posted December 23, 2004 11:01 PM            

***
Here is a link to just one of many in regards to these sins: http://www.whitestonejournal.com/seven/

Here are some excerpts to make you more familiar with them if you are not already:
Vice - Virtue against which it sins - Brief description
(1)Pride - Humility - Seeing ourselves as we are and not comparing ourselves to others is humility. Pride and vanity are competitive. If someone else's pride really bothers you, you have a lot of pride.
(2)Avarice/Greed - Generosity - This is about more than money. Generosity means letting others get the credit or praise. It is giving without having expectations of the other person. Greed wants to get its "fair share" or a bit more.
(3)Envy - Love - "Love is patient, love is kind…" Love actively seeks the good of others for their sake. Envy resents the good others receive or even might receive. Envy is almost indistinguishable from pride at times.
(4)Wrath/Anger - Kindness - Kindness means taking the tender approach, with patience and compassion. Anger is often our first reaction to the problems of others. Impatience with the faults of others is related to this.
(5)Lust - Self control - Self control and self mastery prevent pleasure from killing the soul by suffocation. Legitimate pleasures are controlled in the same way an athlete's muscles are: for maximum efficiency without damage. Lust is the self-destructive drive for pleasure out of proportion to its worth. Sex, power, or image can be used well, but they tend to go out of control.
(6)Gluttony - Faith and Temperance -Temperance accepts the natural limits of pleasures and preserves this natural balance. This does not pertain only to food, but to entertainment and other legitimate goods, and even the company of others.
(7)Sloth - Zeal - Zeal is the energetic response of the heart to God's commands. The other sins work together to deaden the spiritual senses so we first become slow to respond to God and then drift completely into the sleep of complacency.

Origins
The Seven Deadly Sins never occur as a formal list in the Bible. Some people say they can all be found in Matthew's Gospel (chapters 5 through 7), but they are not in a simple list there.
These sins were identified as a group around the same time as the Bible was being translated into a single language. Rather than these sins being identified in a single place in the Bible, they are found all through it, from Genesis to Revelation. The letters of the New Testament mention all of these, and many others as well. The Catechism has many Scriptural references in the section that lists the "Seven Deadly Sins." It is well to remember that the Scriptures come from the Jewish and Christian Churches, not the other way around. In both cases, faith preceded the writing.

***

Now, part of the reason for my interest in this topic is the fact that my hubby and I don't watch television. We find it to be a waste of time and money more than anything else. However, whenever we visit a friend's house the television is always on. It doesn't bother me, I mean, it's their home after all, but it seems to be the center of attention at all times for the people we're around at the time. In these few moments of watching TV, I have noticed that the programs and advertisements shown, aside from a number of children's programs, focus and or deal with these 7 deadly sins. Yet they deal with them not as though they were sins but rather as sources of entertainment or indeed even, sometimes, as virtues. Messages such as "make more money" and "be more beautiful" ... "anger, even vengeance, is ok/necessary" ... "have more power" and "have more things" ... etc.
Anybody care to spiral with me?

posted December 23, 2004 11:32 PM              

When we watch soaps. Because of our interconnectedness, we enjoy it. Its like we live our own fantasy thru the characters. Did you also ever wonder why there are people who get addicted to porn?

We live here on earth. We can either chose to spend the time wisely or unwisely. The reason I believe we are here on earth is to learn a lesson. Once we learn it we would return (don't know where?)

In the old times, the royal children were required to spend time in schools away from home. Thru television, I have learnt so many lessons, all at the comfort of my home. I being a visual guy, it helps me understand more better. I have learnt about fascinating subjects thru it. I actually, wish there were more programs added.

Theres negatives to television as well, sometimes. If we are not strong enough, we actually act/react based on what we saw in our favourite soap
Thats dangerous, because it may not be good for the atoms and molecules of our soul.

posted December 23, 2004 11:44 PM            

I don`t watch t.v. either so I can`t give any opinion. I was just recommended a movie and dont own a VCR or DVD so it`s a search for the good old stand by : a book

IAmThat, wow, interesting insight! I didn`t realize a soul had atoms & molecules. I look forward to the rest of your post!

Happy Holidays

posted December 24, 2004 02:13 AM              

I totally agree that television does contain many of the 7 deadly sins, though I'm not Christian and don't like to call it sin, I don't these things should be encouraged by the strongest influence many of us have in our lives. I mainly see lust, violence (anger), and gluttony all being glorified and yes it disturbs me as well.

For those of you who don't agree that TV can have very bad influences on our psyches, you probably shouldn't waste your time reading the rest of this, but for anyone who cares..this is my 2 cents.

Teens see violent video game commercials, which are becoming more and more extreme, and are exposed with no filter to all of the horrific violence shown all over the place..many times with the "bad guys" being macho icons. Ahhh..look at the cartoons even..whatever happened to the Care Bears?? I loved them! Teens are old enough not to be sheltered from reality, but must it be so Real on TV. For those of you believe in some Buddhist philosophy, wouldn't you say this waters their violence seed more and more each time.

I agree that the television uses sex appeal to lure you in as much as possible. Everywhere you look it DOES send you messages to be more beautiful, make more money, be the popular guy who gets the chicks or woman who gets the guys. Advertisers main strategy is sex appeal! They know exactly what they're doing, and most of us play right into their mind games. I know I'm making this sound serious...but to me it is. I'm so aware of it now, that it doesn't faze me so much to see makeup commercials or beer commercials with walking "prime ribs", but I see most people around me eating right out of the palms of their hands. Like my girlfriends saying "ohmigod shes sooo beautiful!!!!!!" Like they aren't just complimenting her, she might as well be Queen in their eyes...she is somehow superior to them. As far as its influence on our sexuality...where doesn't it influence our sexuality? Our standard of beauty is what TV and fashion deem our standard to be..look how its changed over the decades. Guys are taught to want women for their beauty and their bodies..You see for many guys I know, a woman's beauty is her identity, its the only asset that matters! This is what they are taught 24/7..so of course they feel pressure to posses a girl of beauty to show off to their friends as a symbol of power and popularity. Sex has become so casual, not only from TV, but its certainly not innocent. Can you deny how TV encourages you to Lust away any girl in high heels and a miniskirt?? Its hilarious and upsetting how much negative attention I get when I dress this way..and no I am not asking to be treated like a piece of meat when I dress up! I find the whole image advertisers give women as their standard of perfection to be unrealistic and ridiculous. Women today have wayyyyyy to much pressure to look beautiful for men..but is it the men who aim to brainwash us this way?? or Cover Girl and Maybelline? And guys was it your friends who chose to make women sex objects or was it Bud Light and Maxim? You don't need these fantasies people, they are unhealthy! They are taking your natural, repressed sexuality and packaging it to make millions off of us..making it competitive and entirely too visual. I'm getting tired of TV myself, I'm over the sex appeal game. Those aren't my fantasies because my sexual fantasies involve a little more love and a little less competition and heartless lust. I tend to get passionate when speaking on this issue, please nobody take it personally..we all have our own truths..this is here for anyone who would like to know mine

Monica

BTW~ I bet some of you are sitting there thinking man, this girl must really be insecure about the way she looks...well I'm am told I'm beautiful..if that counts for anything. I'll post my pic and let you judge for yourself. I'm not upset because I can't be a model, I'm upset because I dont want That to be my standard of a Beautiful Woman! I want beauty to be defined in broader terms...black, white, asian, latin, middle eastern bigger, smaller, taller, shorter...lets expand our minds and embrace Beauty in All shapes and sizes!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

posted December 24, 2004 09:41 AM            

***

juniperb
Thanks so much, we're quite excited about our little Elf on the way! I always enjoy reading your posts, btw.
I realize now that I only addressed television in my original post, but I meant everything around us. Radio, magazines, movies ... perhaps even theater. Or, even just the people you come across in your life where you might see these vices/sins being considered normal, ok, or acceptable. Just wanted to clear that up.

***

LeoSweetHeart
You make a lot of points I agree with. I know parents who after coming home from work, understandably exhausted, will proceed to plop their kids in front of the television while they pop a ready made meal in the microwave and then join the kids in front of the box for dinner. Those are their evenings. I'm no one to complain about how someone else lives their life but I find the idea of centering a family's time together around television disturbing.
It's true, though, that there are advertisements to look more beautiful from make up to clothing to plastic surgery ... shows, even the news at times, protraying graphic violence ... advertisements to "live the good life", stuff yourself at such and such restaurant, and then commercials for weight-loss pills ...
But the same can be said for many media aspects in our lives. Murder mystery and romance novels, for example.
It just seems to me that we are being constantly fed images or ideas that seem to accept, sometimes even glorify, vice as virtue.

***

Philbird
Yes, I did see that movie. You're right, it's not for the squeamish. Kevin Spacey's character was really something else.

posted December 24, 2004 02:28 PM              

ineterestingly, here's a history placing their origin with the greeks -- pre-christian:

quote:

---

According to Sacred Origins of Profound Things, by Charles Panati, Greek monastic theologian Evagrius of Pontus first drew up a list of eight offenses and wicked human passions:. They were, in order of increasing seriousness: gluttony, lust, avarice, sadness, anger, acedia, vainglory, and pride. Evagrius saw the escalating severity as representing increasing fixation with the self, with pride as the most egregious of the sins. Acedia (from the Greek "akedia," or "not to care") denoted "spiritual sloth."

In the late 6th century, Pope Gregory the Great reduced the list to seven items, folding vainglory into pride, acedia into sadness, and adding envy. His ranking of the Sins' seriousness was based on the degree from which they offended against love. It was, from most serious to least: pride, envy, anger, sadness, avarice, gluttony, and lust. Later theologians, including St. Thomas Aquinas, would contradict the notion that the seriousness of the sins could be ranked in this way. The term "covetousness" has historically been used interchangeably with "avarice" in accounts of the Deadly Sins. In the seventeenth century, the Church replaced the vague sin of "sadness" with sloth.

---

A Brief History of Sin

posted December 24, 2004 05:21 PM              

I mean you see these shows that show rich and beautiful people, thats really what people are trying to amount to in real life. I mean, I am the type of person who doesnt want to be rich. I basically want to make just enough. When I tell people this, they think Im insane. I get made fun of by people all the time because I value spending time w/my friends and family and working on my home life rather than working long days and hours to make money. I am basically a "housewife" for lack of a better word and someone had the nerve to tell me that if they were my fiance they would kick me out for being lazy and not out there doing "real work".

These are the values our modern day society has adopted. Its not just TV. Greed, Gluttony, and Envy have dominated our society in general.

posted December 24, 2004 08:20 PM              

Well it was about how religion used to repress our curiousities, when it had more influence, making those curiousities become dreams and fantasies. Looking back throughout history theres been obvious trends of Repression, Obsession, Repression Obsession. 26taurus noted this in the SEX string a little while ago, quoting Osho if anyones interested. I'm still upset about my passage getting erased. I'm going to get off now before I throw my computer out the window

oh yea I also wrote about how spirituality is becoming more mainstream now..I'm no longer afraid to be caught in the New Age section at the bookstore for fear that people think I'm a witch and am looking up my next potion to turn them into frogs. hehe Oh and that I think people may be starting to feel empty inside from all this distraction on sex, violence money, money, money..MOney! The only thing that can fill this void is hugs and kisses and laughter oh my! hehe Now who wants a big bear hug? Be honest. hehe

Monica

posted December 25, 2004 09:12 AM              

Talking of Sin. I learnt of an interesting definition of Sin. Sin = Deviation. Deviation from our true potential. Its akin to all the misshots on the dart board.

All thing that was created was created good. The cause was good. Its possible that due to certain combination, there are impurities or disharmony that some call evil exists.

For example, consider three primary colors red, blue, green. These three color in combination produce a color what we perceive. Now what is color white? It is these three colors mixed with highest intensity and equal measures. What is black? absense of red, green, blue. What is yellow? Absence of red and green and blue combined.

So you see we give names to the result. Black is considered evil by many. Now is black really evil? No.

posted December 25, 2004 10:40 PM            

Television does not glorify anything that someone wouldn't care to watch. Television, like all things from manifest humans, is not a cause; it's an effect.

posted December 25, 2004 11:21 PM              

It is plausible to think that our continued dependance on machines/robots could make the movie Matrix a reality. A long way to go. Also Frankenstein is one of my favourite movie and fits here on what I would like to say.

The point I want to make is that, we humans create our our own adversary and then we fear it.

Hmmm..... Now when I contemplate of the story of Garden of Eden , I think, that some one was trying to explain to us this reality in the form of a story (apple and serpent)

Whooaaa.... should I consider this as one of my hypothesis? Anyway some food for thought.

posted December 30, 2004 05:24 PM            

See, here's the contradiction that might turn everything on its head. If you are independent and do things of your own volition, then you will be productive and help the world evolve as well as bring success to yourself. However, by watching TV and buying products, you're contributing to capitalism and big companies which want to monopolise markets and ensure their steadily increasing profits increase more steadily. But then, what happens when these large companies saturate the market? How do they continue their profits? What will happen when people collectively realise they don't need there products any more? Microsoft vs Linux is a perfect example. MS keeps increasing prices for software, while Linux keeps becoming more userfriendly, stable, and with more free games and applications, not to mention books, magazines and online documents. Competition is good for reducing prices, but then when massive companies are able to undermine everyone else until they are all bankrupt, then increase there prices to create massive profits and monopolies, then you can see this could be disastrous, unless as I said, they saturate and everyone loses.

I guess my point is I wish people could just be satisfied with a modest company making a living, why do we have to compete so much? I guess this might come back to ego as in that other thread, but it really doesn't make too much sense in the long run.

posted January 05, 2005 04:58 PM              

Yes I think big capitalistic companies are corrupt by nature. They have proven that they will stop at nothing to get MORE MONEY! They have pretty much made a whole culture out of worship of money and power, where it feels natural sometimes to act completely selfishly and against humanity for the sake of personal gain. I think its good to stop and re-evaluate what has become of media and advertising so that we don't become absorbed into that greedy, power hungry culture. As you said competition is good for lowering prices and providing better services for us, but without real interest in the people, monopoly minded companies are bound to become corrupt.

Yea and I'm just plain tired of lust everywhere. I just learned to ignore it as much as possible for my own peace of mind. I stopped reading fashion magazines with fake models staring you in the face "saying if you only buy this, you'll look like me and be happy" HAhah thats what I used to read from them subconciously and I see most other girls seem to do the same without even realizing it. Anyways enough about that, I'm glad to see more people, like you waking up to the influence and potential corruption of big business. Its good to know I'm not alone Thanks for your thoughts, you seem very inciteful .

Monica

posted December 05, 2005 07:38 PM              

Eleanore, I particularly enjoyed the way you listed not only the vice, but the corresponding virtue. I'm thinking the essential truth behind the seven deadly sins can only be understood by meditating on this contrast.

posted December 22, 2005 11:01 PM              

------------------
Sincerely,
divinia

posted December 27, 2005 02:57 PM              

I do watch the news, a few odd programs, etc.

I had a friend staying with me... the t.v. was on more in this length than it has been in a combined 2 years.

The Man Show? Are these people serious? The Howard Stern Show? Are these people serious?

I made my friend mad once by telling him that I felt embarrassed for the women on these shows.

I just don't see the sense in jumping on a trampoline in a skirt... of course I guess a male would get amusement from it... but are these women content on just showing their bodies? Have they no personality?

Or on Howard Stern... these women will go in his studio... prance around, etc. allow this guy to make the most crass, vulgar comments... they giggle some more... I mean, why does this guy's opinion matter? (This is rude... but the guy is ugly as h*ll)

Then these males(men, boys) watching these things wonder what's going on when they realize that most women they meet are not willing to just bending over, coo over them, etc.

Once the friend saw that I was less than impressed with the show.. he said "why don't you do something like that"? Huh?

I went into the argument that due to shows/pictures/commercials just like these my 16 year old sister has a complex out of this world. She's a full-figured (not fat) girl... very attractive... however, she still thinks that in order to be seen as attractive she needs to be the size of Kate Moss.

I've tried to explain to her that women come in all shapes... it doesn't work.

Some can chalk it up to needing more self-worth... well, it's kind of hard for some teenage girls not to compare themselves to others... then once they realize that their body structure just won't allow them to be a size 1 ... they think that there is something wrong with them.

I don't know... I guess it takes all kinds.

Well... who am I to judge. Whatever floats their boats.

I just don't see where they will ever be taken all that serious... or maybe they don't want to??

posted December 27, 2005 03:09 PM              

I noticed the girl on the trampoline had larger breasts than me... I'm 27... I don't need those kind of insecurities...

posted December 28, 2005 03:32 AM              

It's sad because it mostly affects our children. It's hard to filter everything when you can't constantly be at their sides.

She makes comments on occasion about being smart and wanting to CHANGE the world so everyone will love each other. And that is what I want my child to be. I want her to be the change that she sees in the world. It's very hard raising children, especially girls..and I hate the thought that she someday may choose to use her body as a ploy or a tool to win some jerks attention. But I hope if I give her anything, it will be self-respect. Because I think an attractive woman is one who carries herself with confidence, dresses classy, and can hold her own. Sexuality is a very powerful thing, but it's become such a negative part of our society that everyone has just become brainwashed.