posted April 10, 2014 03:35 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ceridwen:
ah why are all the planets in D30 on 00 degrees of the signs in my chart?
Is that normal? Why is that so?

---

That's definitely significant. I'm still learning the D30 - which is one you're going to want to examine closely, Ceri. The Trimsamsa.

It's specifically 'all evils, past karma, and punishments'.

Yeah. Look at yours and Jude's synastry through THAT lens. If your jaw doesn't drop several times, then I'll be very, very surprised.

Here's the weird thing. I did all of this last night in about the span of 3 hours. Of course, I don't think 'I' was really doing it - if you follow.

I learnt Jyotish back in my late teens from a very skilled practitioner. But it's been YEARS. Did the basics flood back to me? Maybe. (I mean, I wear Rahu around my neck.)

While these spoke to me, the Rasi did not. Tropical speaks to me, as well as Helio - but not Sidereal.

Why?

It's perspective. And I know, I KNOW, I'm breaking some crazy rules here, but ALL of it is part of the journey. ALL of it brings insight and understanding.

Porphyry is the best house-system for those things which are transpiring on a mundane, physical level. Regiomontanus seems to have a special relationship to the Sabians, and Antiscia Points. Who knows. 'And Placidus for everything else.'

Sidereal calculations are said to have a bit of that Helio feel to them; they're 'actions behind the actions' - which is what the D30 and D60 analyse. Maybe this is because of their accounting for the actual locations of things, going off of the positions of the Fixed Stars? That alone does feel a bit more 'anchored' and karmic.

Thing is, we're here NOW. And there's nothing like Geo-Tropical to put the emphasis on YOU in your CURRENT incarnation. There's a strange urgency with this system. By placing ourselves as the 'literal' centre of the universe, the spotlight's on us.

It's the Sun's Persona chart, in other words.

This leaves a lot floating out there, though. WHY that aspect in the natal? WHY those synastric connexions? WHY is the composite configured this way?

As you already know, Ceri, the answer lies in other systems - not just breaking down the one we've got.

So, for S&G's, I 'invented' a new method last night. Even if it ONLY worked for me, in THAT moment - it served its purpose. I get it. I don't LIKE it - but I KNOW it's true, and I can make peace.

But that's being a bit overly negative, isn't it? It may provide insight for you.

After all, many 00's in the D30 is a 'karmic reset'. You should find the understanding of why the wiped-slate has taken place in the D60: the compendium of all past physical karma, and the culmination of those actions across lives.

As always, lots of 28s, 29s, is an ending. 00s are the beginning. Seeing that in a D30, I'm going to surmise indicates that the punishment IS the reset - or, the enforced 'beginning?'

Look at the D60. I'm curious to see how that plays out.

Now. Are you using Sidereal or Tropical? I'm using - believe it or not - Tropical.

Putting it all together logically, the Tropical D60, following traditional rules of the Shashtiamsa - with a few 'modernisations' (because, God forbid, we use PLUTO! The esoteric, traditional astrologers once said .... ) But this SHOULD, in theory, show us that which is most URGENT, and HERE.

I like that. It's like a Cliff's Notes of our total accumulated karma - which, let's face it, can be a LOT.

How can we honestly expect to pick out one tiny little bit which may pertain to the NOW?

But Sages would slap my hand and say, 'the D60 IS what's most prevalent in this life.' But ... then another Sage will jump up and say, 'no, you're wrong.'

See, THEY don't even agree - and some are saying the Shashtiamsa should replace the Rasi. That it's already taking karma into account, so the D60, the 'soul chart' is more representative of the individual here.

Maybe, but then we get this huge divide which distresses me. I don't think astrology should be divided. I think it should be nothing more than lenses we're switching out in an apparatus with which we're using to view our universe - much like in the optometrist's chair. YOUR combination of lenses is almost guaranteed to differ from MY combination.

Is one better than the other? More accurate?

No.

The goal is clarity. How we GET there should be as both individualised - and collectively attained! - as possible. Share and share alike. Explore. Debate. Collaborate. Discuss. DO.

So, for that, the Tropical D60, D30, and D11 have revealed a BIZARRE symmetry to me - the likes of which you just never, ever find.

The Sidereal, on the other hand, is the 'part of the larger whole'. This is telling me WHY these things are here NOW - and what's driving them. This anchors the TD60 into the whole of the larger framework that is my collective karma.

In theory.

But what's staggering?

IT DOES.

posted April 10, 2014 03:38 PM            

And he puts his Sun on this configuration, with close orb, too.

he on the other hand has Venus exactly on his DESC in D9, and widely conjunct Saturn (7 degrees).

posted April 10, 2014 03:50 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ceridwen:
But then my own D9 is, well, there is an exact Saturn-JUNO-conjunction, only one degree off the DESC.

And he puts his Sun on this configuration, with close orb, too.

he on the other hand has Venus exactly on his DESC in D9, and widely conjunct Saturn (7 degrees).

And my D9 Venus conjuncts his ASC and opposes his Venus by 2 degrees. tip of iceberg.

---

Commitments are extremely karmic. JUNO-SATURN off the DSC really does hint at the whole 'sacred marriage' thing to me. And you were just telling us about your Saturnalia 'experiences' ....

The fact that he's mirroring that?

posted April 10, 2014 03:51 PM            

BTW it seems the planets end up on 00 degree always.

Anyway in my D30 I have:
Mars-Neptne-Nodes-ASC-MC on 00 Virgo
opposing Moon on 00 Pisces

Sun-Mercury-Lilith on 00 Scorpio

Jupiter-Saturn-Juno on 00 Sag

Venus-Ceres on 00 Aqua

Jude has:

Neptune-MC on 00 Virgo
opposite
Venus-Saturn-Chiron on 00 Pisces

Mars-Lilith on 00 Libra

Moon on 00 Scorpio
opposing
Pluto-Vesta-Juno on 00 Taurus

Jupiter-Node on 00 SAg

MNercury-Urnaus on 00 Cap

For our synastry that means:

1)
his Neptune-ASC-MC
conjunct my Mars-Neptune-Pluto-NN-ASC-MC
opposite my Moon

his Venus
conjunct my Moon
opposite my Mars-Neptune-Pluto-NN-ASC-MC

2)
his Mars-Lilith
opposite my Uranus

3)
his Moon conjunct my Sun-Mercury-Lilith

his Pluto-Vesta-Juno opposite my Sun-Mercury-Lilith

4)
his Jupiter-Nodes
conjunct my Jupiter-Saturn-Juno

5)
his Merucry-Uranus
conjunct m Chiron

6)
his Sun
conjunct my Venus-Ceres

It still looks like a strange chart.

posted April 10, 2014 03:56 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by maira:
tgem, I've been meaning to comment for a few days now, but I don't know if my input is welcome. I'll do it anyway and hope for the best

The letter you wrote was... struck me as cold. There, I've said it. I know that you said that you wrote it in heartbeat, and that is a sign that it did express everything that you felt at the time. But if you had hurt me badly while I was falling in love with you, a letter saying you 'have feelings' would angry me even more. At no point did you tell him that you were madly in love with him. Men are simple, they need it spelt out.
The way he dealt with it shows a lack of class. Personally, I would have beaten him with a stick. Yes, literally. But the reason might be the one I just wrote.

He might or might not be your TF, he might be a soulmate or just someone random in the big play that is your life. But you are a beautiful person and you will come out ok from this, I'm sure.

Again, I hope I haven't offended you!

---

Maira, thank you for commenting and sharing your opinion. You did not offend me at all as I am always open to constructive criticism..I have to be if I am going to post things on a public forum I see where you are coming from- and yes, I do agree that I wish he would have handled things differently from his end.

posted April 10, 2014 03:59 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ceridwen:
Yes, I understand what you are saying. Now and then I have been there myself, thinking, what`s the point anyway?

But usually my interest in astrology is resparked again.

Well, to me the point is not even to find definite markers to conclude he IS my tf or not, but to figure out what his specific purpose in my life is and the specific nature of the connection.

Do you know what I mean?

---

posted April 10, 2014 04:01 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ceridwen:
only got that far until you mentioned to view Judes and my syn in the 30th. lol

BTW it seems the planets end up on 00 degree always.

Anyway in my D30 I have:
Mars-Neptne-Nodes-ASC-MC on 00 Virgo
opposing Moon on 00 Pisces

Sun-Mercury-Lilith on 00 Scorpio

Jupiter-Saturn-Juno on 00 Sag

Venus-Ceres on 00 Aqua

Jude has:

Neptune-MC on 00 Virgo
opposite
Venus-Saturn-Chiron on 00 Pisces

Mars-Lilith on 00 Libra

Moon on 00 Scorpio
opposing
Pluto-Vesta-Juno on 00 Taurus

Jupiter-Node on 00 SAg

MNercury-Urnaus on 00 Cap

For our synastry that means:

1)
his Neptune-ASC-MC
conjunct my Mars-Neptune-Pluto-NN-ASC-MC
opposite my Moon

his Venus
conjunct my Moon
opposite my Mars-Neptune-Pluto-NN-ASC-MC

2)
his Mars-Lilith
opposite my Uranus

3)
his Moon conjunct my Sun-Mercury-Lilith

his Pluto-Vesta-Juno opposite my Sun-Mercury-Lilith

4)
his Jupiter-Nodes
conjunct my Jupiter-Saturn-Juno

5)
his Merucry-Uranus
conjunct m Chiron

6)
his Sun
conjunct my Venus-Ceres

It still looks like a strange chart.

---

Look for conjunctions and patterns. Treat it like you would Helio. Look for those kinds of patterns.

And, more than anything, cross, cross, cross. With D60, with D11, with D9, with Draco, Tropical, Helio - synastry, composites, natal - EVERYTHING.

posted April 10, 2014 04:05 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ceridwen:
only got that far until you mentioned to view Judes and my syn in the 30th. lol

BTW it seems the planets end up on 00 degree always.

Anyway in my D30 I have:
Mars-Neptne-Nodes-ASC-MC on 00 Virgo
opposing Moon on 00 Pisces

Sun-Mercury-Lilith on 00 Scorpio

Jupiter-Saturn-Juno on 00 Sag

Venus-Ceres on 00 Aqua

Jude has:

Neptune-MC on 00 Virgo
opposite
Venus-Saturn-Chiron on 00 Pisces

Mars-Lilith on 00 Libra

Moon on 00 Scorpio
opposing
Pluto-Vesta-Juno on 00 Taurus

Jupiter-Node on 00 SAg

MNercury-Urnaus on 00 Cap

For our synastry that means:

1)
his Neptune-ASC-MC
conjunct my Mars-Neptune-Pluto-NN-ASC-MC
opposite my Moon

his Venus
conjunct my Moon
opposite my Mars-Neptune-Pluto-NN-ASC-MC

2)
his Mars-Lilith
opposite my Uranus

3)
his Moon conjunct my Sun-Mercury-Lilith

his Pluto-Vesta-Juno opposite my Sun-Mercury-Lilith

4)
his Jupiter-Nodes
conjunct my Jupiter-Saturn-Juno

5)
his Merucry-Uranus
conjunct m Chiron

6)
his Sun
conjunct my Venus-Ceres

It still looks like a strange chart.

---

Jesus! I'm just seeing HOW MANY 0's.

WOW, Ceri.

Okay. Start plugging in the ones you know. ATLANTIS, the Arthurians, TRISTAN, ISOLDA, etc.

posted April 10, 2014 04:14 PM            

In the D60 Patrick`s Mars is conjunct my Venus by 1°38 degrees.

his Moon conjuncts my NN exactly

I have Moon on my own DESC in Scorpio there exactly, which mirrors the fact that my Draco Moon is conjunct my tropical DESC exactly.

In D60 this Moon/DESC is trine my Venus in Pisces, which means that his Mars is not only conjunct my Venus but trine my Moon-DESC, and maybe triggering this.

His Moon is not only on my NN, but conjunct my IC by 4 degrees, and his Chiron conjuncts my IC exact, which looks a bit painful I admit.

Interestingly my IC in D60 is exactly conjunct my IC in the radical chart, too.

his ASC conjuncts my Mars (and curiously his D60 ASC falls right onto my D1 ASC-Neptune-NN-Atlantis whatever, which is also conjunct our first meeting chart`s ASC).

Of course JUNO-Saturn is popping up again, I suppose this is so because we both have exact aspects in the natal chart, my D1 Juno-Saturn trine is even just a minute of orb (his sextile is a bit more widish, but still way under half a degree. lol) So this might be the reason they stay throughout all the harmonics

Well, in this instance my JUNO is conjunct Neptune, and trine Saturn.
For him JUNO and Saturn are conjunct.

Now it happens that my Jupiter conjunctsh is JUNO and Saturn in D60.

and his VESTA conjuncts my JUNO (NN is a bit too wide (5-6 degrees)

Just pointing out the things that I noticed at first glance.

Trying that exercise with Jude it has following "signals"

his ASC and Venus conjunct my Moon; his Mars-Juno opposite my Moon

his Mercury opposite my Venus

his Jupiter conjunct my SN

his VESTA conjunct my Neptune-Juno, but in his case closer to my Neptune, while in Patrick`s case it was closer to my Juno.

his Uranus conjunct my Mars exact (falling on the same degree as D1 NN-Neptune)

his SN conjunct my VESTA

interestingly he also triggers my angular Moon-Venus-trine in watersigns, just in his case he puts his Venus in conjunction to my Moon and trine my Venus, while Patrick put his Mars onto my Venus and trine my Moon. Also in Patrick`s case the orbs were closer.

posted April 10, 2014 04:19 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by IndigoDirae:
I agree the composite was very close - even as it was missing a few of the things which I'd consider it a lock. Doesn't mean it doesn't apply - means we've got a different animal here. Trick is identifying it. For, say, proper care of feeding.

Curiously, what drew me most was your dual SUN-UNION conjunctions. Points near the SUN are identifying features. It says to me that there's a profound similarity there, and it has to do with the human need to connect.

Does this make you very high level Soulmates?
Was he a Guardian - putting you on your path?

Never knock either of the above, remember. As Ceri said, she'd rather have whatever gives her the best experience of true love. (In a manner of speaking - I bungled the words, but I think that was the gist.)

Cheers to that! You deserve the same.

I'm thinking it's possible that he very well may be your Twin Flame, but certain features in the composite are missing which determine that THIS is the life in which you reunite.

'But if I'M a Twin Flame, doesn't that mean I'm HERE to DO that?'

That's what we're all trying to determine now. Interesting theory posed by Zeyven Blackwell - who ... my logic says, 'Oh, please.' But something else ... my soul? My soul tends to nod and think, 'yes, this is true.'

He wrote something quite speedily which also harkens from The Lachesis Theory, which is, obviously, a variation on The Graduate Theory.

He surmised that the highest level and most tightly bonded Soulmates, those who are so capable of love and compassion - that they're the 'frontline'.

Then, 'if necessary', he writes, to activate the Twin Flames.

( ... I know, it's a bit 'go-go-gadget karma,' but - bear with me. I see his point.)

The key of 'activation' is intriguing.

It makes me think we can look at the basic overall patterning of a chart and go, 'Oh, yes. Twin Flames.'

But are they ACTIVE Twin Flames?

Is there a pair - or a dozen - Soulmates on the planet right now doing their level best to achieve THEIR end of the deal - before it goes into 'red zone' and YOU take over?

AND ...

... Are you one of them?

Think about that for a moment. IF you're ALSO here with high-level Soulmates, then it's kinda important to clear that first rung, right? Similar to a video game. Why on earth would we think we're ready for Level 42 if we haven't even cleared those up to Level 12? Level 42 will crush us!

But more than that ... what of everyone else along the way? There to provide advice? Insight? From whom we're to learn lessons? Balance karma? Settle old debts? Be READY for those advanced levels?

Perhaps there's something to this 'activation' theory. Perhaps we all felt the '2012 Rush', so to speak, (I know I did. October 2011, I felt an insane drive to reconnect with him; but by September 2012, it was evident that there was too much 'undone' before we got to THAT point) and now it's time to accept the fact we weren't ready for some things.

I thought yesterday, 'she's not going to be here much more since she feels nothing applies to her,' and hoped that you don't feel that. I was compelled to create this thread, which has become a sort of 'convergence point' for all of us - for a reason. I 'built it'. You guys came. That's not coincidence. Maybe a bit of providence, in fact.

So, yes, I AM going to study your charts. It's possible that you, like me, have some major outstanding karma to attend to, and 2012 made us all feel like we could skip all of those levels. We can't.

Something that Mel said that I DO agree with, wholeheartedly, is 'why don't they WAIT?' There's such a mad rush. We all want to be there NOW. I admire the courage, tenacity, and PATIENCE of Ceri. She's able to remind me, in her way, to be patient and have faith.

All right, enough pre-coffee / insomniac morning soapboxing. (I didn't sleep much last night. Following posts should explain why. A LOT clicked last night for me. And, believe it or not, Fate was not the subject. Just me. Just my 'path'.)

And, for the hell of it, since my iTunes decided to throw this one at me today ...
http://youtu.be/z7Eu4pTGtVM

Always thought those two songs 'belonged together'. But it took more than two decades and a young Filipino couple to make it happen.

You just never know.

---

Can you list which ones I was missing in the composite that would have considered it a lock ( just for my own future informational purposes?)

Yes, the DW sun/union in our natals is pretty interesting...it must mean SOMETHING??!!

About what Ceri said... I totally agree.. I just want the best chance to experience true required love with someone... In whatever shape or form...without all the drama..

I can't believe you thought that I thought about not posting much anymore because my case no longer applies...because I was!! For like the last two days...we must have some sort of psychic links between our charts somewhere...I pretty sure about that.

I hear you about the activation theory. It makes sense. I tend to take Ceri's opinion that everyone has a TF...and I do believe I am here in this incarnation to meet mine..why you say? Because even if you take Cusp out of the picture completely, I can list about 5 things that put me in the category of uniting with my TF in this lifetime..and that's just going off my natal and numerology and experiences I've had..not even synastry with anyone...now I'm not saying I want to be, I'm not saying that I definitely am to be united in this lifetime...what I am saying is the info. I have found points that direction.

Regardless...I don't want to play level 42 if I'm only at 12....passing 12 was hard enough and took the fun out of the game..

posted April 10, 2014 04:24 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by IndigoDirae:
Jesus! I'm just seeing HOW MANY 0's.

WOW, Ceri.

Okay. Start plugging in the ones you know. ATLANTIS, the Arthurians, TRISTAN, ISOLDA, etc.

Get your theme going. Then tell me what emerges.

---

WEll, I did it with solar fire that has an opition for Vedic divisional charts, and there the D30 comes up with 00 degrees (in EVERY case).

posted April 10, 2014 04:36 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by IndigoDirae:
So many configurations 'spring' to life, as if they come out of hiding. Like, 'how didn't I notice this before?' that sort of thing.

---

Yes, when I first saw our 9th harmonic synastry, my eyes glazed over, like that was just too unreal.

Also, not only is his Sun conjunct my jUNO, but my Moon is also conjunct his JUNO (though the orb is a bit wider (5 degrees). But my Valentine is conjunct his Juno by just a mere degree. lol

posted April 10, 2014 04:38 PM            

Indigo- if/when you go back to our charts, plug in our name asteroids:
Mine: 16012
His: 24305 and 5948

Notice where they fall!
My name in my natal 28'59 Pisces conjunct Amor in 10th
His name in my natal 29'42/ 29'04 Aries both conjunct in my 11th

posted April 10, 2014 04:46 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by IndigoDirae:
So many configurations 'spring' to life, as if they come out of hiding. Like, 'how didn't I notice this before?' that sort of thing.

---

Yes, when I first saw our 9th harmonic synastry, my eyes glazed over, like that was just too unreal.

Also, not only is his Sun conjunct my jUNO, but my Moon is also conjunct his JUNO (though the orb is a bit wider (5 degrees). But my Valentine is conjunct his Juno by just a mere degree. lol

posted April 10, 2014 05:19 PM            

(interestingly I noticed him just after I turned 30, so this was my Age harmonic for this. lol)

planets from 29-02

his EROS-JUNO 1 Gemini
his Mars 00 Pisces
his Venus 01 Taurus
his KARMA 00 Sag

my JUNO 29 Aquarius (conj. SAturn on 28 Aqua)
my PSYCHE 1 Aries
my EROS 29 Gemini
my KARMA 00 Leo
my MC 29 Leo
my ASC 00 Scorpio
my Chiron 01 Sag

so...

his EROS-.JUNO sextile my PSYCHE exact
his EROS-JUNO sextile my KARMA
his EROS-JUNO opposite my Chiron exact

his Mars conjunct my JUNO
his Mars trine my EROS
his Mars conjunct my IC
his Mars trine my KARMA
his Mars square my Chiron (t-square-alarm!)

his Venus square my KARMA
his Venus conjunct my DESC
his KARMA square my JUNO (he fulfilled my natal Juno-Karma-square?)
his KARMA trine my PSYCHE
his KARMA trine my KARMA
his KARMA conjunct my Chiron

(my D30 Chiron conjuncts my tropical AMOR and helio ANGEL)

additionally (not on the transition degrees):

his ASC on 3 Cap conjunct my Pluto on 2 Cap
(on our tropical Eve-Adams-conjunction)

hsi NESSUS on 20 Cap square my DEJANIRA on 20 Aries exact

(his D30 Nessus on my Avx, Sun/Moon-mp and opposing my EROS and Draco DEIANIRA exact; my D30 DEJA conjunct my Chiron exact and opposing my DNA - and curiously Patrick`s and my composite SN is on 20 Aries, composite Amor-Cupido-Camelot on the NN on 20 Libra, with his Pluto falling there - he is pulling me away from this? lol)

his AMOR on 28 Aquarius conjunct my Saturn on 28 AQua and JUNO on 29 Aqua and IC on 29 Aqua.
Also trines EROS on 29 Gemini and squares Sun on 28 Taurus.

his Jupiter on 5 PIsces opposing my Moon (3 Vg), Mars (5 Vg), Jupiter (6 Vg)

in his own chart VALENTINE on 14 Aries exactly square Saturn on 14 Cancer and trines Pluto n 12 Leo

his Saturn conjunct my Vertex on 14 Cancer exact (and hence Valentine squares it). My own VAL is on 16 Cap (on his natal NN btw) and hence opposes his Saturn and squares his Valentine.

his Chiron on 26 Aries squares my Neptune on 28 Cap (slipping through his hands, literally?)

his Venus conjunct my mercury on 1 Taurus exact, and trines my Pluto on 2 Cap, on his ASC on 3 Cap

his Venus also on my DESC and square my KARMA

his SUn on 18 Taurus trne my Val on 16 Cap,

his Moon on 27 Cancer opposite my Neptune on 28 Cap, conjunct my KARMA on 00 Leo

his Pluto on 12 Leo squares my VESTA on 11 Sco and VX on 10 Sco

hsi VX conjunct my UNON on 25 Virgo

his Neptune on 4 Libra square my Pluto on 2 Cap (on his ASC)

his Neptune opposes my Venus on 3 Aries

his Neptune on 4 LIbra also trines my NN on 4 Aquarius and AMOR on 4 Gemini

his UNION on 21 Sco is exact on my natal 12th house cusp but nothing of significance in the D30 chart

posted April 10, 2014 05:51 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ceridwen:
Wow!
Just risked a glance.

In the D60 Patrick`s Mars is conjunct my Venus by 1°38 degrees.

his Moon conjuncts my NN exactly

I have Moon on my own DESC in Scorpio there exactly, which mirrors the fact that my Draco Moon is conjunct my tropical DESC exactly.

---

Yeah. The keyword seems to be 'exactly'. It's astonishing how many aspects are EXACT, and how many degrees are 'missing degrees' - linkages that seem to bring everything together into a cohesive framework.

Something I just noticed, too, in looking at the differences between the 'traditional' approach (whole sign / lahiri geo) and my speculative approach for the 'here and now, physical karma' - geo-tropical, etc.

It seems they should be used in tandem - but much like we compare Draco and Tropical.

I'm surmising the Sidereal degrees will convey how the physical karma represented in the Tropical is anchored in the whole. These are the soul-based motivations.

Here's why.

In my Sidereal D60, the point which represents the death in the past life which most influences this one, is EROS - 13º ARI 22'.

This is no different from the Tropical. But the degree - and sign - have changed.

And - so have the aspects. THAT caused me to investigate, and refine.

In the Tropical D60, there's a staggering connexion: an exact conjunction of 0º08 of my EROS to his TISIPHONE. Words can't describe the monumental impact of that. (18º PIS, for those curious.)

I figured, much like Draco to Tropical, there'd be the same thing.

I was intrigued to find ... I was wrong.

It's one of the patterns which shifted out of aspect. And, yes, I DO find that meaningful.

I also figured the Sidereal D60 might show me why.

CHIRON-ATROPOS-TISIPHONE are huddled together across 0º-5º PISCES, beginning the second house from AL.

This does hit his Sidereal D60.

His EROS conjunct my ATROPOS 0º13; it's also conjunct my CHIRON/TISIPHONE MP, 0º25.

If you know the synastric links in Geo-Tropical - this is flabbergasting. Theories surrounding that synastry are being EXPLAINED, right here, in the Sidereal D60.

Incredible.

Okay. We've got his EROS exactly on my ATROPOS, which sits on my CHIRON/TISIPHONE MP.

This will be the lynchpin for examining the Tropical D60.

Going back to that, we recall that my - for our purposes today - 'Shashtiamsa Death Point' - is at 18º PIS 27'; his TISIPHONE is 18º PIS 36' (and conjunct his AL at 3º, and his CHIRON at 1º - in case we needed confirmation of significance. Anything near the AL is EXTREMELY important to the D60; shapes or conveys the overall tone, purpose, or gist of that incarnation.)

Curiously, we don't have the same 'direct hit' in the Sidereal D60. I suppose you could argue there's an eerie sense to his VENUS/ASC MP being conjunct my 13º EROS 1º; as well as his VENUS/TISIPHONE, 2º. With TISIPHONE on the AL, it's pretty clear what the 'gist' of that lifetime is. And with CHIRON conjunct it 1º, well, we can presume things weren't all roses and planets. (Understatement of the century.)

Oh, and my AL is conjunct ALICE.

IN ALL THREE.

YEAH. I about ... I definitely said some words.

So, there was another 'switch-up' here.

In SD60, it's his EROS that gets wrapped up in my ATROPOS, CHIRON/TISIPHONE.

In TD60, it's my EROS, which now serves as my Shashtiamsa Death Point, that's EXACTLY conjunct his TISIPHONE.

Well, since the ante was dramatically upped from soul-centric, astral-motivation level to the physical level of action, and we now have an exact synastric link between D60s, THAT needs to be investigated.

As the troublemaker seems to be TISIPHONE, we'll examine her more closely from the perspective of his charts - starting with TD60. If we want to see what loaded this gun, however, it's best to refer back to the SD60. While not an exact aspect like we see in the Tropical, it does form the CHIRON/TISIPHONE MP - which is meaningless without the support of my ATROPOS and his EROS activating it.

This ONLY happens in the Sidereal. So there's a strange chronology to it.

In the Tropical, it's as if it's already siphoned off into an exact aspect: TISIPHONE conjunct EROS, synastric, 0º08.

An aspect which says, 'I'M ON YOUR DEATH POINT! NOTICE ME!'

Ohhh, duly noted, conjunction-from-hell. Duly. Noted.

The way I knew this was having a powerful, but subtle effect in the tropical was the TISIPHONES exactly parallel each other at 32N. That just DOES NOT HAPPEN.

Ready for the kicker?

TISIPHONE conjunct CHIRON. Synastric. Exact. 17º TAU. Tropical. My CHIRON. His TISIPHONE.

So now I can only muse upon what my D60 (as it's a 'transdimensional aspect') CHIRON/TISIPHONE has to do with creating that. Especially since it 'was all academic' before the TD60.

ATROPOS was always there - heralding either inevitability or death - you decide.

But there was nothing ACTIVATING it. Like a dormant volcano, it lay in wait. Until ...

BAM.

EROS. What's EROS got to do with it?

Well, if you look at the Draco (and Tropical synastry and composite) quite a lot. Interestingly, the EROS-PSYCHE that appears in my D60 - both - is a near-exact opposition. Sidereally, it's opposing that 13º EROS - which becomes the Death Point.

Tropically? It's 19º VIRGO - 1º opposite the DP. Which also happens to be my natal ATROPOS - which is 7º off of his MADHATTER. Because, no, we're not going to escape THAT easily!

I'll save THAT for another post, however. Oh, he's making his mark all over the D60. But it's the linkages with D30, and the D11, which provide the 'missing links' between our natals, synastries, and composites - Draco, Tropical, Helio - you name it.

posted April 10, 2014 06:01 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Ceridwen:
WEll, I did it with solar fire that has an opition for Vedic divisional charts, and there the D30 comes up with 00 degrees (in EVERY case).

However making a 30th harmonic chart on astro.com has diff. results.

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posted April 10, 2014 06:03 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Ceridwen:
Yes, when I first saw our 9th harmonic synastry, my eyes glazed over, like that was just too unreal.

Also, not only is his Sun conjunct my jUNO, but my Moon is also conjunct his JUNO (though the orb is a bit wider (5 degrees). But my Valentine is conjunct his Juno by just a mere degree. lol

BtW did I mention that in D9 Jude`s Sun is conjunct my Moon-Valentine? lol

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Exactly!

This whole PSYCHE-MADHATTER thing had me so confused. But now that I realise HOW pivotal PSYCHE is in all of this? No wonder!

And his exact tropical VALENTINE-MADHATTER?

posted April 11, 2014 03:45 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Ceridwen:
some of the D-charts are differently calculated than harmonic charts though. The D9 and 9th harmonic chart comes up with the same results, but that is not true for every D-chart/ harmonic chart. It seems that the D30 and D60 are among those that have different results to the respective harmonic charts.

so what are we really looking at? D-charts or harmonic charts?

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That's a good question. I was told (on a jyotish forum) that you can cast divisional charts on Astrodienst using Whole Signs, Lahiri, and filling in the harmonic number with the desired divisional / harmonic.

I know whatever these are, they're ASTOUNDING.

posted April 11, 2014 03:53 AM            

Either way, it's certainly interesting. I stumbled upon the division charts again when looking for karmic indicator charts or which harmonics might represent karma.

That brought me D60, and D30 for negative karma / punishments, with the D11 for 'death, destruction'.

Whatever it turns out to be, it's been gobsmacking in terms of providing missing links and filling in Tropical, Draco, and Helio gaps. Providing motivation and background for certain oddities.

posted April 11, 2014 04:24 AM            

speaking of Cochrane, he describes some degree-meanings, and bases his descriptions/ findings on the 9th, 30th and 12th harmonic signs and their relative position.

http://www.astrosoftware.com/DegreeMeaning.htm

of course that is a different approach than Vedic.

In my own case Moon is in these signs:

9th: Pisces
12th: Libra
30th: Virgo

In all of these it is tied to Saturn

9th: square
12th: conjunct
30th: opposite