posted January 08, 2013 10:55 PM            

especially for those who think the OCCUPY folk are obama's darlings and FREEDOM WORKS (hannity and his koch bro backers et al) are considered the enemy,,,

Shannon McLeish of Florida is a 45-year-old married mother of two young children. She is a homeowner, a taxpayer and a safe driver. She votes in every election. She attends a Unitarian Universalist church on Sundays. She is also, like nearly all who have a relationship with the Occupy movement in the United States, being monitored by the federal government. She knows this because when she read FBI documents obtained by the Partnership for Civil Justice Fund (PCJF) through the Freedom of Information Act, she was startled to see a redaction that could only be referring to her. McLeish’s story is the story of hundreds of thousands of people—perhaps more—whose lives are being invaded by the state. It is the story of a security and surveillance apparatus—overseen by the executive branch under Barack Obama—that has empowered the FBI and the Department of Homeland Security to silence the voices and obstruct the activity of citizens who question corporate power.

Mara Verheyden-Hilliard, executive director of the PCJF, said in a written statement about the released files: “This production [of information], which we believe is just the tip of the iceberg, is a window into the nationwide scope of the FBI’s surveillance, monitoring, and reporting on peaceful protesters organizing with the Occupy movement. These documents show that the FBI and the Department of Homeland Security are treating protests against the corporate and banking structure of America as potential criminal and terrorist activity. These documents also show these federal agencies functioning as a de facto intelligence arm of Wall Street and Corporate America.”

The FBI documents are not only a chilling example of how widespread this surveillance and obstruction has become, they are an explicit warning by the security services to all who consider dissent. Anyone who defies corporate power, even if he or she is nonviolent and acting within constitutional rights, is a suspect. These documents are part of the plan to make us fearful, compliant and disempowered. They mark, I suspect, a government attempt to end peaceful mass protests by responding with repression to the grievances of Americans. When the corporate-financed group FreedomWorks bused in goons to disrupt Democratic candidates’ town hall meetings about the federal health care legislation in August 2009, Eric Zuesse of the Business Insider notes, “there was no FBI surveillance of those corporate-organized disruptions of legitimate democratic processes. There also were no subsequent FreedomWorks applications for Freedom of Information Act releases of FBI files regarding such surveillance being used against them—because there was no such FBI campaign against them.”

The combination of intimidation tactics by right-wing fringe groups, which speak in the language of violence and hate, with the state’s massive intrusion into the personal affairs of the citizen is corporate fascism. And we are much farther down that road than many of us care to admit.

“When activists took up relatively long-term residence in Zuccotti Park in New York City on Sept. 17 [in 2011], their message of outrage was a mirror to my own after we bailed out the banks with our tax dollars, then watched them get off scot-free without even a token attempt to help fix the wreckage they’d created,” McLeish told me over the phone when I called her home. “I personally lost considerable income and my retirement with the economic collapse, as well as more than half the value of my home. I could see the people around me struggling, too. I have friends, neighbors and family members that the banks refused to help, who lost their homes or were forced to pay for costly attorneys to defend themselves against fraudulent foreclosure attempts. People couldn’t sell their homes, as they were worth so much less than what they’d paid for them. Homes all over the area, including in my neighborhood right near the downtown [of Ormond Beach, Fla.], were abandoned due to the foreclosure crisis—and left to rot by the banks. Strip malls were emptied as businesses went bankrupt and closed their doors. More and more homeless people were wandering through the neighborhood—people you could tell had never been homeless, just by virtue of what and how much they carried with them. Families were sleeping behind big-box stores, and my area was featured on national news repeatedly for the number of homeless families.”

“These are some of the things that prompted me to create a Facebook page for Occupy in my area in solidarity with the courageous activists camping in Zuccotti—the only group to fully give voice to what I saw as the issue: the corruption of pretty much everything from the economy to the environment to our social safety nets to our democratic system of governance due to corporate greed,” she said. “The message of OWS [Occupy Wall Street] resonated deeply and moved me to action.”

The FBI documents obtained by the PCJF show that government security services began to monitor the activities of Occupy activists before the Zuccotti Park encampment was established. They revealed that when McLeish met with about 40 other activists in Daytona Beach, Fla., several undercover law enforcement officers were present. ..

posted January 09, 2013 09:59 AM            

I always wondered if I was on a watch list as well... for different reasons. My rather high profile Muslim Friend and I chat often via internet or phone and we know how subversive they all are

posted January 09, 2013 09:26 PM            

I also think the Watch Lists are swelling more and more all the time. My husband once talked to a guy who got put on the No Fly list for telling Dick Cheney in person that he took issue with his foreign policy.

Restricting travel is one of the hallmarks of a closed society.

I'm actually getting a bit paranoid, to be honest, about the walls they are erecting on either side of all major highways in my area. It'd be very easy to corral people by stopping traffic in one of the those lanes. With TSA VIPR teams coming out in increasing numbers, those walls will prevent anyone from opting out of a grope-down.

Big question is, what's it leading toward? The lists, the "security" everywhere, the walls...

posted January 09, 2013 09:39 PM            

The point of free speech is that it is FREE

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posted January 10, 2013 12:31 AM            

i realize this surveillance thing is getting scary. that is what the article is about..the intention being to keep people afraid to say their piece. so if you get too paranoid they have won.

don't fool yourself that they haven't been at this for-bloody-ever.

both sides think THEY are the target and the other is against them. this is ALSO the desired effect.

we can't afford to let them divide our house or scare us into being rabbits. as my mother in law said years ago "the worst thing is you don't KNOW who the enemy is" and that is true now too. we can see the FBI snooping but not their ultimate aims.

posted January 10, 2013 08:48 AM            

I can't make much sense of your comment.

Actually, I am both paranoid and vocal. It's possible, you know?

posted January 10, 2013 09:01 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by katatonic:
he didn't say we can't ALLOW it though, did he? is he not entitled to HIS opinion ami? and your paraphrase is taking a remark and running with it

i realize this surveillance thing is getting scary. that is what the article is about..the intention being to keep people afraid to say their piece. so if you get too paranoid they have won.

don't fool yourself that they haven't been at this for-bloody-ever.

both sides think THEY are the target and the other is against them. this is ALSO the desired effect.

we can't afford to let them divide our house or scare us into being rabbits. as my mother in law said years ago "the worst thing is you don't KNOW who the enemy is" and that is true now too. we can see the FBI snooping but not their ultimate aims.

and please don't read that as my endorsement of the FBI, HS or any of the others.

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Kat, once Obama grabs the guns, it is over. Wake up, the boiling water has almost reached your neck. You and the other dumbed down people celebrating when Obama won. Wait until he gets the guns. Then, you will see the his true face. (The lie was that it MATTERED that he was black. It mattered who he was, as a person, as MLK said) Then, none of you will be celebrating.

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posted January 10, 2013 09:27 AM            

quote:

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Obama said that this time in history was not for those who talked badly about Mohammud or something like that.

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"or something like that"
covers the inane sentence.

Faith being vigilant and paranoid seem the same at times but I think vigilance is a smart thing

posted January 10, 2013 11:39 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by juniperb:
balderdash Ami Anne . It may be YOUR guns he wants but he promised to leave mine alone. Oh and I get to choose 12 others to keep theirs.
"or something like that"
covers the inane sentence.

Faith being vigilant and paranoid seem the same at times but I think vigilance is a smart thing

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Juni. Then, YOU will be an outlaw and THAT WILL BE THE POINT

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posted January 10, 2013 11:40 AM            

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posted January 10, 2013 11:48 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Ami Anne:

Juni. Then, YOU will be an outlaw and THAT WILL BE THE POINT

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No I won`t because any arms I have will / are not assault weapons. There is a huge difference and few are getting the distinction between what is being considered for control and what is not and has never been controled. You`re throwing the baby out with the bath water.

posted January 10, 2013 01:17 PM            

@faith, the "both sides" should have been in quotes, sorry. the tea partiers and the occupiers alike are convinced that THEY are being singled out for martyrdom. this keeps people divided. just like limbaugh who asserts that HE is the only media person who has the brains to see the TRUTH, so many people are convinced that it is only they and their friends who are being spied on. not true. we are all spied on and have been for ages. it just gets worse and worse.

govts come and go.i am more concerned with a) the protection of the freedom of food supply and choice and b) the prevention of total overrun of the planet by pollution and c)the corporations who meddle in govt.

yes, ami, i am glad obama won. i am not a hero-worshipper but i prefer someone who feels he has to throw a bone to big money to someone who nurtured big money and monsanto in particular for decades. corruption is. but we the people have some say in what the govt does and can override it if we keep at it, whereas we have NO say in what the board of a corporation decides unless we are shareholders..

there is a similarity between the public and the shareholders, though. both seem to prefer to let the guys at the top do all the deciding as long as their pockets are full enough. as long as profit is the bottom line, and the middle AND the top, it will stay so.

i am encouraged by the departure of geithner from the dept of treasury, and the introduction of a defense secretary who is not in the pocket of israel OR iran, and recognizes that fighting has not solved the palestine problem one whit.

posted January 10, 2013 01:43 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by pire:
people in europe are free and they don't own weapons

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Is Britain Europe?

They are becoming a total police state.

And..

quote:

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Though it may pale in comparison to America's 88.8 registered weapons per hundred people, the rate of gun ownership in Europe is higher than one might imagine. In Switzerland there are 45.7 guns per hundred people; in Finland, 45.3; France's 31.2 is a little higher than Germany's 30.3. The U.K., which banned most gun ownership after two massacres, has a rate of 6.2 registered guns per 100 people.

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posted January 10, 2013 02:00 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by juniperb:
No I won`t because any arms I have will / are not assault weapons. There is a huge difference and few are getting the distinction between what is being considered for control and what is not and has never been controled. You`re throwing the baby out with the bath water.

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First, they come for the gays, but I don't care because I am not gay. Then, they come for the Jews, but I don't care because I am not Jewish. Then, they come for the Catholics, but I don't care because I am not Catholic. Then, they came for me and I had no one to help me.

This applies to levels of guns, too.

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posted January 10, 2013 02:08 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by katatonic:
pire

@faith, the "both sides" should have been in quotes, sorry. the tea partiers and the occupiers alike are convinced that THEY are being singled out for martyrdom. this keeps people divided. just like limbaugh who asserts that HE is the only media person who has the brains to see the TRUTH, so many people are convinced that it is only they and their friends who are being spied on. not true. we are all spied on and have been for ages. it just gets worse and worse.

govts come and go.i am more concerned with a) the protection of the freedom of food supply and choice and b) the prevention of total overrun of the planet by pollution and c)the corporations who meddle in govt.

yes, ami, i am glad obama won. i am not a hero-worshipper but i prefer someone who feels he has to throw a bone to big money to someone who nurtured big money and monsanto in particular for decades. corruption is. but we the people have some say in what the govt does and can override it if we keep at it, whereas we have NO say in what the board of a corporation decides unless we are shareholders..

there is a similarity between the public and the shareholders, though. both seem to prefer to let the guys at the top do all the deciding as long as their pockets are full enough. as long as profit is the bottom line, and the middle AND the top, it will stay so.

i am encouraged by the departure of geithner from the dept of treasury, and the introduction of a defense secretary who is not in the pocket of israel OR iran, and recognizes that fighting has not solved the palestine problem one whit.

but it's funny how the source you listen to shapes your thoughts. this morning rush was panning obama for the lack of coloured and female cabinet members...he seems already to have forgotten that obama's first pick for sec of state was susan rice, and the republicans tried to crucify her. another instance of blaming the president (any president) for what congress has created.

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I will praise Obama to the hilts if he gets out of bed with Monsanto. It won't happen. Big money and power like Monsanto lets NO ONE out. Someone will be killed first.

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posted January 13, 2013 11:58 AM            

Now, how did i miss THIS? Ami you are saying the same thing as me? So you DO understand it is not a matter of an easy choice to just say no...and yet you prefer to sit and diss obama and not the tangled mess of politics...tothe point where you voted for the man who GUIDED monsanto from a rightful position of public censure (for creating agent orange and other, domestic, pesticides to the position they are in today? Please explain how that makes sense?

posted January 13, 2013 12:30 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by katatonic:
WOWWW

Now, how did i miss THIS? Ami you are saying the same thing as me? So you DO understand it is not a matter of an easy choice to just say no...and yet you prefer to sit and diss obama and not the tangled mess of politics...tothe point where you voted for the man who GUIDED monsanto from a rightful position of public censure (for creating agent orange and other, domestic, pesticides to the position they are in today? Please explain how that makes sense?

Would it not be more productive to join the people trying to lobby against monsanto? There are millions and growing daily you know..

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I do a lot against Monsanto as far as sign petitions and post a lot on my FB page for my website. I support only Non Gmo food and won't buy cans until I know they are non GMO like Amy, Hains and Imagine. I am a RABID Anti Monsanto person but they must have bought out Ca, because the "people" voted that they did NOT want labeling of GMOs. That one action showed me that it is over, I think.

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posted January 13, 2013 01:22 PM            

I guess some people think he should make that kind of noble Gesture but as i keep saying a dead prez only serves to demoralize people even more.

posted January 13, 2013 01:47 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by katatonic:
The cali vote did reflect how advertising can sway people but as in the case of prop 8, that is the time to DOUBLE our efforts. But this is what i mean when i say there's no use blaming the president...he is only as strong as the support he gets. As you obviously can see despite his apparent power he is also much more vulnerable to strongarm tactics than WE the combined people. It's also why i prefer to vote for someone who went directly TO the people for small donations rather than rely on a few Bigmoneymen like Romney. He is way far from perfect but i think he is trying to work around these guys...but unless he wants to get himself offed it is impossible for him to try to change it by himself.

I guess some people think he should make that kind of noble Gesture but as i keep saying a dead prez only serves to demoralize people even more.

It.s never ovrr til it's over, ami

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This is why I think it is. Everyone( or most everyone) has secrets. Judge Roberts had something in which he was blackmailed. Maybe, he was a cross dresser. Maybe, he had a homosexual fling/ affair, whatever. He was strong armed to make that inane Supreme Court ruling. There is no other explanation. Obama et al use thug tactics. Very few people will be threatened with public humiliation and not cave. Then, there are the many dead people such as Breitbart, who stood up like a warrior. Obama is in bed with Montsanto. Monsanto is super, super powerful. It is like going against Marlon Brando in the Godfather. You have your horse head in bed next to you and you give in.

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posted January 13, 2013 02:39 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by katatonic:
And that's why we the many are necessary. Even unarmed we are too numerous tp exterminate ..not that it hasn't been tried or won't be again. Europe and India are fighting back we can too! You are right to use your pocketbook as a weapon..u see if there are no consumers the self-chosen providers die too..it's easy to off a prez or discredit a senator(i'm thinking chappaquidick here) but slaughter yoit market and you commit suicide

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NO Unarmed citizenry WILL be exterminated. Was over 6,000,000 too much for Hitler? Arms are THE answer. We can never let Obama et al take away our guns. Once that happens, we are doomed.

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