posted December 06, 2012 12:31 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by katatonic:
well i came here for a few minutes - and want to thank ami anne for demonstrating why i don't need to come here any more.

ami enjoy your spiteful life.

i understand - as i am my own business - taxes too. i may not be a finance whizz kid but i'm not a wage slave either, and i make a lot less than ian does. he doesn't have to live in new york city if he is willing to commute...so the high cost of living in the most expensive place in the country doesn't really make me weep. sorry bout that!

but the raises in taxes on the highest earners are only on what comes AFTER 250K or whatever line they end up drawing...and it leaves a lot more, as ian admits, than what most middle class families have to live on even in podunk.

the richest people in the world understand the ethics of GIVING BACK< PAYING FORWARD, and not whining about the cost of their good fortune.

merry christmas to you all and may scrooge be awakened before congress recesses.

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Passion, Lust, Desire. Check out my journal

posted December 06, 2012 02:47 PM            

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I have a DO NOT DISTURB sign on my imagination

The moment I cease to seek the truth, or settle for the truth in the moment ... that is the moment I cease to be a seeker, and become a fundamentalist instead.

posted December 06, 2012 05:20 PM            

Maybe the difference is that Bill Gates is a college drop out. And he still had the good sense to invite Warren Buffet over to sample his Mother's cooking ... thereby starting a long friendship which inspired Warren Buffet to contribute 2 billion to the Gates' Charitable Foundation.

My point being ... surely you're not comparing yourself to Bill Gates! He's a college dropout. You apparently are not.

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I have a DO NOT DISTURB sign on my imagination

The moment I cease to seek the truth, or settle for the truth in the moment ... that is the moment I cease to be a seeker, and become a fundamentalist instead.

posted December 06, 2012 05:25 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by YoursTrulyAlways:
That's real fresh.

So Bill and Melinda Gates' $35 billion charitable contribution is meaningless.

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Some people just want to cause trouble, Ian. Don't give them the satisfaction

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Passion, Lust, Desire. Check out my journal

posted December 06, 2012 05:31 PM            

There are other ways as well, I understand you can even write off some federal taxes by paying state taxes. Parents with dependents get even more write offs. And, of course, there are business expenses that can further reduce the tax obligation even further.

Of course the wealthy have the best tax lawyers money can buy, and the lawyers save their clients enough money to be worth the pay those lawyers get. Some lawyers even go selling themselves to the wealthy promising them the more they make the less they have to pay (with their help).

And then I think we've all seen those TV ads for lawyers who promise tax cheaters of any income bracket on how to get away with it.

It's such that I'm surprised our big businesses even bother with offshore accounts and other dodgy practices. Maybe it just feels good to bolster foreign economies that allow them to work their citizens without a union and well below minimum wage.

Finally, the part we're not hearing about is how much money the wealthy get at the expense of the rest of us. Not just in bailouts or supporting a system that generally won't prosecute them in any meaningful way while busting skulls of the Black Bloc that bust out their windows covered by insurance anyway (though that's significant all by itself), but in examples like these that go on for pages:
http://reason.com/archives/2004/03/01/confessions-of-a-welfare-queen

quote:

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Law grinds the poor, and rich men rule the law --Oliver Goldsmith

Ronald Reagan memorably complained about "welfare queens," but he never told us the biggest welfare queens are already wealthy. Their lobbyists fawn over politicians, giving them little bits of money...<snip>...in exchange for huge chunks of the taxpayers' money

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Reminds me of what a pirate said about the difference between pirates and big business/government types:

"They vilify us, the Scoundrels do, when there is only this Difference, they rob the Poor under the Cover of Law, forsooth, and we plunder the Rich under the Protection of our own Courage."

posted December 08, 2012 01:40 PM            

once again, people (in this case customers) have the power. time for the "job creators" to realize that scrooge will never be popular amongst the general public. and for the political poodles of said "job creators" to realize that BOTH sides of the coin are essential to each other.

until we have robots to do everything, and i really don't think that will ever happen, the bosses are nothing without workers. however the workers can always look around and find something to do to make themselves useful...

so while obamacare may create a TEMPORARY dip in profits due to increased overhead, it will iron out eventually and refusing to go along will be a much worse outcome, ie NO BUSINESS!

posted December 09, 2012 10:01 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Randall:
No, the companies are the job creators.

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Oy Vey

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Passion, Lust, Desire. Check out my journal

posted December 11, 2012 04:48 PM            

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Passion, Lust, Desire. Check out my journal

posted December 11, 2012 09:24 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Randall:
Generally speaking, a business will only rise to meet the needs in the market place. Find a need and fill it. Or better yet, create a need and fill it. Yes, the customer is vital, but it is the business owner who takes the risk to bring the product or service to the customer pool.

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Totally. Life 101 which is a nuclear bomb to these people

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Passion, Lust, Desire. Check out my journal

posted December 11, 2012 11:13 PM            

so unless you can convince people they need what you are selling, all the capital in the world won't create jobs or profits.

hence the shenanigans of the advertising business "creating need" where often there really is none. this is a short-lived victory though, if your workers churn out a shite product/service.

yes there's a sucker born every minute but most suckers get wise after awhile, and hardly any of them will work for nothing. if you don't pay your workers sooner or later they will quit or revolt.

posted December 12, 2012 02:07 PM            

quote:

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It is the providers of jobs who find needs and then take the risks to create businesses to fill them.

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"Needs" is another word for demand, which is defined primarily by consumers, not business.

quote:

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Generally speaking, a business will only rise to meet the needs in the market place. Find a need and fill it. Or better yet, create a need and fill it. Yes, the customer is vital, but it is the business owner who takes the risk to bring the product or service to the customer pool.

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Once again with "need"s.

posted December 12, 2012 05:19 PM            

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Passion, Lust, Desire. Check out my journal

posted December 18, 2012 01:47 PM            

You guys seem to get it in your head that because Kat speaks loosely that there must always be something wrong with her message. There wasn't in this case. Demand, i.e. consumers, are the defining factor in job creation. That IS reality.

What is also reality is that you don't have an adequate answer for me. If you did, you'd have posited it before. Instead, you grabbed on to Randall's coattails as Randall was himself floundering to get out from under his own poor attempt at argument.

posted December 19, 2012 11:38 AM            

What you've said doesn't discount the fact that demand creates jobs. The person that takes the risk to provide the product is responding to demand, right? And by deciding to create the product, they've given themselves a job. The maxim doesn't change simply because you'd like to think that things are different than they are. In fact, I'm pretty certain (99%) that at some level you understand my point very well. These are the simplest terms.