posted December 12, 2014 02:36 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by DaniPepper87:
I'd say more that feeling of coming and going that some couples have, more because the cards... some are good, other seems more a leaving situation.. and Lily-Coffin for sure is depression because of sexual part of them!! He liked a lot but don't have it anymore....

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hahaha like he misses that part? great interpretation!

what do you mean by feelings coming and going? or is it a mixture of feelings?

posted December 12, 2014 02:39 PM            

how do I see Fox/Lily though?

posted December 12, 2014 02:42 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by LeeLoo2014:

what do you mean by feelings coming and going? or is it a mixture of feelings?

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posted December 12, 2014 02:45 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by LeeLoo2014:
wait I think I know...Fox Lily is the loss of trust and so is Lily Coffin...he lost her trust.
I still need more ideas

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fox-lily = lost of the feelings, trust and even that familiar feeling, as this guy will turn to an enemy! (from where I took this one?? )

Lily-Coffin = transformation of this feeling, as this combo is followed after the fox... the last sentence makes sense (turning into an enemy!! lol)...

posted December 12, 2014 02:55 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by DaniPepper87:
Not a mixture... more about "Ah I love her", passing 4 minutes he says "Nah, I don't love her anymore"... Passing another day he says "I love her"... As if the Moon of this guy is in Gemini!! I don't want to anger Moon in Gemini people, but my father is this way... changes a lot of mood!!! More like this!!!

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it makes sense

you say he turns into an enemy?

posted December 12, 2014 03:08 PM            

I will break down the cards later.

posted December 12, 2014 04:47 PM            

Breaking down the spread I see he has strong feeling for her ans as Dani described, it's a rollercoaster, from anger guilt feeling cunning and plotting maybe lol plus desire, decision to move on, decision to separate, decision to reconcile lol love hope desire memories (Stars Lily can point to that) regret of losing the sex deep depression, hatred.

The spread opens with Bear Bouquet clarifies with Bear, so there are strong feelings as I was saying.

Whip: strong physical desire, anger, guilt
Fox: lies cunning plotting thinking the lady is sexy
Roads: decision separation new beginning
Stars: hope, a fated love, memories (with Lily)
Lily: affection sex longing, trust faith Coffin: the end of matter lol

Whip Fox: he feels guilty for his lies, that is for sure, with this combo. he also may desire her a lot, very physically, with this combo

He acknowledges his lies led to the separation: Whip Fox Roads

Roads Heart followed by Stars shows the decision, the new course will be taken with the Heart, following the Heart's wish and there is hope or desire for her in his Heart. Stars Lily points to new hope too, also good memories, nostalgia (probably about the sex lol) and Lily/Coffin: end of sex, end of happiness: depression and missing the sex too.

Some say this combo also means peace ends, rest ends - so it may point to a desire for action, end of lassitude, nostalgia, contemplation.

And...we see something abrupt here, with Whip Coffin, like snapping from it. It also indicates the possibility of self-destructive behavior, violence, but also: end of arguments. Interesting.

This is pretty much what he's feeling for her right now, I'd say.

posted December 13, 2014 07:18 AM            

The problem was also the fact that the Yes/No question was "does he love me?" which I believe it's a difficult question to ask with cards, because when it comes to feelings, cards are very much in the moment, they usually reflect what the other person feels at that particular moment. They can hardly capture the whole feeling of love in time and space. So, I don't like when someone expects this question to be answered with yes/no cards; I prefer to describe the feelings someone has at a particular moment, for a person, feelings shown by the cards. But the yes/no question when it comes to "does he/she love me?"...not a good idea.

What do you all think about this?

posted December 13, 2014 09:08 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by vesta:
My thought on that is if someone loves you It is inside of them it would not be affected by feelings of the moment for outcome of cards. Just because someone is upset with you will not change wether they love you or not.
Real love can overcome all situations. So if you asked does he / she love me the answer would be what the person truly feels inside not what emotions are reflecting at the moment.

IMO.

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I agree with you, however there's a glitch here. leno cards seem to pick on what is in the PRESENT, my little practice shows so far. They pick on emotions a lot, when you ask about feelings.

The other problem is that when you do a reading for a love quarrel, they always show the quarrel, the state of affairs, the present situation. Quarrels are part of love, so you see some radical cards in the answer such as Scythe Whip Coffin Mice Bear Snake which actually reflect the intensity of the chagrin, and not the lack of love.

So this is where the problem is, how to make the distinction here.

What cards should we get there when there's no love?

Also, my question to you all: how do you approach the question: does he/she love me, how does he feel? .

Do you first do a yes/no spread, then one for describing the feelings? Or what else?

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posted December 13, 2014 09:26 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by vesta:
My thought on that is if someone loves you It is inside of them it would not be affected by feelings of the moment for outcome of cards. Just because someone is upset with you will not change wether they love you or not.
Real love can overcome all situations. So if you asked does he / she love me the answer would be what the person truly feels inside not what emotions are reflecting at the moment.

IMO.

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Now I'm thinking, Vesta, that a good way to get to the bottom of this (when you're facing a love quarrel) is to ask: "what are the true feelings X has for Y (despite or beyond the quarrel)?" What do you think?

posted December 13, 2014 09:48 AM            

I made the same observation as you concering Leno-cards and emotional qestions.
I usually ask: "What are his feelings for xy?" and am quite aware that the leno cards emphasise the "this moment, today, now", something that could change.

If I want to inquire about more lasting feelings I phrase the question like that, as you did, too. But I donīt think either lenny or tarot are really equipped to answer "this, forever, unchanging" questions. Partly this is due to the fact that feelings are not unchanging but in a flow, always.
Of course within that flow there might be a lasting bond, let`s hope so.

As for the end of love feelings in lenormand I usually see a love card (heart, sometimes even ring, bouquet, lily etc.) followed by coffin, tower, sometimes scythe (the mountain seems more to be delay and block than really cutting it, but sometimes the mountain proves so high, that you will lose interest in getting over it.)

posted December 13, 2014 10:21 AM            

??

Followed by: what does he want from me?
Clouds-man-anchor-sun-woman

posted December 13, 2014 12:05 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Ceridwen:
Leeloo,

I made the same observation as you concering Leno-cards and emotional qestions.
I usually ask: "What are his feelings for xy?" and am quite aware that the leno cards emphasise the "this moment, today, now", something that could change.

If I want to inquire about more lasting feelings I phrase the question like that, as you did, too. But I donīt think either lenny or tarot are really equipped to answer "this, forever, unchanging" questions. Partly this is due to the fact that feelings are not unchanging but in a flow, always.
Of course within that flow there might be a lasting bond, let`s hope so.

As for the end of love feelings in lenormand I usually see a love card (heart, sometimes even ring, bouquet, lily etc.) followed by coffin, tower, sometimes scythe (the mountain seems more to be delay and block than really cutting it, but sometimes the mountain proves so high, that you will lose interest in getting over it.)

I am pretty sure I forgot some, but really coffin or tower or mice directly following the heart?
Not wanting to see it in MY spreads.

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Ceri, thank you for your insight, such a great one. The Heart popping up in the spread followed by an "ending" card or surrounded by two perhaps (depending on the spread) or more than one separation cards near the Heart (especially in connection with lack of emotions) should really indicate the end of love Without the Heart, I'm also thinking a series of "cold" cards: Tower Scythe Roads etc. probably when love wasn't there in the first place.

Apparently Mice is not a cold card, Heart Mice or Mice Heart seems to be a common symbol for "love pains" "heartache" from what I've read and did come up in my spreads, a lot lol obviously most girls I know request spreads when they fight with their partners after that, they just get back together, move on and forget about me lol just kidding!

Tgem, who's that? Your husband or Cusp?

EDIT: and I agree with you, Ring, maybe Bouquet can replace Heart here (although Bouquet Coffin might mean end of hppiness, good times, losing a precious relationship). It is interesting that some cards imply the quesited has strong feelings (Bouquet is one of them), while others imply coldness indifference lack of feelings. Perhaps these are the ones we should associate with "lack of love". I'll try and think of a list.
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posted December 13, 2014 12:17 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by tgem:
Ok here's one: what are his real feelings for me despite the quarrels?
Rider-anchor-clover

??

Followed by: what does he want from me?
Clouds-man-anchor-sun-woman

Soooo...I'm not seeing any negative cards here despite the horrible way he's treated me....

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Man, what a spread!

He will soon know what he wants and pehaps a woman or you will help him.

Do you know that Clouds also means the ex - so Clouds woman must be you.

He wants something deffinitive, one way or the other. To get away completely or get back forever lol

But Anchor Clover suggests he wants "another chance"

posted December 13, 2014 12:40 PM            

As for wanting another chance, I donīt think it is a chance at love, as love cards are missing, maybe he wants you two to find a common basis (anchor) to deal with each other successfully (Sun), possibly in favour for your son.

Clover is a lucky thing, naturally; however clover is also a fleeting luck, shorttime, sometimes a little shallow, so I am not sure how committed he really would be to that "making it work" (Sun-Anchor) scenario.

posted December 13, 2014 12:44 PM            

"ithout the Heart, I'm also thinking a series of "cold" cards: Tower Scythe Roads etc. probably when love wasn't there in the first place."
Yes. I think that would be the difference. With only the cold cards, there would be simple disinterest and indifference. If the heart is in the mix, there will be emotions at play.

"Apparently Mice is not a cold card, Heart Mice or Mice Heart seems to be a common symbol for "love pains" "heartache"
I notice the same, too. it is more lovesickness, heartache and so on than coldness.
However if it all accumulates these stings of heartache can erode the love that had been there in the beginning. But it is a slow erosive process, not an immediate cut.

Also I find that mice often symbolize worry/ anxiety for me, especially in daily spreads.

posted December 13, 2014 06:01 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Ceridwen:

Also I find that mice often symbolize worry/ anxiety for me, especially in daily spreads.

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I also liked a very simple description of Mice: "problems" (usually day to day, common problems). Where Mice is, that's where you find the current problem(s).