posted February 06, 2017 08:53 AM            

Also, put in Nessus, Dejanira, Hekate. I know there are others but I can't think of them now.

Nice to see you, Astra

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posted February 06, 2017 08:56 AM            

Is your stepfather clueless if anyone tries to explain his OBVIOUS behavior to him lol

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posted February 06, 2017 09:12 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Faith:
I think new astrologers don't even realize how much truth there is in natal charts.

So they don't have the same level of respect for meticulous research.

As I've progressed in learning, I've been more and more interested in seeing actual charts of people who exhibit certain tendencies. I'm very curious to know if there really ARE patterns.

With sun square Jupiter, which I have, the pattern does not seem to be that these people are malicious and dark, as alleged here. Just glancing over the list, I see many people who are well-liked for their ebullient sense of humor or epic-sized imagination (George Lucas/ Star Wars.) Traditionally this aspect is associated with a simple tendency towards excess. That CAN be sublimated in brilliant ways, and I strongly disagree that it impinges on the native's conscience, especially when that is Ami's trademark idea, and she's never supplied any research to prove it out.

Not everyone's conscience is the product of religious indoctrination (Jupiter/religion). Therefore if one's indoctrination is at odds with one's core self (sun), it may just show an eventual rejection of whatever belief system the person was raised in. In my case, it's Catholicism, and there is a clean break.

Admittedly I have some grievances surrounding my religious upbringing, represented in the square. But that doesn't obliterate my conscience. If anything I suffer from an over-reactive guilt complex, as a product of my upbringing. That is the negative manifestation of the square in my case, not sociopathic tendencies.

I think it's a good idea, if we want to understand an aspect, to have an open discussion with the people who have that aspect, rather than dictating to them who they really are inside, what they are hiding from themselves, and so on. That is really beyond the scope of astrology and inappropriate in all purely social situations, in my opinion.

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Yes! Thanks for this - I hadn't considered the religious indoctrination being at odds with the native's consciousness angle.. Makes a lot of sense with Jupiter.

posted February 06, 2017 09:24 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Elysia:
Yes! Thanks for this - I hadn't considered the religious indoctrination being at odds with the native's consciousness angle.. Makes a lot of sense with Jupiter.

Sun square Jupiter can also result in expecting too much of oneself? The one person I know that has it does set huge goals for himself. Well he has the discipline to follow through but I can imagine it must get exhausting. And with the Jupiter influence - he has a "don't let 'em see you sweat" motto. He smiles & jokes through everything. So, no-one actually realizes the effort that goes into fulfilling those goals.

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^ That makes sense, too! He sounds cool.

Also, I should mention that I just have an awkward relationship with religion in general. And a feeling that I don't belong.

It's between me and the churches. I try very hard to just keep an ecumenical mindset and remind myself that there are many ways to live spiritually within a religious framework, despite all the depressing negative manifestations of religion out there. It takes effort to see it and not just turn disgusted when I see the problems, but deliberately seek out those people who keep my hope alive, that evolution is happening even within the clergies and higher positions in the hierarchy.

I really appreciate Pope Francis. For ME to honor a pope has taken effort and inner work (again, that square)...but I do.

Squares are not hopeless and they are not to be read as sure indicators of character deficiencies.

It's a simple thing we all should bear in mind.....

posted February 06, 2017 09:28 AM            

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posted February 06, 2017 09:30 AM            

Should I mention my afflicted water moon also then?

posted February 06, 2017 09:32 AM            

"With sun square Jupiter, which I have, the pattern does not seem to be that these people are malicious and dark, as alleged here."

The reason for this is that it is not within its astrological symbolism. Neither Sun nor Jupiter are dark energies at all, so you can boost them as much as you want, they won´t turn dark, as an isolated aspect.

the square is pumping up their volume but it can only pump up what is within the symbolic range.

The risk or danger with Sun-Jupiter in challenging aspect is not darkness or malice at all, but too much expansive energy. It can expand to a degree that it gets too much.

Of course some people with Sun-Jupiter-square could exhibit dark traits (though we still have to define those), but this not the result of the Sun-Jupiter-square, but of a combination of another aspect, which may be prone to darker manifestations, and then the presence of Sun-Jupiter could magnify what is there. As Jupiter expands what it touches anyway, in squares it really lifts up, and Sun energizes what it touches, so with Sun-Jupiter-squares we have a LOT of energy to deal with.

But like you said in most cases this usually gives an extra dose of optimism, an ebullient sense of humour and the need to expand and have a lot of space to express themselves.

Sometimes it might be a bit overly enthusiastic though, and even overly confident (but other aspects have to confirm that too).

I don´t even think that Juptier on its own deals with religion or philosophy so much as the need to find a meaning in things and a way of expansion of the mental sphere (which of course could be found on these areas, but does not have to).

usually if it means religion or philosophy, we would find a strong link to the 9th house (rulership or tenancy).

posted February 06, 2017 09:34 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Faith:
I think new astrologers don't even realize how much truth there is in natal charts.

So they don't have the same level of respect for meticulous research.

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Yes I agree with you (and with the rest of what you said but I haven't quoted).

posted February 06, 2017 09:34 AM            

My Jupiter is in the 9th house.

I did think Jupiter was "the religion planet" just like the the 9th house is "the religion house." That's inaccurate?

posted February 06, 2017 09:45 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Ceridwen:
Faith,

"With sun square Jupiter, which I have, the pattern does not seem to be that these people are malicious and dark, as alleged here."

The reason for this is that it is not within its astrological symbolism. Neither Sun nor Jupiter are dark energies at all, so you can boost them as much as you want, they won´t turn dark, as an isolated aspect.

the square is pumping up their volume but it can only pump up what is within the symbolic range.

The risk or danger with Sun-Jupiter in challenging aspect is not darkness or malice at all, but too much expansive energy. It can expand to a degree that it gets too much.

Of course some people with Sun-Jupiter-square could exhibit dark traits (though we still have to define those), but this not the result of the Sun-Jupiter-square, but of a combination of another aspect, which may be prone to darker manifestations, and then the presence of Sun-Jupiter could magnify what is there. As Jupiter expands what it touches anyway, in squares it really lifts up, and Sun energizes what it touches, so with Sun-Jupiter-squares we have a LOT of energy to deal with.

But like you said in most cases this usually gives an extra dose of optimism, an ebullient sense of humour and the need to expand and have a lot of space to express themselves.

Sometimes it might be a bit overly enthusiastic though, and even overly confident (but other aspects have to confirm that too).

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posted February 06, 2017 09:45 AM            

Jupiter is mostly about expansion and also about finding meaning in things. (probably the very core symbolism would really just be expansion).

So of course religion, philosophy is not wrong, as this can be a way to find meaning, to expand one´s horizon.

But there are other ways, too.
(for example sometimes Jupiter expans your body, rather than your mind, which is why some people tend to get a bit indulgent with food and therefore increase their weight, when Jupiter-transits are touching their ASC or 1st house planets or ruler or even 2nd house and ruler. Of course not always. - it is an isolated example of course. though for me personally interestingly my greatest weightloss happened with Tr Jupiter in Cancer right around my 8th house cusp and then conjunct my 2nd house ruler Saturn. In this instance Jupiter expanded my ability for restriction).

posted February 06, 2017 09:54 AM            

1. This person has no empathy.

2. This person enjoys hurting others. Normal people may like getting power over others but EMPATHY stops them from brutality, usually. In the case of the person with no empathy, there is nothing stopping them.

3. They have boatloads of empathy for themselves. Hence, they will cry and wail when someone hurts them, but they will have no compunction hurting someone else in the very same manner.

4, This person has NO self reflection i.e insight into themselves. They may appear to have insight into themselves, but it is a shallow show. In reality, they don’t

5. They blame others for what THEY do. This is a psychological defense mechanism. It is the “food choice” of the Malignant Narcissist.

etc.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Venusincap89:
I DON'T GIVE A FUCM IF MY HATRED AGAINST LEELOO AND FAITH CREATES SOME KIND OF KARMA. I WILL ******* CHASE THEM INTO HELL IF I HAVE TO. MARK MY WORDS LEELOO AND FAITH, I DON'T FORGIVE, I DON'T FORGET. I WILL BATTLE YOU GUYS UNTIL MY LAST ******* BREATH. IF YOU OR FAITH WANT A PIECE OF ME I AM IN TORONTO.

Answer: [QUOTE]Originally posted by Ami Anne:
@Venus

I am not bragging but I have leadership roles in which I have to deal with these kinds of people and do it well. I learned these lessons from EXACTLY what YOU are going through. I could never be doing half the things I am without having to go through what you are going through

PS Also, the people who treat others horribly always get karma! ALWAYS

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Venusincap89:
The only thing that can make me feel better right now is some sort of disaster in your house. Or news of you and leeloo getting hit by a car.

Answer: [QUOTE]Originally posted by Ami Anne:
I have to tell you something, Venus. Someone treated me like this and something really bad happened to her. Now, when I am treated like this, I pity the person!

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Venusincap89:
I don't wish to just harm your body. I wish to harm your soul. I wish to harm everything you have and everything you will have or had. As well as Leeloo's.

Answer: [QUOTE]Originally posted by Ami Anne:
People like this will reap what they sow, Venus. Don't let them make YOU do anything or say anything bad.

I understand this might be some kind of cry for help, but I don't think an astrology forum has the ability to deal with this level of need for psychiatric counselling.

I can't stress enough the danger and consequences of condoning internet violence.

This forum is trying to heal after a difficult moment and can't be dragged down into a personal mental health matter.

Of course, this is an important matter we need to discuss: the consequences of condoning, encouraging and cheering for internet violence that includes death threats, threats to bodily harm, hitlists, threats to track down and strike, etc. It would be unwise to assume all people would take this lightly.

But I don't see how this would be the proper forum for that, since there is no astrological marker for psychiatric conditions, and any other suggestion has the potential to create a precedent for false and prejudiced astrology.

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I seem to have loved you in numberless forms...

posted February 06, 2017 10:10 AM            

Mistaken for a misandrist tirade.

posted February 06, 2017 10:13 AM            

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posted February 06, 2017 10:19 AM            

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posted February 06, 2017 10:20 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Ami Anne:
I know people on here fight against rape and women's issues. Well, the Mal Narc rapes the souls of people.

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And you support that.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Venusincap89:
I don't wish to just harm your body. I wish to harm your soul. I wish to harm everything you have and everything you will have or had. As well as Leeloo's.

posted February 06, 2017 10:22 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Ami Anne:
I know people on here fight against rape and women's issues. Well, the Mal Narc rapes the souls of people.

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Your point being...?
You're sounding dangerously close to saying "Oh you people are fighting about rape and such petty things. That's nothing. Look what Mal Narc does."

posted February 06, 2017 10:23 AM            

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posted February 06, 2017 10:26 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Ami Anne:
The Mal Narc DESTROYS the SOULS of people.That is very bad. Also, it is done in a way that people don't SEE it, so people need to be educated.

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