posted June 10, 2011 07:18 PM            

yes I've always been pretty close with my mom.

And by the time I was a teenager...I was like okay woman, you need to be not so involved in my life. So I rebelled. And even seriously hated her for a few years.

posted June 10, 2011 09:02 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by dysfunctionalmystic:
[B]Yep I'd agree Ami but sometimes you might have to swap mother for feminine and father for masculine (principal that is). B]

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Now that makes a ton of alot more sense for me. I mean, mom could be overprotective at times and somewhat paranoid about outside influences, but it hasn't really been a bad or toxic relationship. The feminine is a different story though.

posted June 10, 2011 09:07 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by dysfunctionalmystic:
Yep I'd agree Ami but sometimes you might have to swap mother for feminine and father for masculine (principal that is). Mars pluto is about controlling action fullstop because the rage/anger within can be powerful but the willfullness may also need managing.

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Yep
When you do a chart do you have to see WHICH key words fit for the person?
So Mars /Pluto can be willful too cuz Mars is the will and Pluto intensifies it?

posted June 11, 2011 03:03 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Ami Anne:
May I ask a question here to further my Astrological knowledge if you would allow me.
OK--so for Moon/Pluto--we say issues with Mother
Sun/Pluto--issues with Father
Venus/Pluto --issues with love perhaps obsessive in love
Mars /Pluto issues with violent anger,perhaps
Thanks for any help

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posted June 11, 2011 06:11 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by MertSerimer:
All major aspects can show a plutonian mother such as over-protective,dominative or strong-willed but also bad traits.

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my mom is also scorpio with pluto and sun in first house
that makes scorpio her rising sign too
sometimes i feel like she is not that strong on inside, she just needs to assure herself that she can control Everything, she hates opposition, not that she has been contested many times, she is people's people kind of person, but i don't know why but my gut tells me that she does this just to make up for some longing inside or she just has to be in control, at least pretend to be..its satisfies her

*sigh*

posted June 11, 2011 06:15 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by dysfunctionalmystic:
I have an 18 yr old daughter with a moon/pluto opposition and whilst there is a definite undercurrent of power struggle I can't say that we let it get in the way. I take care to not impose myself on her but at the same time I'll give my opinion if she wants it. We actually get along fine, she takes her role as a daughter quite seriously and makes the effort to come and see me so that we can talk and just chill out...this is her insistence not mine.

However, before she moved out things could be hard, there was a feeling of her wanting to rule the roost...and she was aware of this also. We both have a lot of fixed planets and feel happier knowing one anothers boundaries and I wonder if this helps? We do have disagreements but can agree to respect the difference.

I think the moon/pluto has to be worked with...it's not an aspect you can ignore. I have them quindecile and was unable to work through anything with my own mother though as I've got older I can respect the fact that she's human - and therefore flawed.

With the moon/pluto there is always an obsessive element to emotions and I know that my daughter likes the fact that I get where she's coming from if she's caught up in something.

Things could always change between us ... but it would take something major to cause long term damage. Her moon is in taurus (exalted?)and pluto is in scorpio (dignity) and I wonder if this also helps?

So yes to mother issues...power struggles... but there can be a good outcome.

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oh my God, i also have moon in taurus and pluto in scorpio and i don't see mom and i can be in the same room longer than 5minutes. she loves me, too much probably, that i know, i love her, she is well aware of the fact, its just that i just can't grasp and i have actually given up on working out the differences.

posted June 11, 2011 06:19 AM            

The article definitely rings true to me. I always follow my gut instincts...no matter what.

Thanks for posting this, Mert.

edit:

posted June 11, 2011 06:35 AM            

The artilcle seems to be very accurate. Were struggled growing up, mom couldn't afford the expensive shoes so we wore cheap ones. My mom and i always got along great and still do. She has moon in Libra also.

As far as emotions, yes, they run uber deep and sometimes I have to make a conscious decision to quell them. Even though my moon and Pluto is in an air sign like Libra, it makes no difference. There is nothing superficial about this aspect.

Another true thing is the sensing other people's emotions under the surface is very accurate. And I do always trust my gut/intuition/instinct when it comes to emotional matters.

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Gemini Sun
Libra Moon
Gemini Mercury
Cancer Venus
Virgo Mars
Virgo Asc

posted June 11, 2011 07:05 AM            

My daughter will generally give me too much info at times and like I said it's not all plain sailing but if we have a problem (which we don't very often) we can sort it out. I don't try to change her opinion and she doesn't try to change mine. If I'm wrong, I admit it, if she's wrong then she admits it. If anything she's more interfering in my life than I am of hers...and I accept this, I just don't "do as she says".

Awareness and acceptance can make a big difference. I'm glad that you feel you love one another in spite of any difficulties you might have.

@Ami Yes to your question on the mars/pluto thing. People witht hese aspects are usually better if they have somewhere to direct their energy and will often do sport or other physically demanding stuff to channel off energy.

posted June 11, 2011 10:50 AM            

quote:

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Consider the themes of Moon and create from them a sense of struggle for survival, and a propensity to Spartanism (a key tenet of Pluto) the mother therefore might not be especially nurturing. The same can be said for those with Moon in Pluto’s domicile, Scorpio and also his house, the 8th. Very often children with these placements are made to ‘make do’ or suffer some form of privation that sets them apart from others. One friend of mine with a strong Moon-Pluto configuration was always forced to make do with the cheapest school shoes and soccer boots, such that they hurt his feet because they were so cheap and poorly made. His mother saw the cost of good shoes as a waste of money since he would only grow out of them anyway. This seemingly trivial economy belies the normal priorities for a mother at least in the eyes of the child: the mother is supposed to consider the welfare, happiness and comfort of the child as being of paramount importance and yet here is a subtle message that the child is undervalued, not worth the expense and not very well nurtured.

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In the earlier days of my existence, we had to make do with alot. So it was rare I would have an expensive brand of shoes...except maybe on my birthday. After highschool that seemed to change though. But again, I experienced most of the 'Spartanism' with my father. He would give lots of nice things freely to my sister, while I was pretty much made to survive on what I had. He still supports my sister freely, while because I supposedly have this nice job that pays good I should be okay (I'm PRN, therefore I don't have regular income anymore). Mom's pretty much always the one who saves the day.

posted June 15, 2011 07:21 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by MertSerimer:
All major aspects can show a plutonian mother such as over-protective,dominative or strong-willed but also bad traits.

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posted September 28, 2011 05:47 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Ami Anne:
Ok
Let me ask you guys something--Do ALL Moon/Pluto aspects create problems with mother or JUST the opposition?

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Hell no they don't. I have moon conjunct pluto and my mother was absolutely nothing like all the interpretations say. In fact she was the exact opposite.

posted September 28, 2011 06:01 AM            

I have a feeling that Moon/Pluto has a selective memory in terms of the nurturing they received. You're programmed by that aspect to pick up on Plutonian craziness, hyper-sensitive to it all. Doesn't matter if your mother really had that quality or not, but when she comes at you wanting to know the ins and outs of your psyche the lights start flashing inside, when she is in a rage, again the signal goes off, when she is there to save your life, signal again. You add it all up and it points to your personal Moon/Pluto early life experience because that's what you were natally prone to pick up on. Combine that with Moon sign, house and other aspects (and house it rules) and you get a more personal picture.
That goes for any Moon aspect, if it's Jupiter you remember her sense of humor or when she promised more than she could deliver, how she indulged herself or over indulged you. If it's Venus you remember her beauty, if she felt as if she were in competition with you, if she complimented you, her cooking, her artistry, her femininity, her sensitivity to physical appearance. With Uranus you're over-sensitive to times she left you in another's care making you feel abandoned, the times she changed her mind all of a sudden that threw you off balance, all the new subjects she would introduce to you, the crazy changes that she would implement at home, any zany aspect of her personality - that is what you are going to personally attach to because it is reminiscent of who you are.
But the thing with parenting is you are picking up on the lunar vibes of the child, the Moon/Pluto child may cling to you for dear life afraid to venture out on their own so you develop a fear for them and an over protection because they show themselves to be so utterly hopeless you push them to branch out but you know their weaknesses, you know they can be easily manipulated because they cling so if you want you can pull that card on them. You could also easily be over protective if they had a rough birth and were sickly as an infant or if the doctors say you're unlikely to have another child or if your baby was difficult to conceive, any number of circumstances could point to an over-protective parent. But maybe their Moon/Pluto is not so tiresome and is more able to withstand storms and soldier on, then as a 'Plutonian' mother you can devote more energy toward empowering them, or you can be really rotten and cut them down at every chance you get because you find their strength to be threatening. So with all lunar aspects it is definitely a two way street: what the mother is picking up from the child, how they choose to respond to that, and also the child's selective memory based on the Moon's condition in their chart. And that of course carries over into adult life because others are picking up on your emotional reality and responding to it accordingly, 'cept now you have to kiss the memory of mama good-bye and admit you have no one to blame but yourself when Moon-related matters go awry

posted September 28, 2011 06:17 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Lonake:
What's the obsession on this thread with expensive shoes. lol (!) Better than kids in dire poverty walking daily barefoot in the mud and *hit of local livestock. We've all seen the commercials.

I have a feeling that Moon/Pluto has a selective memory in terms of the nurturing they received. You're programmed by that aspect to pick up on Plutonian craziness, hyper-sensitive to it all. Doesn't matter if your mother really had that quality or not, but when she comes at you wanting to know the ins and outs of your psyche the lights start flashing inside, when she is in a rage, again the signal goes off, when she is there to save your life, signal again. You add it all up and it points to your personal Moon/Pluto early life experience because that's what you were natally prone to pick up on. Combine that with Moon sign, house and other aspects (and house it rules) and you get a more personal picture.
That goes for any Moon aspect, if it's Jupiter you remember her sense of humor or when she promised more than she could deliver, how she indulged herself or over indulged you. If it's Venus you remember her beauty, if she felt as if she were in competition with you, if she complimented you, her cooking, her artistry, her femininity, her sensitivity to physical appearance. With Uranus you're over-sensitive to times she left you in another's care making you feel abandoned, the times she changed her mind all of a sudden that threw you off balance, all the new subjects she would introduce to you, the crazy changes that she would implement at home, any zany aspect of her personality - that is what you are going to personally attach to because it is reminiscent of [b]who you are.
But the thing with parenting is you are picking up on the lunar vibes of the child, the Moon/Pluto child may cling to you for dear life afraid to venture out on their own so you develop a fear for them and an over protection because they show themselves to be so utterly hopeless you push them to branch out but you know their weaknesses, you know they can be easily manipulated because they cling so if you want you can pull that card on them. You could also easily be over protective if they had a rough birth and were sickly as an infant or if the doctors say you're unlikely to have another child or if your baby was difficult to conceive, any number of circumstances could point to an over-protective parent. But maybe their Moon/Pluto is not so tiresome and is more able to withstand storms and soldier on, then as a 'Plutonian' mother you can devote more energy toward empowering them, or you can be really rotten and cut them down at every chance you get because you find their strength to be threatening. So with all lunar aspects it is definitely a two way street: what the mother is picking up from the child, how they choose to respond to that, and also the child's selective memory based on the Moon's condition in their chart. And that of course carries over into adult life because others are picking up on your emotional reality and responding to it accordingly, 'cept now you have to kiss the memory of mama good-bye and admit you have no one to blame but yourself when Moon-related matters go awry

And I guess based off of this thread if your child has a Moon/Pluto aspect, never ever buy them cheap shoes cos they will never forget [/B]

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Uh...could you not lump all Pluto Moons into one category? I read your entire post doing the headscratch and going, "No, my mom wasn't like that at all and no, I'm not like that at all either."

Not every Pluto-Moon person has (or had a) dark or even complex relationship with their mom. I think too that people forget the most basic astrology sometimes, which is that every luminary, planet and aspect symbolizes several different things, so they can play out in any number of ways. The Moon is more than just the mom, for instance. So moon-pluto can manifest as just being emotionally intense, that type of thing and actually have nothing to do with your mother.

posted September 28, 2011 06:25 AM            

Quoted!
The main difference between those who have a positive aspect between Moon and Pluto and those who are born with the negative aspects is that those born with positive aspects evolve through these experiences and use their powers to generally benefit the masses.

On the other hand, those born with negative aspects have difficulty resolving events which are beyond their control (life and death situations or relationship with parents etc). As a result, they tend to hold grudges, and become bitter and resentful with life. They can also lead the masses in the wrong direction (consciously or not). George Bush Sr. is a prime examle (1.2 million tons of bombs on Iraq for the sake of "peace")!

posted September 28, 2011 06:29 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by MertSerimer:
Edit:
The main difference between those who have a [b]positive aspect between Moon and Pluto and those who are born with the negative aspects is that those born with positive aspects evolve through these experiences and use their powers to generally benefit the masses.

On the other hand, those born with negative aspects have difficulty resolving events which are beyond their control (life and death situations or relationship with parents etc). As a result, they tend to hold grudges, and become bitter and resentful with life. They can also lead the masses in the wrong direction (consciously or not). George Bush Sr. is a prime examle (1.2 million tons of bombs on Iraq for the sake of "peace")!

[/B]

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posted September 28, 2011 07:31 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by MertSerimer:
Edit:

Quoted!
The main difference between those who have a [b]positive aspect between Moon and Pluto and those who are born with the negative aspects is that those born with positive aspects evolve through these experiences and use their powers to generally benefit the masses.

On the other hand, those born with negative aspects have difficulty resolving events which are beyond their control (life and death situations or relationship with parents etc). As a result, they tend to hold grudges, and become bitter and resentful with life. They can also lead the masses in the wrong direction (consciously or not). George Bush Sr. is a prime examle (1.2 million tons of bombs on Iraq for the sake of "peace")!

[/B]

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posted September 28, 2011 07:51 AM            

I live entirely on gut instincts, I always tell others that I feel like my life is a "survival game" emotionally. All intense, all the time, always searching for what's beneath the surface. For a long time, especially when I was younger and even now, on occasion, those deep emotions get the best of me. It's almost like you walk around knowing the ugly side of everything and it can make it hard to enjoy anything at all, especially if you know "the truth". It took a long time for me to be able to put that aspect of myself "away" sometimes and just have a good time. It's still a lesson I'm trying to learn to this day. I love having this aspect but I'll tell you, it can be very draining.

quote:

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Consider the themes of Moon and create from them a sense of struggle for survival, and a propensity to Spartanism (a key tenet of Pluto) the mother therefore might not be especially nurturing. The same can be said for those with Moon in Pluto’s domicile, Scorpio and also his house, the 8th. Very often children with these placements are made to ‘make do’ or suffer some form of privation that sets them apart from others.

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This part is so TRUE! My mother was never really nurturing so much as a "coach". When the going got rough, or when I was sad, or down, she never hugged me, comforted me and said it would be alright. She said "that's life, you've got to keep going, you're not dead yet." And I always felt that whatever was upsetting me was trivial and was almost embarrassed to express any emotion that didn't convey such. There were no tears in my home, no "I love yous", nothing of that sort. I felt my sister and I was raised as soldiers, to go out in the world, and fight, and stay alive. A peculiar upbringing that I didn't realize was strange until i became older and realized everyone else's was different.

I love her to death (Mom), but to this day she has a very strong hold over me that I'll never quite understand. Maybe it is the emotional manipulation, actually, I'm certain it is. But w/e the case, she makes it so hard for me to say "no" or to live my life the way I want. *sigh*

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Unlock your true potential!

posted September 28, 2011 08:45 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by MertSerimer:
Moon always does not need to be your "mother". It is who nurtured you - an event, an object, your father, uncle, your dreams(neptune/ceres aspects) or even [b]yourself.. Moon is where you find home. Everybody has issues or at least small issues who has these aspects where you get nurtured or grown up [/B]

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