posted March 04, 2011 11:26 AM
quote:
Originally posted by LEXX:
Jesus quotes:
(Luke 12:49-53)49 I am come to send fire on the earth; and what will I, if it be already kindled?
50 But I have a baptism to be baptized with; and how am I straitened till it be accomplished!
51 Suppose ye that I am come to give peace on earth? I tell you, Nay; but rather division:
52 For from henceforth there shall be five in one house divided, three against two, and two against three.
53 The father shall be divided against the son, and the son against the father; the mother against the daughter, and the daughter against the mother; the mother in law against her daughter in law, and the daughter in law against her mother in law.
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Matthew 10:34-39
34Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword.
35For I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law.
36And a man's foes shall be they of his own household.
37He that loveth father or mother more than me is not worthy of me: and he that loveth son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me.
38And he that taketh not his cross, and followeth after me, is not worthy of me.
39He that findeth his life shall lose it: and he that loseth his life for my sake shall find it.
Lexx and ami i dont know who wrote the bible..But me being a non christian have come to believe immensely in the word of jesus christ!
I rever his teachings to the point of being extremely paranoid in his faith and belief!
He alone has the Words of life.
Luke 12:49-53
DECODED
12:49 I came to cast fire upon the earth1; and what do I desire, if it is already kindled2?
I came to cast fire upon the earth. A firebrand. The object of Christ's coming was to rouse men to spiritual conflict, to kindle a fire in the public mind which would purify the better part and destroy the worse. But the burning of this fire would excite men and stir up their passions and cause division and discord.
And what do I desire, if it is already kindled? The opposition of the Pharisees showed that this fire was already kindled. What therefore was left for Jesus to desire? His work as a teacher was practically accomplished. But there remained for him yet his duty as priest to offer himself as a sacrifice for the world's sin. To this work, therefore, he glances briefly forward.
12:50 But I have a baptism to be baptized with1; and how am I straitened till it be accomplished2!
But I have a baptism to be baptized with. A flood of suffering; that is, the agony of the cross.
And how am I straitened till it be accomplished! The language here is broken, indicating the strong emotion of him who spoke it.
12:51 Think ye that I am come to give peace in the earth? I tell you, Nay; but rather division:
Think ye that I am come to give peace in the earth? I tell you, Nay;
but rather division. Jesus came to conquer a peace by overcoming evil with good; a conflict in which the good must always suffer.
12:52 for there shall be from henceforth five in one house divided, three against two, and two against three1.
For there shall be from henceforth five in one house divided, three against two, and two against three. His warfare was not, as the people supposed, a struggle against the heathen, but against the evil within them and around them. So long as evil abounded, these unhappy divisions would last.
12:53 They shall be divided, father against son, and son against father1; mother against daughter, and daughter against her mother; mother in law against her daughter in law, and daughter in law against her mother in law.
They shall be divided, father against son, and son against father, etc. Jesus here shows the hard plight of the disciple. If he were the young son he would find his father against him, and if he were the aged father he would be persecuted by the boy whom he had raised.
Matthew 10:34-39
DECODED
quote
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The Jesus we see in chapter 10, verses 34-39--this Jesus, quite frankly, is the one that nobody wants to know .
It would have been so easy, and tempting, for me to skip this section of Matthew as I endeavour to reach the "Passion" narrative by Easter. But if I skipped this section, you would miss an essential side of Jesus. The side of Jesus that is DEMANDING.
This is where Jesus is, what you might term, "brutally straight forward". He holds nothing back here. "Do not think that I came to bring peace on the earth; I did not come to bring peace, but a sword"(v.34).
What a shocking statement! Jesus "did not come to bring peace, but a sword"?!. Why would He say such a thing?
What Jesus is doing here is He is correcting false assumptions about what the Jewish Messiah's mission was. According to Isaiah 9:5-7, the Messiah is described as the "Prince of Peace". The interpreters of the Hebrew Scriptures took that to mean that the Messiah would be the "Prince of Peace" ON EARTH. That, however, was not Jesus' mission. The ultimate goal of the Gospel was, and is, not harmony on earth, but PEACE WITH GOD(Rom.5:1).
Jesus says, "Do not think that I came to bring peace ON THE EARTH", but He did come to make peace between God and humanity(Rom.5:1).
I think we would all agree that peace does not come easily. Right now, all over the world, wars are being fought. And it would be ignorant for us to suggest that these countries are enjoying being at war. Peace is always preferable, but the reality is, when two sides strongly disagree on something conflict is inevitable.
The same goes for the Gospel. The goal of the Gospel is NOT conflict--with God, or with each other. The goal of the Gospel is "peace with God"(Rom.5:1). The difficulty is that the Gospel is such a penetrating message that it acts like a "sword". It pierces the consciences of humanity and calls us to love God more than we love ourselves.
Jesus warns us that profound conflict should be expected between those who accept the Gospel and those who reject it.
I am not telling you anything new here. Likely every person in this sanctuary can relate to what Jesus is saying. When you go to work, what do you usually talk about with your co-workers? Sports? Fashion? Home repair? Anything and everything, but not religion.
When your family gathers at Christmas, what do you talk about? Anything and everything, but not religion. Why? Because honest, from the heart, discussions on religious beliefs inevitably causes conflict. We have all been there--at least I have--many times. Even with fellow Christians, conflicts arise when it comes to getting straight the message of Jesus. The Corinthians fought, the Galatians fought, therefore so will St.Andrew's and Fraser if you try to get the message right, stand by that message, and share it with others.
Nowhere in this section is there the sense that we should run from this conflict either. It is presented as an inevitability--"A man's enemies WILL be the members of His household"(v.36). Now that doesn't give us permission to be obnoxious for the sake of the Gospel. This does not give us permission to pick fights with people who don't share our views. We are still required to be gentle, patient, loving, and gracious towards everyone. The cause of conflict SHOULD NEVER BE our personality or our manner of presentation. The only legitimate cause of conflict is the CONTENT of the message. An abrasive personality should never be the "sword"--the content is the "sword"--the Gospel is the "sword".
After warning His disciples about the potential the Gospel has for conflict, Jesus reminds them of their need for loyalty. Jesus tells them that "he who loves father or mother more than Me is not worthy of Me; and he who loves son or daughter more than Me is not worthy of Me"(v.37).
Now Jesus isn't calling us to dislike our family members. And even though Luke's version would have us "hate" our family, we must conclude this to be relative. Scripture is clear in its command for us to "honour (our) father and (our) mother"(Ex.20:12). And Scripture makes it clear that we should love our spouses(Eph.5:25).
So what is Jesus getting at here? Quite simply, Jesus wants us to prioritize Him. He wants us to make Him our first loyalty, and to emphasize this He names the two things most precious to us: our family and our own life .
Those of you with aging or ailing parents, think about how you devote yourselves to seeing that they are looked after. Those of you with children, think about to what extreme you would go to, to defend, protect, and look after your children. You invest your valuable time and resources in them on a daily basis. Quite frankly, you put your "heart and soul" into your care for them.
Then you read this passage, "he who loves father or mother more than Me is not worthy of Me; and he who loves son or daughter more than Me is not worthy of Me".
If you work hard to love, and care for, your parents and children that is terrific. It really is. Jesus would think so too. Jesus is NOT asking anyone to abandon their love and care for family. What Jesus is calling for here is, that you put the same energy and care into your relationship with Him, as you do with the people you love most. In fact, He calls for more. This is the mark of a Christian disciple: ONE WHO PUTS JESUS FIRST.
Christians should be known as hard workers at work. Christians should be known as good parents and committed spouses. But above all, Christians should be known as people committed to Christ--committed to Him above all else.
And just in case those listening to Jesus' message still haven't figured that out yet, He drives the point home with this challenging statement: "He who does not take his cross and follow after Me is not worthy of Me. He who has found his life shall lose it, and he who has lost his life for My sake shall find it"(v.38, 39).
What does Jesus mean, "take (our) cross"? I have heard some people describe their chronic illness as a "cross". Others will name everything from their nagging boss to their car trouble to their cranky mother-in-law as their "cross". But this is NOT what the word "cross" meant to a first century audience. The "cross" did not call to their minds the idea of long term difficulties or troublesome burdens. Even though Jesus had not yet revealed how He would die, the disciples knew the meaning of cross bearing well enough. To bear a cross was to shoulder a heavy wooden beam on the way to one's execution.
No, this doesn't mean disciples of Christ should go and get themselves killed. Christianity does not teach salvation by martyrdom. What Jesus is calling for here is loyalty so profound that one should be willing to make the most extreme sacrifice if necessary.
The apostles of Christ did just that. "The Foxe's Book of Christian Martyrs" records, that of the 11 apostles who remained after the Resurrection of Christ, 10 of them were executed for preaching the Gospel. At least 6 of them were executed by crucifixion.
We are extremely blessed here in 20th century North America. Few, if any, of us will ever be in danger because of our belief in Christ. Yet the Word of God still challenges to make sacrifices for the sake of the Gospel. And making sacrifices of time and resources is never easy. In fact, sacrificing may make us quite uncomfortable and cause us distress.
But this is the life of a disciple of Jesus Christ. We stretch ourselves. We think about the vigour we have towards our career, towards supporting our family and we hear the call of God to give even more vigour and more enthusiasm for the sake of the Gospel.
I am not trying to present the Gospel as some charity case that needs our contribution. I am trying to communicate precisely what I see here in Matthew 10--and that is a summons to sacrificial discipleship . Not sacrifice to a "charity case", but sacrifice to a God who came to us in human form and made the ultimate sacrifice--He died for us.
He died because He loves us. And He wants our loyalty not simply because we owe it to Him. Christ desires our sacrifice to have the same motivation as His--LOVE.
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I dont find any of the scriptures wrong few might be questionable but so is the case for any holy book.
Lindaland
UBBFriend: Email This Page to Someone! 
posted March 04, 2011 09:05 AM
posted March 04, 2011 09:08 AM
posted March 04, 2011 09:17 AM
posted March 04, 2011 09:20 AM
, just not the evil Demiurge of the Bibles.
posted March 04, 2011 10:41 AM
I grew up with the Bible, and I wanted to be a pastor. Fundamentally, if you're Christian, you follow Christ, so you look to what he said, and how he handled things. Underscoring everything he said were his two commandments, "Love the Lord your God with all your Soul," and, "Love one another as I've loved you." There is no antagonism towards people.