posted October 04, 2013 05:17 PM            

Best wishes

posted October 04, 2013 05:28 PM            

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Originally posted by geea:

and if theres a god , to quote a jewish prisoner in the nazi lager, ”he will have to beg for MY forgivness”

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Interesting...yeah...a Christian friend of mine said that she thought children were born with certain defects because "the sins of the fathers are visited upon the children to the third and fourth generations" and I must've looked shocked and disgusted, because she wouldn't look me in the face even as I calmly asked for some clarification.

She backtracked and said that we are all affected by the sins of our ancestors, but that seems nonsensical to me. Why should some pay worse for their ancestors' sins, when we all come into the world equally innocent? How do you tell someone who lives in debilitating pain from a congenital defect, "God did this to you because someone in your family sinned terribly"...and then seriously expect that person to LOVE GOD?

Or expect that person to tolerate your presence one second longer?

posted October 04, 2013 05:32 PM            

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Originally posted by Panthera Leo:
That must have been difficult.My family is Catholic and I was to when I was younger. Fortunately my mother and family weren't strict fanatics.I am glad they aren't strict because if they were they wouldn't have accepted me.

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Glad your family accepts you. That's huge.

My extended family thinks I am a total weirdo for leaving "The Church." It's no big deal to me, but I go to funerals and it's like I showed up with antlers on...everyone looks at me a little funny.

That's okay, never got along with them too well anyway.....

posted October 05, 2013 01:30 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Faith:
Interesting...yeah...a Christian friend of mine said that she thought children were born with certain defects because "the sins of the fathers are visited upon the children to the third and fourth generations" and I must've looked shocked and disgusted, because she wouldn't look me in the face even as I calmly asked for some clarification.

She backtracked and said that we are all affected by the sins of our ancestors, but that seems nonsensical to me. Why should some pay worse for their ancestors' sins, when we all come into the world equally innocent? How do you tell someone who lives in debilitating pain from a congenital defect, "God did this to you because someone in your family sinned terribly"...and then seriously expect that person to LOVE GOD?

Or expect that person to tolerate your presence one second longer?

I think the people who can just coldly rattle off these religious "facts" perhaps haven't dealt with any hardcore suffering, so they think it's merely a concept they can file in their big cabinet with all the other issues they think they've "solved."

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posted October 05, 2013 09:30 AM            

My father was an alcoholic, my paternal bloodline is completely Irish...no offense to the Irish, but there have been heavy drinkers in my family from time immemorial. I figured it was a cultural thing, but maybe there is biology involved.

Now...if there IS a gene, which miraculously I was just spared from having or acting on, are people with the genetic tendency to drink even "sinning" by drinking too much, or are they succumbing to an inborn weakness? I mean, did one ancestor originate the gene by sinning, and all his or her progeny are victims of that one fall, or are they equally sinning, even though they were increasingly genetically predisposed (as you say) to drink?

There ARE situations where the parents' behavior affects the health of the children...crack babies, for example, or children born out of incest. But to say that these children are like the "whipping boy" for their parents' sins is just repugnant to me. They are victims of circumstance, that's all. If God targets and cripples children just to teach their parents a lesson, how can we ever think of God as forgiving and loving? It's a conceptual mismatch.

posted October 05, 2013 09:46 AM            

quote:

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Alcoholism often seems to run in families, and we may hear about scientific studies of an “alcoholism gene.” Genetics certainly influence our likelihood of developing alcoholism, but the story isn’t so simple.

Research shows that genes are responsible for about half of the risk for alcoholism. Therefore, genes alone do not determine whether someone will become an alcoholic. Environmental factors, as well as gene and environment interactions account for the remainder of the risk.*

Multiple genes play a role in a person’s risk for developing alcoholism. There are genes that increase a person’s risk, as well as those that may decrease that risk, directly or indirectly. For instance, some people of Asian descent carry a gene variant that alters their rate of alcohol metabolism, causing them to have symptoms like flushing, nausea, and rapid heartbeat when they drink. Many people who experience these effects avoid alcohol, which helps protect them from developing alcoholism.**

As we have learned more about the role genes play in our health, researchers have discovered that different factors can alter the expression of our genes. This field is called epigenetics. Scientists are learning more and more about how epigenetics can affect our risk for developing alcoholism.

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posted October 05, 2013 11:59 AM            

Consider the royal and noble families of Europe. Family karma with these groups is very strong - unnaturally strong. Not a pleasant experience for them, but excellent examples of the phenomenon at work for us. The Habsburgs are a particularly good study. It works the same way when applied to the karma of nations, of cultures - and you can see how multiple family karma will influence even the destiny of nations. It shows, in glaring relief, the importance of nurturing good habits and strong moral fiber. Not only for our own spiritual evolution, but for the sake of our incarnating children, grandchildren, great grand children ....

posted October 05, 2013 12:49 PM            

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Originally posted by Faith:

But even if it is true, it's not like a person's fate is sealed by having certain genes.

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posted October 05, 2013 02:30 PM            

Family traits will exhaust themselves if they are overcome and when they no longer serve a purpose - both the negative and the positive traits! Dormant genes are scientifically acknowledged, yes? Continue to calm that passion found in your family karma and the trait will eventually lay dormant. Your great great grandchildren will not need it, their individual karma will not require it as yours did. Give in and cultivate the passion and it will continue to manifest in your family tree. Even better, seek out what good moral traits your family displays and cultivate them within yourself. Your grandmother had a temper. What else? A good sense of humor? A patient ear for a friend in need? A generous hand? Tend that garden and your descendants will eat well from it. You'll strengthen your line with incarnating souls willing and able to utilize those available good traits. It's imperative to our personal, family, and national karma that we nurture the good and weed the bad. In this way we provide better incarnating opportunities for future generations.

posted October 05, 2013 03:29 PM            

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Originally posted by Panthera Leo:
That's a great point you have made Geea. You will be happy to know i'm feeling less and less interested in him or what he thinks. I'm feeling a like a weight has been lifted off my mind.On the plus side if Hell is real and do go to there apparently according to Lei Kuei its like GAY HEAVEN

So hows things with you Geea

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posted October 05, 2013 04:04 PM            

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Originally posted by geea:
... even though i dont believe in karma

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ah. I'd like to hear more about that if you ever have the time and inclination. No debating necessary just your thoughts

posted October 05, 2013 05:21 PM            

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Originally posted by shura:
It refers to moral impulses - or the lack thereof. Family karma, you might call it, and it dies out by seven generations. Please understand that individual karma can and will trump it, if necessary. Also, there's always willpower. In other words, like a bad astrological aspect, it can be overcome. The overcoming is often part of our individual karma.

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Reconciling matters of "karma" with the Biblical concept of sin is too complex for little old 9H Jupiter Aries me.

Spiritual ideas have to be very basic and straightforward (read: Aries) or I just don't get them, they fly over my head.

quote:

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Originally posted by shura:
Consider the royal and noble families of Europe. Family karma with these groups is very strong - unnaturally strong. Not a pleasant experience for them, but excellent examples of the phenomenon at work for us. The Habsburgs are a particularly good study. It works the same way when applied to the karma of nations, of cultures - and you can see how multiple family karma will influence even the destiny of nations. It shows, in glaring relief, the importance of nurturing good habits and strong moral fiber. Not only for our own spiritual evolution, but for the sake of our incarnating children, grandchildren, great grand children ....

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Interesting...but as I said, karma is one thing, sin another. I just can't see a bridge between them, they hearken from such different traditions.

quote:

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Originally posted by shura:
We like to say that children resemble grandmother or father or so and so, but there is a greater truth to be found when see that we choose our parents because they resemble us.

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posted October 06, 2013 02:10 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by shura:
ah. I'd like to hear more about that if you ever have the time and inclination. No debating necessary just your thoughts

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posted October 06, 2013 02:14 PM            

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Originally posted by Panthera Leo:
I hope things improve for you to Geea and wish thebest of luck,health and happiness.

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posted October 07, 2013 05:24 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by shura:
ah. I'd like to hear more about that if you ever have the time and inclination. No debating necessary just your thoughts

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posted October 07, 2013 08:56 PM            

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Originally posted by Panthera Leo:
I don't think I really hate myself.I think I think I feel trapped by life.I understand that our actions in life determine what happens afterwards.I think the problem is we are all interconnected and effect each others lives.It just takes one small mistake to ruin lives or damn souls.I find it very difficult to function in society and remain mentally balanced.Sometimes just wish I could leave everyone behind.If I could I would be happy to leave the rest of the world to get on with things and I wouldn't hold unto any negative feelings I would be glad to leave.I have Aspergers Syndrome.Sometimes I just get really depressed or sometimes I go through the roof.I suppose I am glad I have some I can talk to and in my own way am glad I have my family and have met some new people in groups I have been involved with.My problem is that I difficulty keeping myself together sometimes even with family members.I guess sometimes I can't help but feel like I'm surrounded by enemies.Even when its not so obvious that I'm not feeling great and am acting friendly and pleasant and people seem to be enjoying my company I still feel disconnected.I have sometimes managed to be able to conceal the inner storm that is brewing inside me.Part of me hates having to do it.I don't really have a choice.I can let it out or people will think I'm unhinged.They would say I'm twisted if they found how I felt later.Yet they would blame me for being honest.Then they are oblivious to how I feel and I have to the keep up masquerade.I Sometimes I hate that in order to even be able to walk among other people I have to be become this stupid cold robotic thing that looked and acted like it he walked out a happy ever after of a fairy tale. I feel like life is just big game of cat and mouse.I guess I feel like I can't win and that makes me feel completely rabid.I feel like I hate humanity because I feel like the world is against and I feel backed into a corner.I feel like I want to fight back.I despise God because he created this reality and he let us have free will.He allows us to all butcher each other.

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posted October 08, 2013 09:27 AM            

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Originally posted by Panthera Leo:
Thanks blueskiez06. I agree there are really some assholes out there.On the plus there are plenty of good people also.I also need to get over my own hangs up and become more independent and assertive and stop myself from becoming an ******* . Sometimes I become very insecure and nasty and destructive.I need to let go of all my bad habits and attitude because they ruining my life and driving other people away.I need to find my purpose and remain balanced.I guess I shouldn't let the the jerks or the bad things that happen get me down.

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Yeah, time to be regal like a LEO