of 5th and 8th, it spells so much deeply felt intensity and passion, emotional as well as sexual.

You have a Sun-Valentine- AND Mars-Valentine-conjunction?
No wonder you love him so deeply.

Also, that GT in all these emotional houses - wow!
I think the overlay in houses IS definitely important; it shows the areas in which the particular energies can be expressed.

So, if we find a dw like Neptune / ASC for example, it probably is very important to see where the Neptune of each person falls into the chart of the other.
Where is it for you?

DD

posted May 09, 2008 07:20 PM              

You know the intensity and all that eros/venus stuff with his eros in my 5th and my eros conjunct exact my venus means we just can't do anything other than be together. We live over 3,000 miles apart and we have discussed breaking up due to distance but we can't! Thank goodness

Do you remember you once said to me "IQ would love that aspect"... l will have to find the thread cos l can't remember the aspect.

my neptune conjuncts his AC 1deg in his1st
his neptune square my AC 1 deg in my 4th
(our neptunes are conjunct)

That GT is scary actually as there are so many emotional planets and houses involved.

His NN is in my 7th and my NN is in his 5th

His armor in my 5th and my armor in his 8th.
BOTH our cupids are in each others 8th houses lol

posted May 09, 2008 07:50 PM            

as for twin souls, Evolutionary Astrology Jeffrey Wolf Green believes that people meeting their twin souls is very rare. He also says that it has to do with being time twins. I am not sure about that.

I would also think that twin souls would have charts with strong affinities....that they would have similar charts showing highly similar personalities. I don't think that aspects in synastry would indicate being twinsouls.

That's just my opinion.

posted May 10, 2008 05:00 AM              

Lara,

did you use equal now for the rulerships?

"You know the intensity and all that eros/venus stuff with his eros in my 5th and my eros conjunct exact my venus means we just can't do anything other than be together."
It`s amazing to see how strongly Eros can connect two people.
But it seems to work even in "only admiring from afar"- situations, like my affinity to this musical actor.

His Eros exactly squares my Venus; and his Eros falls in my 5th house, and my Eros falls in his 5th house (equal houses), and in Placidus his Eros falls onto the cusp of my 4th house, and my Eros falls still into his 5th house.

We also have a double whammy of Mercury / IC.
His Mercury conjuncts my IC, while my Mercury conjuncts his MC.
Mercury rules his 7th and 4th house, and it also rules my 7th house.
In equal his Mercury falls into my 5th house, my Mercury falls into his 10th house.
In Placidus it`s my 4th house and his 10th house - a strong emphasis on the parental axis, or even the private - public-axis. It seems SOO fitting.
Mercury as the connecting planet - his voice, performance, communication.
It hits me at my deepest core (IC), also triggering creativity inside of me (5th house equal), while for him the MC, his career, the area where he is a "public persona" is highlighted. Can it get more telling?

"o you remember you once said to me "IQ would love that aspect"... l will have to find the thread cos l can't remember the aspect."
I remember. But I don`t know which aspect it is either, probably one with Valentine.

"my neptune conjuncts his AC 1deg in his1st
his neptune square my AC 1 deg in my 4th
(our neptunes are conjunct)"
Usually I don`t pay much attention to generational planets in aspect, because everyone in your generationw ould have them. BUT in your case they rule personal houses and therefor they get highly important.
For example: Let`s say Neptune ruled your 11t house and his 9th house; in this case I wouldn`t think it very important for a personal relationship.

In your case Neptune doesn`t only rule personal houses, but it also fall into relationship houses, 1st and 4th, therefor highlighting the importance even more.
The 1st and 4th house would be the areas of your life, where the Neptune-ASC-connection is being expressed. It does probably not only influence your deepest personality, but also your physical being, appearance, the way you see and approach the world (1st house) and your family, home and the urge to "nest" (4th house).

"His armor in my 5th and my armor in his 8th.
BOTH our cupids are in each others 8th houses lol"
Looks intense to me.

You inspired me to look at the houses overlays with musicman some more, and I found out something rather astounding.
Using equal houses:

His Moon in my 6th.
My Moon in his 12th.

His Venus in my 5th.
My Venus conjunct his 11th house cusp.

HIs NN in my 9th.
My NN in his 9th.

his IC in my 1st.
my IC in his 1st.

his Ceres conjunct my DC.
my Ceres conjunct his AC.

his Eros in my 5th house.
my Eros in his 5th house.

And applying Placidus there are even:

His Sun in my 4th.
My Sun in his 10th.

His Mercury in my 4th
My Mercury in his 10th.

I noticed, that there are the same or polar houses activated, for me personal houses, for him social houses, which makes sense, since I am part of his audience and therefor a private person, whereas he is performing and being a public person in these situations.

EDIT:

After I saw that your Neptune not only ruled personal houses for both of you, but also fell into relationship-houses, I checked the celebrity couples for this, and in every single case the connecting planet (who was ruler of a relationship house) fell into a personal relationship house for at least one of the persons.

So, I guess we can narrow this down even more.
Double whammies with ASC should be:
1. with planets which rule the 1st, 4th, 5th, 7th, 8th or 10th house

2. within a reasonable orb (2° - 3° max.)

3. the connecting planet should fall into the 1st, 4th, 5th, 7th, 8th or 10th house of the other person (at least one way).

this seems to work for Equal as well as Placidus - *sighs* Is till feel so torn between those two. Which one is the better system?

posted May 10, 2008 05:07 AM              

Yes, I read that in Blashke`s book, too, and he even uses antiscia frequently.
Personally I have found antiscia - connections to be significant.

Regarding Twinsouls-
I don`t know if oyu can see a TWinsoul in the astrological chart. I`m really not sure about that.
But I think what you can see is a karmic relationships and the potential to be soulmates.
And really, meeting your soulmate can be a real blessing, and don`t happens all that often either.
I also think that you should look for the natal charts first to see if there is Twin-Soul-potential.
I think there should be many similiarities, but also complimentary aspects: like for example: Person A has Sun in Scorpio, Person B has Moon in Scorpio.
or
A has Venus conjunct Jupiter, B has Mars square Jupiter or Mars in Sagittarius or 9th house.

BTW what does Green mean with "time twins"?

DD

posted May 10, 2008 05:33 AM              

DEFINITELY.

I think there has to be such a form of attraction, planted in the natal charts; the synastry shows in my opinion the occasion to express this basic attraction (via natal charts) and how it will be expressed, or could be expressed.

This form of "natal attraction" works even with people, who are NOT part of your ordinary life, like singers actors.

My favourite examples for this are musicman and Jude Law.

In both cases there are quite some similiarities and complimentary aspects in the natal charts, probably the deeper reason why I like them; they express something, that I can feel inside my own soul - therefore fascination grows.

Musicman:

his Sun in Aries
my Sun in firesign in 1st house

his Moon in 3rd house
my Moonin Airsign in 3rd house

his Mercury in Aries
my Mercury in firesign in 1st house

his Venus in Taurus in 2nd house
my Venus in Earth-sign conjunct 2nd house cusp (from 1st house)

his Venus squares Saturn
my Venus in Capricorn

his Venus trines Pluto
my Venus squares Pluto

his Mars in Pisces
my Mars conjunct Neptune (in 12th house)

his Mars in 1st house
my Mars conjunct 1st house cusp (ASC)

HIs Mercury rules his DC
my Mercury rules my DC

his Jupiter rules his AC
my Jupiter rules my AC

in the Draconic we have our draconic Sun in each other`s natal Sun-sign
Actually my Draconic personal planets and points (Sun, Mercury, Mars, AC) all fall into his natal Sun, Mercury, Mars and ASC-signs

I once jokingly said to a friend that we coiuld have been born into the same family, maybe even as twins, with all these similiarities between oiur charts.

With Jude Law it is a bit different, since there is a mix of similiar and complimentary aspects:

His Sun in 1st house
my Sun in 1st house

His Moon in Airsign in 11th house conjunct Uranus
my Moon in Aquarius in 3rd house

HIs Mercury in SAgittarius
my Mercury in Sagittarius

His Mercury in 1st house
my Mercury in 1st house

His Venus in Sagittarius-
my Mars in Sagittarius square Jupiter
(complimentary - and yes they are widely conjunct and closely parallel)

His Venus conjunct AC-
my Mars conjunct AC
complimentary

His Venus opposite Saturn-
my Venus in Capricorn

His Venus conjunct NEptune
my Mars conjunct Neptune
complimentary

His Mars in Scorpio-
my Venus square Pluto
complimentary (and synastrically we have a dw on Venus-Pluto-aspects)

His Mars in 12th house-
my Mars in 12th house conjunct Neptune

His ASC in Sagittarius-
my ASC in Sagittarius

ruler of his 7th house in Sag in 1st house
ruler of my 7th house in Sag in 1st house-
they are even conjunct

ruler of his 4th house conjunct AC-
ruler of my 4th house ocnjunct AC

ruler of his 5th house in 12th house
ruler of his 5th house in 12th house

also interesint:
his Sun in Capricorn, his Venus in Sagittarius
my Sun in Sagittarius, my Venus in Capricorn

I still don`t understand why I like him (I don`t want to like him), but astrologically there seems to be some familiarity and complimentary aspects there.

This works in all relationships.
For example:
My best friend and me have each a Venus-Pluto-aspect (she: conjunction, me: square) and of course my Pluto is also conjunct her Venus. We are obsessed with talking about relationships, ours, other`s, our relationship to other people, and it has even similiarity with a therapy sometimes. ONe of our biggest confusion is that we both can`t understand how superficial some people can be.
We have other areas of difference, but in this respect we are on the very same plate.

My parents` charts also have these natal attraction to each other:

Dad`s Moon in Taurus, Mum`s Sun in SCorpio and of course opposing each other`s.

Both having an Earth-Moon.

Both Sun`s and MErcury`s in 5th house - the reason and purpose for their relationship was having children and build a family together - as my mum has repeatedly emphasized.

His ASC in Virgo, her IC in Virgo.

And so much more - it works. Try it out.

PLease, try it out and tell me, if it works for you, too?

posted May 10, 2008 06:29 AM              

not sure if l totally understand how it works but l gave it a go!

his sun in leo
my sun in aries

his moon in Sag/1st
my moon in Aries/8th

his mercury in virgo/10th
my mercury in taurus/9th

his venus in libra/11th (aquarius,ruler of my ASC)
my venus in aries/8th (scorpio,ruler of his ASC)

his venus conjunct pluto
my venus quincunx pluto

his mars in leo/9th
my mars in taurus/9th

his jupiter in libra/12th
my jupiter in leo/12th

his ASC in scorpio
my ASC in leo
his pluto conjunct my DC ruler
my ASC conjunct his sun

his IC conjunct my AC in scorpio (his AC sign)
his MC conjunct my AC in Leo (his sun sign)
his DC conjunct my MC in taurus (my sun sign)
my DC conjunct his IC in aquarius
his venus conjunct his uranus (ruler of my 7th)

ruler of his 4th is ruler of my 7th (aquarius)
ruler of my 4th is ruler of his 1st (scorpio)

ruler of his 5th is in 1st house conjunct ASC (neptune)
ruler of my 5th is in 12th house conjunct ASC (jupiter)

ruler of his 7th in 11th house (venus)
ruler of my 7th in 1st house (uranus)
his venus conjunct his uranus (ruler of my 7th)

his DC in taurus (my sun)
my AC in leo (his sun)

posted May 10, 2008 07:05 AM              

I will list your connections that I feel, fall into the similiarity / complimentary-category.

his sun in leo
my sun in aries
- two fire-suns

his moon in Sag/1st
my moon in Aries/8th
- his Moon in 1st and your Moon in Aries
You have Sun and Moon in ARies? Whoa!

his mercury in virgo/10th
my mercury in taurus/9th
- both Mercury`s in earthsigns

his venus in libra/11th (aquarius,ruler of my ASC)
my venus in aries/8th (scorpio,ruler of his ASC)
- Venus in Libra, Venus in Aries: complimentary

his venus conjunct pluto
my venus quincunx pluto
- same aspect obviously

his mars in leo/9th
my mars in taurus/9th
- bo th Mars in 9th house

his jupiter in libra/12th
my jupiter in leo/12th
- both jupiter in 12th house

uler of his 4th is ruler of my 7th (aquarius)
ruler of my 4th is ruler of his 1st (scorpio)
- DEFINITELY a very important hit

uler of his 5th is in 1st house conjunct ASC (neptune)
ruler of my 5th is in 12th house conjunct ASC (jupiter)
- similiarity again

his DC in taurus (my sun)
my AC in leo (his sun)
- DC and Sun in same sign
- ASC and Sun in same sign

You really have some very interesting natal similiarities and interconnections.
And on top of that your awesome synastry. Wow!

posted May 10, 2008 12:27 PM              

I thank you both X

It's exciting and quite emotional when you see the thread visibly in a chart, don't you think? This is such a perfect interraction for me as l am so intuitively sensitive and emotional anyway. Makes total sense that Neptune is a key player

I made a mistake on my sun sign. I'm taurus but i'm so arian that it was one of those freudian slip mistakes

The 4th house rulers are like WOW! lol

posted May 10, 2008 02:29 PM              

SO according to you,also the IC/MC axis should be included into IQ´S List?And the max orn can be wider than 2ºorb,making for 3ºorb..

in the sinastry the only DW i find with Jonhhy is:

Placidus

Kiron trine ASC
Kiron sextile ASC

Equal

His Ceres sextile my ASC
MY Ceres sextile his MC

My Ceres falls into his 7th and his into my 3rd

His Eros sextile my ASC
MY Eros skuare his MC

my Eros falls into his 12th (conj his NN),and his falls into my 3rd again

Relating to Planets..no DW,only random aspects like:

-Venus conj ASC
-Juno conj IC
- Jup/VX Trine ASC
- Sun conj ASC (wider orb)

I went to look at the DRACOS then:

( do you look to them as IQ´S a1st rule also)?

His NN hits my Draco ASC(0)
My NN trines his Draco ASC(2)

My Draco ASC hits his SDraco IC(3º)

His Sun hits my IC(3)
My Sun trine his Draco MC(1)

His karma hits my Draco DSC(0)
My karma trines his MC(0)

My Lilith trine his Draco DSC(3)
His Lilith conj my Draco DSC(3)

My Ceres trine his Draco DSC(2)
His Ceres sextile my IC(2)

My Pscyhe sextile his Draco DSC(1)
HIs Draco Psyche conj my draco ASC(4)

My Juno trines his Draco MC(1)
His Draco Juno trines my Moon (2)-my draco asc ruler

My VERTEX skuare his Draco MC(4)
His VERTEX trine my ASC(1)

posted May 10, 2008 02:52 PM              

my venus conjunct his IC (0')
his venus conjunct my IC (1')

That will do! YUMMY