posted September 07, 2020 04:19 AM            

Whenever I get the freedom to do whatever I want I can be myself and excel then everything just goes naturally.

Think of it like Novak Djokvoic kinda of Gemini sun. That man has absolutely no 1%er attitude.

He has fun playing tennis, he's great at it and he can have a little fun making fun of himself.

The man was free to do what he wanted to do and he's nice as a result.

When ever I get that type of freedom to be myself I'm also very nice.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u2plnVfLr_c

I grew up with two Cancer parents that would always put up a fake facade to cover up for there own failings or insecurities.

They would also force me to do the same, or assume there protecting me, rather then just let me be free to do whatever I wanted to do.

My Planets
=========================================
☉‘ ♊, ☽ ♈, ASC ♑, ☿ ♊, ¡÷ ♉, ¡ö ♋ , ♃ ♒, ♄ ♏, ♅ ♐, ♆ ♑

posted September 07, 2020 09:36 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Ayelet:
Values. The search for truth. Being loyal to yourself.
"Being nice" doesn't have to be a facade.
Playing vicious is not necessarily the "true, hidden truth".
There are layers.
What's beneath it all? Go figure that one for yourself.

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I agree. ... But, what if being conditioned to "always be nice" results in the child suppressing the "not nice" behavioural traits that are a part of his/her nature? ... Would that conditioning have done harm?

posted September 07, 2020 10:10 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by DualGemV2:
But...what if its the case of...
If I can be myself then I'm nice.

Whenever I get the freedom to do whatever I want I can be myself and excel then everything just goes naturally.

Think of it like Novak Djokvoic kinda of Gemini sun. That man has absolutely no 1%er attitude.

He has fun playing tennis, he's great at it and he can have a little fun making fun of himself.

The man was free to do what he wanted to do and he's nice as a result.

When ever I get that type of freedom to be myself I'm also very nice.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u2plnVfLr_c

I grew up with two Cancer parents that would always put up a fake facade to cover up for there own failings or insecurities.

They would also force me to do the same, or assume there protecting me, rather then just let me be free to do whatever I wanted to do.

My Planets
=========================================
☉‘ ♊, ☽ ♈, ASC ♑, ☿ ♊, ¡÷ ♉, ¡ö ♋ , ♃ ♒, ♄ ♏, ♅ ♐, ♆ ♑

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posted September 07, 2020 12:09 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Graham:
I agree. ... But, what if being conditioned to "always be nice" results in the child suppressing the "not nice" behavioural traits that are a part of his/her nature? ... Would that conditioning have done harm?

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If the child is raised to suppress his/her feelings, then it's wrong. "Nice" becomes a cover for non-acceptance.

posted September 07, 2020 01:03 PM            

What kind of 'warts' you talkin' about??

posted September 07, 2020 01:31 PM            

What’s about spoil children with tantrums. A school needs to retrain them because the parents were to lazy or kind to not accept their bad behavior.
I saw a boy at 18 y.o. yelling at his mother, and callling her names, and acting like she is betraying him because she wanted to buy him “crappy Toyota” and didn’t want to give him money for “a better car” (luxury one).
I mean parents are ones who most likely to be suffering for allowing kids too much self-expression. The second is a stupid girl who’d fall in love with him,

posted September 07, 2020 03:04 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Librapurr:
A lot of feelings are supposed to be suppressed. Human nature has a lot of darkness. If we let our negative feelings run wild how far can we go?
“Being yourself “ in society is unrealistic delusion. One person's freedom ends where another's begins.
If one’s chart is full of intensity, being self-centered, and lack of self-awareness, It is safe to let this person to be yourself?

What’s about spoil children with tantrums. A school needs to retrain them because the parents were to lazy or kind to not accept their bad behavior.
I saw a boy at 18 y.o. yelling at his mother, and callling her names, and acting like she is betraying him because she wanted to buy him “crappy Toyota” and didn’t want to give him money for “a better car” (luxury one).
I mean parents are ones who most likely to be suffering for allowing kids too much self-expression. The second is a stupid girl who’d fall in love with him,

There are the time and the place for self-expression. Term “Karen” (popular in US now) is another example.

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posted September 07, 2020 06:00 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Ayelet:
Values. The search for truth. Being loyal to yourself.
"Being nice" doesn't have to be a facade.
Playing vicious is not necessarily the "true, hidden truth".
There are layers.
What's beneath it all? Go figure that one for yourself.

---

This is what I’ve always thought.

posted September 07, 2020 06:08 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Librapurr:
A lot of feelings are supposed to be suppressed. Human nature has a lot of darkness. If we let our negative feelings run wild how far can we go?
“Being yourself “ in society is unrealistic delusion. One person's freedom ends where another's begins.
If one’s chart is full of intensity, being self-centered, and lack of self-awareness, It is safe to let this person to be yourself?

What’s about spoil children with tantrums. A school needs to retrain them because the parents were to lazy or kind to not accept their bad behavior.
I saw a boy at 18 y.o. yelling at his mother, and callling her names, and acting like she is betraying him because she wanted to buy him “crappy Toyota” and didn’t want to give him money for “a better car” (luxury one).
I mean parents are ones who most likely to be suffering for allowing kids too much self-expression. The second is a stupid girl who’d fall in love with him,

There are the time and the place for self-expression. Term “Karen” (popular in US now) is another example.

---

posted September 08, 2020 04:09 AM            

quote:

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If the child is raised to suppress his/her feelings, then it's wrong. "Nice" becomes a cover for non-acceptance. ...... What kind of 'warts' you talkin' about?? ...... If we let our negative feelings run wild how far can we go?/There are the time and the place for self-expression. ...... My mother said that she wished she hadn’t taught me to be nice, she wished she’d taught me to fight.

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The most common example of this is probably "openly expressing anger", which tends to be discouraged because it makes others uncomfortable, rather than because it is a psychologically unhealthy thing for the child to do. ... Hence, the parental focus is upon ensuring that the child "fits into" society - an essential requirement for his/her psychological health, but (if done incorrectly) often results in the child suppressing his/her anger (which is psychologically unhealthy).

posted September 08, 2020 07:11 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Ayelet:
If the child is raised to suppress his/her feelings, then it's wrong. "Nice" becomes a cover for non-acceptance.

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In the sample relocation report at http://www.astrologysoftware.com/per/personal_reports/astrocartography.html#0 that same point is being made by stating :-

"Different people are apt to react differently to the same astrological influence. You will feel more comfortable with what you already know, so certain planets will be easier for you to live under than others. For example, if you are a woman with traditional values, Mars and the Sun will possibly pose more problems for you than for a man, since the qualities and life experiences associated with these planets are not usually socially encouraged in women's upbringing. Similarly, men will find the Moon and Venus more challenging. People who tend to follow external authorities and believe in society's order as unchallengeable may find themselves more at home under Jupiter and Saturn lines, and stressed by new experiences under Uranus, Neptune, and Pluto, while individualists and the more self-reliant will reverse these reactions.

You might find it useful to realize that, when faced with challenging astrological potentials, it is sometimes easy to "project" these onto your mate or partner, seeing the emerging parts of your own psyche as things THEY are doing. If your interpretations seem to fit your mate, realize that these things are happening because of possibilities in yourself that you aren't ready to face, and try to develop the positive sides of the astrological potentials described."
_________________________________________________________________

posted September 08, 2020 11:47 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Librapurr:
A lot of feelings are supposed to be suppressed. Human nature has a lot of darkness. If we let our negative feelings run wild how far can we go?
“Being yourself “ in society is unrealistic delusion. One person's freedom ends where another's begins.
If one’s chart is full of intensity, being self-centered, and lack of self-awareness, It is safe to let this person to be yourself?

What’s about spoil children with tantrums. A school needs to retrain them because the parents were to lazy or kind to not accept their bad behavior.
I saw a boy at 18 y.o. yelling at his mother, and callling her names, and acting like she is betraying him because she wanted to buy him “crappy Toyota” and didn’t want to give him money for “a better car” (luxury one).
I mean parents are ones who most likely to be suffering for allowing kids too much self-expression. The second is a stupid girl who’d fall in love with him,

There are the time and the place for self-expression. Term “Karen” (popular in US now) is another example.

---

I agree that the child should be guided towards embracing his/her "unacceptable" behavioural traits in a way that is socially acceptable.

However ... is that possible if his/her adult guides have suppressed those behavioural traits in themselves?

For example ... the first stage of sharing is "this is MY toy, and I do not care that others want to play with it" ... and the third stage is "this is MY toy, which I allow others to play with because my parent says I should/must - BUT, I will express my feeling that I am unhappy about having to do so." ... If the parent has never embraced stage 3 himself/herself, will he/she not consider the child's honestly expressed feelings to also be 'unacceptable"?

posted September 08, 2020 11:49 AM            

I have trouble staying quiet, if something bothers me enough, and that’s why I have no relationship with a member of my family. I couldn’t hold onto a boundary, and keep our relationship - she made the choice, not me. I have my sun in Aries. I don’t like arguing, but after getting dragged into enough situations, I’m used to it, and less likely to back down. Even before, I could not keep quiet if I was upset enough - I once argued with a teacher, after she yelled at me out of nowhere.

posted September 08, 2020 12:11 PM            

quote:

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I usually realize when I’m projecting, and say so.

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quote:

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If someone projects into me, I might say something, or I might leave it.

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posted September 08, 2020 12:29 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Graham:
Originally posted by teasel :

[QUOTE][b]I usually realize when I’m projecting, and say so.

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quote:

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If someone projects into me, I might say something, or I might leave it.

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It isn’t always projection, it’s more like I’ll be saying something and then think, “oh, I need to hear this, too!”

posted September 08, 2020 01:57 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Graham:
I agree that the child should be guided towards embracing his/her "unacceptable" behavioural traits in a way that is socially acceptable.

However ... is that possible if his/her adult guides have suppressed those behavioural traits in themselves?

For example ... the first stage of sharing is "this is [b]MY toy, and I do not care that others want to play with it" ... and the third stage is "this is MY toy, which I allow others to play with because my parent says I should/must - BUT, I will express my feeling that I am unhappy about having to do so." ... If the parent has never embraced stage 3 himself/herself, will he/she not consider the child's honestly expressed feelings to also be 'unacceptable"?

And ... what might be the effect if a child's natal promise is to achieve (say) stage 7 of the behavioural trait of "sharing" but is being guided by a parent who has not developed beyond stage 2?[/B]

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Parents are the reason for anger and emotional damages plenty of time. It’s such a hard job to do it right. It should be required to take parenting classes. If they don’t teach a child to share and accept expression of anger, eventually, he needs to learn the hard way. Perhaps, he would not understand why nobody wants to accept his unacceptable behavior/ be friends with him and develop anger about it. Life often gives us lessons what we were failed to learn as children, but we might not recognize and take it correctly.
What’d be stage 7 of the behavioural trait?

quote:

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Originally posted by Ayelet:
I agree. I will add: you cannot make a picture without the right proportion between light and shade. What is the right proportion, though? I guess it depends on your own experience.
Educating... allowing... punishing...
(The approach today is not "punishing" but "setting limits"... Saturn used to be a malefic. But this is a Light age..)

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posted September 08, 2020 02:30 PM            

Learning to be polite, respectful, and considerate of others is not weakness, nor does it need to go so far as compromise your sense of self.

The real problem is worrying about what others 'might think' (or say) about you; or being so averse to conflict that you just avoid the friction of disagreement, therefore never learning how to navigate it.

How about being nice to yourself?

I know "nice" is derided these days (as in George Carlin's comedy/social commentary about "nice people"), but a lot of people -- a shocking portion of the U.S. population -- are self-loathing. Start with being nice to yourself -- ultimately self-accepting, no matter what it takes to achieve this.

I'm someone who experienced that, then somehow slowly over the last decade or so drifted from it. I'm having to do some serious self-inventory and regain compassion, which is for self and others simultaneously. You can separate them. Genuine compassion for self results in compassion for others, and vice versa.

So parents who have never really experienced or known compassion cannot pass it on to their children.

posted September 08, 2020 03:31 PM            

I see people as like the rest of nature, both beautiful and horrifying, comforting and terrifying: capable of aching beauty and self-sacrifice, and terrifying in their cruelty and sacrifice of others. Few (if any) people truly belong in one camp or another. They're filled with it all, and all of it is natural, it's what they act on, and more importantly why they act on it, that determines the kind of person they are...and they can be one way with one person and something else to another, just as they can be one thing one day and the complete opposite the next day.

Now an inflated sense of entitlement (which is learned more than ingrained) strikes me as much more problematic (which can mix with anger, bitterness, envy, and the like).

There's also a difference between using one's emotions to gain strength and take action vs being a slave to one's emotions to act out like an undisciplined child (which some people can do well into their elder years--strange, given that plenty of kids can show more maturity and compassion than the average adult, and not just when adult eyes are upon them).

Naturally, there are people who will take advantage of foolish niceness that is fear-based (at least socially expected) rather than genuine (just as they exploit guilt and the like in a sordid, manipulative way, exploiting the vulnerability). I personally have no compassion for them and won't pretend otherwise.