posted January 03, 2013 12:41 PM            

Tucked inside the last-minute fiscal cliff package were more than a dozen tax loopholes, many of which will benefit Wall Street financial firms and some of the nation's biggest corporations. These breaks will cost billions of dollars in the coming year, underscoring the lobbying power of corporate interests.

The deal was less kind to the middle class. Congress permitted a cut in the payroll tax to expire, meaning that the tax burden for the average worker will increase about $1,000 in 2013.

"This shows that the lobbyists are able to get what they want even when everyone else is starving," said Phineas Baxandall, senior analyst for tax and budget policy at the U.S. Public Interest Research Group. "It also shows they are best able to get what they want when no one else is paying attention."

The corporate loopholes were part of a package of so-called tax extenders tacked onto the main bill. The extenders package, first approved by the Senate in early August, mixes popular benefits, like a deduction for teachers who buy classroom supplies, with corporate-friendly carve-outs, such as the "active financing" exception that permits businesses earning interest on overseas lending to defer U.S. taxes on that income indefinitely. There is even a tax break for construction of new racetracks.

The tax extenders were passed for only one year, and they still need to clear another potential hurdle: upcoming negotiations over mandated spending cuts and the debt ceiling. President Barack Obama and congressional leaders have indicated they'd like to see a "grand bargain" on taxes, which would feature lower overall rates but close a slew of loopholes.

posted January 03, 2013 01:40 PM            

personally i think a 5% hike in their main income taxation is pretty reasonable and leaves them no less untouched than everyone else. and brings in a nice few pennies too. it would be ludicrous to try to raise money from these folk through income taxes since they don't claim much "income".

posted January 07, 2013 08:03 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by katatonic:
so lobby your reps already to do something about it. there is plenty of room for repeal and rewrite.

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The reps don't listen to us, kat.

They KNOW we all get screwed over by corporate welfare, but that's who they serve. No amount of lobbying from regular people will pry them from their masters.

posted January 07, 2013 08:16 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by katatonic:
so lobby your reps already to do something about it. there is plenty of room for repeal and rewrite.

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Urrgg
This is the reason our country is in the shape it is in
If more than 50% of the people think like this, we are done( and we are)

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Passion, Lust, Desire. Check out my journal

posted January 07, 2013 01:32 PM            

When in recent years have you seen the system working? You can't use a machine that doesn't work. I mean the system of representative government...when have we been represented?

When Congress passes bills it doesn't read, like this Fiscal Cliff bill they had three minutes to glance at before the vote?

How much did calling our Reps help in that situation?

Not at all.

I think in order for change to occur, it has to be social change that circumvents this dysfunctional, crooked government as much as possible.

posted January 07, 2013 02:25 PM            

This is unconscionable for the younger folks and the admin staff that have a combined family income under the $117K SS limit. Secretaries making $60K a year do not need to have less take home pay in the middle of a recessionary environment.

I thought ObamaCare was supposed to make things cheaper. Why are medical insurance premiums up 25% this year for everyone?

Folks like myself don't have large enough capital gains to worry about the 5% increase. I guess those who sit at home and day trade have to worry. I earn a paycheck, not earn my money from financial market speculation.

posted January 07, 2013 02:54 PM            

as to obamacare and rising premiums, when the exchanges kick in and create competition the insurance companies will have to join the price war. in the meantime they are milking us for everything they can get...in britain the cost of healthcare for everyone is about $250 per month. if you want you can pay more and go to private insurance cos. if you calculate that around half, like here, are contributing little to nothing, that means that the wealthiest are chipping in $500 month to keep healthcare available to everyone including themselves. this is a helluva lot better than what most average insurance policies cost here and now.

@faith, i actually share your distaste for the system. however as long as the states are as crazy as they are the feds have to be a balancing act. as long as the corporations try to take COMPLETE control, the feds have to be there to knock them back.

because we cannot do ANYthing about corporate rules and their machinations. and the states are in many cases worse than the feds. especially in localized elections, votes DO count. but if the voter doesn't educate themselves they will always vote for whomever appeals to them on whatever shallow level grabs them. they will not look to see what the elected are doing, they can't be bothered on a day to day basis.

if you are suggesting wholesale revamping of the system, i hope you are happy with wholesale chaos in the interim...

posted January 07, 2013 04:30 PM            

i don't believe it is true that no one in congress is there to represent their people. but politics is a game...you give me some of what i need, i'll do the same for you. and so it has ever been.

this is why kennedy was such a glaring MARK. he used the system to get in, as has pretty much everyone, and then he turned around and defied the very people who put him there, mob and machine alike...

using jfk as an example again, the entrenched members of washington - hoover stands out - did not like what he was trying to do, considered him and his brothers to be communists. so hoover is a BIG suspect in engineering the death of two kennedys and the reputation of a third. i have never had trouble with the idea that the car that drove off chappaquidick bridge was monkeyed with...nor that kennedy was supposed to die as well.

but their is corruption everywhere there is power. as we saw when the czars were overthrown in russia, the replacements are seldom any better than what they replace.

posted January 07, 2013 04:34 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Faith:
^ Kat,

When in recent years have you seen the system working? You can't use a machine that doesn't work. I mean the system of representative government...when have we been represented?

When Congress passes bills it doesn't read, like this Fiscal Cliff bill they had three minutes to glance at before the vote?

How much did calling our Reps help in that situation?

Not at all.

I think in order for change to occur, it has to be social change that circumvents this dysfunctional, crooked government as much as possible.

---

Could not have said it better, if I said it myself

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Passion, Lust, Desire. Check out my journal

posted January 07, 2013 04:36 PM            

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Passion, Lust, Desire. Check out my journal

posted January 07, 2013 04:40 PM            

but i think anyone who thinks "states' rights" is the answer should look at the seriously corrupt state governments before they go down that road.

and NOW, with a new congress sitting, is the time to lobby for the eradication of the things that corrupt bills like this.

it's not enough to whine about the dumb folk and write off the future.

posted January 08, 2013 01:41 PM            

the president is one small part of the equation and congress has to pass pretty much all of his appointments, as you may know...

romney on the other hand has GUIDED MONSANTO to its current position. i am relieved that this virtual employee of theirs is NOT in the white house.

we have a long way to go but housecleaning is generally one step at a time. painfully slow!

posted January 08, 2013 01:49 PM            

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Passion, Lust, Desire. Check out my journal

posted January 08, 2013 01:51 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by katatonic:
i guarantee you if the public were involved enough and on their case enough, things would change. people vote and then go back to their routine, never asking where their vote is working for or against them..

but i think anyone who thinks "states' rights" is the answer should look at the seriously corrupt state governments before they go down that road.

and NOW, with a new congress sitting, is the time to lobby for the eradication of the things that corrupt bills like this.

it's not enough to whine about the dumb folk and write off the future.

i am very interested in HOW you envision effecting change? through history it has mostly been down to working outside the law/box...hence the IRS fixation on "underreporting" etc.

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It is over. This country has hit critical mass. We will never come back. Watch yourself and see Obama's power grab for a 3rd term. There are bills that make it ILLEGAL to use free speech against people you don't like i.e. Muslims. The only variable is HOW fast we go down. It is over, Kat. You will realize it, one of these days.

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Passion, Lust, Desire. Check out my journal

posted January 08, 2013 01:55 PM            

have you registered your disapproval of monsanto's GE salmon with the FDA? there are still 50 days to do so.

the trouble with throwing up your hands and saying "it won't make any difference" is that YOU are the ones stifling your own voices. WHILE WE STILL HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY it is up to us to exercise the VIGILANCE that makes FREEDOM possible.

posted January 08, 2013 02:15 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by katatonic:
i would love to see where you get your info to back up that statement in any case, ami.

have you registered your disapproval of monsanto's GE salmon with the FDA? there are still 50 days to do so.

the trouble with throwing up your hands and saying "it won't make any difference" is that YOU are the ones stifling your own voices. WHILE WE STILL HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY it is up to us to exercise the VIGILANCE that makes FREEDOM possible.

just sitting around whining about how evil THEY are gives THEM all the power!

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If you think the FDA is going to listen to you, I have a song for you.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KThlYHfIVa8

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Passion, Lust, Desire. Check out my journal

posted January 08, 2013 02:50 PM            

there is a very OLD saying. no matter who you vote for, the government gets in. it is true for the most part. but it is not new.

the continued progress of monsanto will go nowhere because more and more countries will refuse to buy food exports from us. india is the latest to ban GMOS and insist on labelling, which, by the way, is required on all EXPORTED food from the usa. so it is not even a stretch for them to do it here at home too.

a change is coming, ami. don't lose heart. it may not be exactly the way you want it, but it will be for the better.

posted January 08, 2013 03:05 PM            

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Passion, Lust, Desire. Check out my journal

posted January 09, 2013 01:15 PM            

yes plenty of elections are swung and outright stolen, but that is largely because we the people choose not to do anything about it - because "it's no use"

that said, it is more than possible things have to get worse STILL before people get so fed up they actually DO do something. or emigrate, as people did in droves in germany in the thirties.

but before you do anything you have to understand that the corporate manipulation of the govt is what is ruining the "free" market and eroding your rights. obama is far from a socialist - if you look at who he has around them, he has a lot of corporatist minders - but as long as people support the right of corporations to buy states and washington, ie, deregulate everything and get rid of taxes? it will continue.