Author
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Topic: Homosexuality & the Bible?
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Yang unregistered
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posted May 18, 2005 04:06 PM
Hi guysThere has recently been a lot of debate in my country between homosexuality & the courts decision on it. I would like to know what the Bible really says about homosexuality. I know it says God is against it but people otherwise say that it is misinterpreted in the Bible. Please direct me to everything that says something about homosexuality in the Bible as I don't know where to find it. Thanks
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Kat unregistered
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posted May 18, 2005 06:35 PM
I believe it is the story of Sodom and Gamora. It is the story in which the city was corrupt and a few were sifted out and told to leave and not look back or be turned into a pillar of salt.The interpretations of this story have been many. Some say it wasn't about homosexuality per say but leading a path of unskilled ways. If we give up our ways that do not lead to God and don't look back our path is then potentially enlightened. If we look back then we become rigid and unable to move. There are other places in the bible, perhaps "I am that" can help if he's still around. Personally, I think trying to justify homosexuality based upon the bible is absurd! I know many many many gay individuals who are recognizable as being gay either physically by their body build, their voice over a phone, their personality, countless ways that is reflective of the opposite sex. Clearly sexuality is generally NOT a choice.I think the reason that fundamentalist fear homosexuals is the simple fact that if gays are proven to be born that way, they then need to rethink their entire belief system. That belief system is to me their Sodom and Gamora story of unskilled perceptions and they have made themselves rigid by holding onto those dated beliefs and refusing to see that God has everyone - gay and all in his plan!!! Question the bible my friend, ask yourself does this belief hold the highest intention for loving myself and others or is it pointing the finger in blame creating fear and guilt. If it is doing the later, it is coming from the ego not God. There is power to the written word and even more if you SAY that GOD said it. IP: Logged |
iAmThat unregistered
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posted May 18, 2005 08:05 PM
Dear Yang, There was a thread in the past about this topic: http://www.linda-goodman.com/ubb/Forum2/HTML/001174.html Well my comments therein was then. Heres my current thoughts. The scripture were written by priests inspired by their own experiences. So we cannot take it literally. We must however not ignore it but refer to it and reach our own truth. That is how we all humans really evolve.
My political stand on this is that I am ok with what ever the government decides. I am for domestic partner rights as I believe I live in a world where people of same sex do live together. If I consider my judicial system to be fair then I cannot ignore these peoples needs. It will be injustice to do so. My spiritual stand on this is as follows: First I would describe desire and lust that is related to sex. Desire is the fantasy about the person. Lust is desire in action. Sex whether gay or straight should be the last resort in any relationship. I think, Romance without sex is so cute. What makes it cute is the anticipation, the hope, the longing, the mood, the desire, the feeling of time going so slow in that moment, etc.. There are singles and married who attain enlightenment. I have seen some married men, who are more enlightened than a himalayan yogi. The point is sex is not a determining factor to achieve enlightenment. We do see nymphs in both gay and str8 world. Shouldn't we be moderate and control our energy. Everytime we ejaculate theres certain chemicals that leaves our body. I think its zinc in case of semen. I think moderation is the key.
Like I said in one of the forum thread theres a woman in every man and a man in every woman. Imagine Leonardo Da Vinci. Why would he paint Mona Lisa with his facial features. I am sure he struggled with that thought as well. A good painter would know that creativity is feminine quality. I can read Michaelangelos thoughts as he was painting the sixteenth chapel. Biologically, it may be against the norm, to go the wrong way. But guess what it has been shown that the nerves around the anus's surrounding is connected to the brain, implying maximum pleasure.
Now on a sombre note. There are chakras within human body as per the hindus. Starting with the mooldhara , etc... Now if we want to establish a channel within our body we must remove all the blockages within each chakra. If we have repressed thoughts, loneliness etc. It interferes with the chakra energy.
Imagine theres a building and we need to raise water from the lower storeys to the upper storeys. If theres a leakage in the lower storeys, then we need more energy to raise the water higher. In same manner, by subconsciously not lusting we can raise our body energy. Theres a useful remedy for people desiring to ascend spirituality but they have lustful thoughts arousing their passion and body heat. Such person must take a cold shower whenever that happens. It works most of the time ![](http://www.linda-goodman.com/ubb/smile.gif) I am against cheating on lovers or wife. Life is too short. I am also against allowing multiple persons to enter our body. Buddha said (I am paraphrasing) We must not desire for fun nor ask for pain. They both bring us grief I echo with his great wisdom. (I didn't have time to edit this post. Please point out any errors) Regards
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fayte.m unregistered
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posted May 18, 2005 08:40 PM
Yang.....I must ask..are you looking for information for or against? I can find you some that seem to be for such relationships. The taboo against was based more on the need for the population to increase than actual morality. Children often didn't survive childhood, so it was necessary to have many children. Also the Greek Culture did not have a problem with it, as long as men took wives later and had children. Let me know which you are wanting, for or against. For I will find and post, but against, I do not believe in. I am not gay, but most of my friends are. I am a woman, but my situation is a little different from most. When I get your reply I might explain further where I am coming from. By the way, do you believe in past lives? ![](http://www.linda-goodman.com/ubb/starsmile.gif)
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thirteen Newflake Posts: 0 From: alberta Registered: Oct 2012
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posted May 19, 2005 12:49 PM
When i used to read the magazine "Spirit Speaks" ( channelled information) it explained simply that it is nothing more than a different "energy". Some people choose to be born with this energy as opposed to strictly female energy or stricktly male energy. Nothing more. I tend to agree. Only in the human world do we judge and find fault with everything that seems different. My concern for homosexuals is that they are so hard on themselves. That is where the trouble is. Maybe it can't be helped or maybe it is supposed to be that way for now as everything is meant to be. IP: Logged |
lalalinda Moderator Posts: 3000 From: nevada Registered: Apr 2009
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posted May 19, 2005 02:19 PM
remember, that the bible is only a human interpretation of Gods will. ![](http://www.linda-goodman.com/ubb/heart.gif) IP: Logged |
Yang unregistered
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posted May 19, 2005 04:56 PM
Thanks guys Some really interesting food for thought here.I am looking for both sides of the story (meaning for & against). I do believe in past lives. Why? IP: Logged |
fayte.m unregistered
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posted May 19, 2005 06:35 PM
Yang...I asked about the past lives because I know I have been male in most of them. And usually not straight. It has much bearing on who I am now, even though I am in a female body. Love is love, God was/is considered to be non sexual or androgenous. Many Native American Cultures call a gay person, two-spirited and this is a term of respect. Many Shamans of many cultures were such. In the KJV version of the Bible, read about the love between David and Jonathan(Saul's son), it is very passionate and to me appears to be also physically intimate in a lovers way. It is like the Songs of Solomon being refered to as Christ's love for the church. That is redactive error and wishful thinking on the part of the "church" so to speak. Anyone with any common sense can see it is a very passionate a lovely, albeit, even rather graphic in it's descriptions. That is why the church had to say it meant something else. They conveinantly forget that Solomon had many wives and consorts, and was most definitely a man who enjoyed the physical pleasures of love/sex. A man like that does not speak in only metaphor. Also the Secret Gospel of Mark, which the church has banned and which Prof.Morton Smith tried to find supporters for, but was lambasted for doing so, even though he was one of the top Biblical scholars of his day. He is still a very respected figure, except for his theories on The secret Gospel. Why? Mostly because he said that Jesus and others were either gay or bi-sexual. Because of the cultural mores of the time, it is hard to determine, but with Sepphoris being only 4 miles from Nazareth, and a highly Helenized city, with Greek culture accepted, especially concerning sexuality; it is not inconceivable, but people don't like that concept. I am just saying what I have read/studied...I am not saying what I believe, but I do keep an open mind since very little has been proven. The Mentors with their young erasmuses of ancient Greece, were not considered monsters of pervision. Many of the ancient sages were gay/homosexual. Yet people still honor their wisdom, even people against gay people. Hadrian had a young male lover, and had many beautiful monuments created to honor him. All I ask you to consider, is to be tolerant of others, do not judge or condemn those you do not agree with in this matter. Ok..I'm going on again..... ![](http://www.linda-goodman.com/ubb/rainbow.gif) IP: Logged |
Yang unregistered
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posted May 20, 2005 08:18 AM
Does it soundlike I am agianst gays? ![](http://www.linda-goodman.com/ubb/confused.gif) That is the last thing I want to be seen as( against gays). Sorry if I have offended gays out there.I don't mind if people are gay as it has nothing to do with me and it is their choice. IP: Logged |
fayte.m unregistered
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posted May 20, 2005 08:41 AM
Yang! You said;Quote: I don't mind if people are gay as it has nothing to do with me and it is their choice.I am glad you feel that way! I do however wish to ask though....then what/why are you searching for information and or validation concerning this issue, unless there is some aspect you are uncomfortable with or curious about? After all you were the one to start this thread. So I am only asking what was your motive for doing so? ![](http://www.linda-goodman.com/ubb/heart2.gif) PS. I myself am not gay, but I am bi/gay friendly. ![](http://www.linda-goodman.com/ubb/rainbow.gif) IP: Logged |
amisha121877 unregistered
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posted May 20, 2005 12:41 PM
I don't recall reading anything in the Bible about how/who/what/where to as far as expressing your sexuality. are you searching for validity or a blueprint pertaining to relations of this calibre? p.s. has anyone been noticing that many "extinct" practices are coming back to focus? IP: Logged |
fayte.m unregistered
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posted May 20, 2005 05:41 PM
amisha121877...I too am not entirely sure what all this is leading to either. I am glad I am not the only one! Yeah, the things coming back, I notice that too. IP: Logged |
wildflwrs unregistered
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posted May 20, 2005 08:17 PM
Well, there are a good many references to homosexuality in the Old Testament. A concordance would help you to look them up. There are not too many references in the New Testament....though mainstream Christianity preaches against homosexuality. The two main commandments that Jesus gave was to Love God with your whole heart, mind, and soul....and to love your neighbor as yourself. He taught do unto others as you would have them do unto you, love one another, and forgive. So, to me....his teachings override the prejudice against homosexuality. I know you aren't asking out of any prejudice and I think most people who have chosen alternative spirituality to organized religion are tolerant of other alternative lifestyle choices. At least it seems that way. I read the Bible but I am able to think for myself and I am not conformed to the doctrinal emphasis of mainstream Christianity. I have traveled along the alternative paths for decades. Anyway, I have a male cousin who has lived in Massachusetts, where gay marriage is legal. He and his partner of 26 years got legally married last summer. I just can not imagine them being condemned to hell by God for their choice to be together. My opinion is that God's love is unconditional. However, I know that homosexuality for some is a struggle...many are quite comfortable with it....but there are accounts where people came away from that lifestyle by faith in God....but it wasn't imposed on them. I sure hope you know what I mean. I myself respect a person's free will and freedom of choice when it comes to lifestyle choices. ![](http://www.linda-goodman.com/ubb/angel.gif) IP: Logged |
fayte.m unregistered
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posted May 20, 2005 08:49 PM
wildflwrs! Good reply! The concordance will only point out the bigotries and the mores and taboos of the society. One will not find the love between two same sex persons by referencing homosexuality etc. There are a few examples, but they don't teach those parts in Sunday school, or they choose that time, those stories to be taken as metaphor or in a symbolic way. Too much, this is literal, this is metaphor or symbolic, all based on who is reading it, telling it, at the time and cultural clime they live in or mores they themselves personally ascribe to. And so, some beautiful same sex relationships are hidden away within its pages. ![](http://www.linda-goodman.com/ubb/rainbow.gif)
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BlueRoamer Knowflake Posts: 109 From: Registered: Apr 2009
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posted May 21, 2005 05:21 PM
Most homosexuals are 2nd 3rd or 4th children. They are rarely 1st born. Many scientists now theorize that homosexuality is merely population control. Although religious doctrine and cultural bias are compelling, its hard for one to ignore the raw power of fact.The bible is filled with excellent teachings. But we can either trust the data we see in front of our face, our we can focus on one small passage of a text written and recopied who knows how many times so many years ago. Put in perspective, blindly following the bible in this case seems rather ludicrous, although for many, hatred is easier. IP: Logged |
iAmThat unregistered
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posted May 22, 2005 01:32 AM
I suppose they are their brother's former lover madly in love with him and not ready to let go ![](http://www.linda-goodman.com/ubb/wink.gif) But what if the first one is his sister? Any sibling relationships is very powerful I believe. IP: Logged |
Yang unregistered
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posted May 22, 2005 05:12 AM
Thanks guys ![](http://www.linda-goodman.com/ubb/thumbsup.gif) It just fascinates me that there are people out there who would rather be in a relationship with the same sex as opposed to the other sex. There are obviously reasons lying deep behind it all and one day the truth shall set it free. ![](http://www.linda-goodman.com/ubb/smile.gif)
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fayte.m unregistered
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posted May 22, 2005 09:55 AM
Yang! ![](http://www.linda-goodman.com/ubb/heart.gif) You said;Quote: There are obviously reasons lying deep behind it all and one day the truth shall set it free.Yes! I most definitely agree! And so, on that note I will (yes, AGAIN !) post some words that have helped me in times of doubt and conflict/confusion! ![](http://www.linda-goodman.com/ubb/starsmile.gif) TO ALL WITH LOVE! ![](http://www.linda-goodman.com/ubb/heart.gif) Jesus said, "let him who seeks continue seeking until he finds. When he finds, he will become troubled. When he becomes troubled, he will be astonished, and he will rule over the all." Jesus said, "Recognize what is in your sight, and that which is hidden from you will become plain to you. For there is nothing hidden which will not become manifest." From "The Gospel of Thomas" ![](http://www.linda-goodman.com/ubb/heart2.gif) IP: Logged |
Kat unregistered
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posted May 22, 2005 04:07 PM
Blue Roamer, A good friend of mine who is gay is the first born I know several other gay individuals who are gay first born."Iam that" reread your comments "going the WRONG way". Come on! I thought you were more enlightened than that!! IP: Logged |
fayte.m unregistered
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posted May 22, 2005 09:08 PM
BlueRoamer! That is strange! Most of the gay people I know are only children or firstborn.....Maybe being a firstborn, I just attract and associate mostly, and best with other firstborns or onlies. ![](http://www.linda-goodman.com/ubb/starsmile.gif) IP: Logged |
iAmThat unregistered
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posted May 22, 2005 10:26 PM
Kat, I am surprised I wrote that. I was only thinking loud, thats all. I guess to answer any problem, one must start by asking right questions. If you were thinking, I was judgemental, I wasn't (proof is the next statement). I seldom judge, but my objective is only to present to the reader my thought process, and how I tackle any problem/questions in my life. These are only my truth (please do not take that away from me, cause I haven't hurt anyone. Or atleast I thought so when I wrote.)
The fact is what seems obvious in the earth plane is indeed paradoxical when you take a really close look at it. So I would always refrain from making truths known in prose. And now that I am really thinking of it, picture 2 men doing it and there is ejaculation. Did you ever wonder how wasted the sperms are? From the time it is released it is programmed to search for ovum. Out of a million only one finds its way. In this case its zilch that the poor sperm on each ejaculation would find the ovum. Now, they tell us that, if we fill the kitchen sink with water and then wash the dishes, it saves 5 gallons of water as compared to using running water. I like that truth and would attempt to follow it. Similarly why will I with the same logic try not to conserve the wastage of sperm? If you want me to stretch it further. The sperms if they are not used enough would be recycled in the blood. If we continue to not use the reserve, it will have an effect on the harmonal level. The masculine voice would become softer, its not noticeable though. The person would have a belly....
I can go on and on....and I better stop. The answer to any question is not just true or false. I rather have each person live their own truth and experience and live it so that they do not miss on that experience lest it haunt them again. Sorry for being so gross on this thread ![](http://www.linda-goodman.com/ubb/smile.gif) Cheers.
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iAmThat unregistered
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posted May 22, 2005 10:35 PM
Yang, I think that you are refering to some real life statistics. It appears that if there are more than one children then the chance that the 2nd,3rd or 4th child is gay is high. IP: Logged |
fayte.m unregistered
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posted May 22, 2005 11:25 PM
Yang...Did you ever see the video/movie, "Angels In America" ? Or the movie "Torch Song Trilogy"? I recommend both. ![](http://www.linda-goodman.com/ubb/blueheart.gif) IP: Logged |
BlueRoamer Knowflake Posts: 109 From: Registered: Apr 2009
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posted May 23, 2005 03:43 PM
Of course some gays are first borns, but when you look at the statistics, most are not. Mere chance will cause some to know only gay first borns. But when you take a group of 500, most are not first borns. ![](http://www.linda-goodman.com/ubb/smile.gif) IP: Logged |
wildflwrs unregistered
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posted May 23, 2005 05:06 PM
My cousin who is gay was 2nd born and a friend of mine that is a lesbian was 3rd born.IP: Logged | |