posted February 18, 2021 11:52 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Randall:
He was a hardcore liberal for 30 years. He stormed the Capitol. What’s not true?

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posted February 20, 2021 04:03 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Randall:
He was a hardcore liberal for 30 years. He stormed the Capitol. What’s not true?

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What's not true is the position that he still supported the democrats when he went to the Capitol. The article clearly states that his allegiance switched. I agree with Teasel here, the title is misleading.

posted February 20, 2021 05:55 PM            

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Originally posted by shura:
I think the more interesting story here is what compelled him to switch allegiance? What drove him out of the DNC?

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posted February 20, 2021 06:45 PM            

If the DNC moves Left, will it lose its center Left members? Where will those disgruntled voters go? Realistically most won't pinball from center left to hard right. Or will they? What's left for them?

posted February 21, 2021 06:53 AM            

And ... few can deny that the Democrats are increasingly becoming an extremist political party.

posted February 21, 2021 07:31 AM            

The extremist groups in both Parties are a threat to the survival of democracy in western societies ... with each insisting on their "right" to protest, and neither exercising their "obligation" to do so responsibly.

Wake up, people of the USA ... before you sleep-walk into the situation that the very liberal/tolerant people of 1930 Germany found themselves in by 1936.

posted February 21, 2021 06:24 PM            

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Originally posted by Randall:
I don’t recall saying anything about ANTIFA in the post, or anything at all other than a link.

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posted February 21, 2021 06:28 PM            

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Originally posted by Graham:
At some point ... the Democrats have to start looking at themselves ... and recognise the extremism with which they are attacking the Republicans for extremism.

The extremist groups in both Parties are a threat to the survival of democracy in western societies ... with each insisting on their "right" to protest, and neither exercising their "obligation" to do so responsibly.

Wake up, people of the USA ... before you sleep-walk into the situation that the very liberal/tolerant people of 1930 Germany found themselves in by 1936.

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Asking for accountability, when it comes to an attempt to overthrow the government, isn't "extremism".

posted February 22, 2021 11:00 AM            

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Originally posted by teasel:
Asking for accountability, when it comes to an attempt to overthrow the government, isn't "extremism".

AOC, Julian Castro, Beto O'Rourke, they've all been helping people in Texas, even though half the State probably hated them (may still hate them), and Ted Cruz took off to Mexico. Another guy said that they shouldn't expect help, and then he quit his job, or was told to quit, because that's sociopathic. I can disagree vehemently with people here, without dehumanizing them. I've been dehumanized, and don't want to do that to anyone else. Not even Grump, when his own actions had him catching covid, and he was really sick. The Democrats are told it's their fault, no matter what.

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From the outside looking in, and located on the other side of the pond ... this looked like a vindictive act, intended to appease the extremist supporters of the Democrats.

And ... if it was ... the people of the USA are already sleep-walking into an Orwellian-style future.

Even now, the extremist Democrat supporters cannot see that they were the initiators of the current breakdown of democracy in the USA.

posted February 22, 2021 12:48 PM            

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Originally posted by Graham:
From the outside looking in, and located on the other side of the pond ... this looked like a vindictive act, intended to appease the extremist supporters of the Democrats.

And ... if it was ... the people of the USA are already sleep-walking into an Orwellian-style future.

Even now, the extremist Democrat supporters cannot see that they were the initiators of the current breakdown of democracy in the USA.

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posted February 22, 2021 09:42 PM            

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Originally posted by Chanterelle:
In many ways I agree... however, from the inside looking out, on some level I feel like I’ve been bullied into voting for the lesser of two evils all my life. That’s no excuse for violence and looting, obviously, but I think the breakdown of democracy in this country goes back a whole lot further than these past few years. People on both sides have weaponized fear and moral absolutism at an increasing rate for decades now, and falsely equated compromise with stagnancy or spinelessness, to the point where taking the middle ground seems like an exercise in futility as well. Throughout my adult life, most of my peers have rarely bothered to vote and largely considered politics a pointless, irrelevant sideshow. All the hysteria on both sides is a deliberate exploitation of people who are tired of feeling ignored and marginalized, seeking strength and safety in numbers.
All this is to say, I find it much easier to focus on the positive when I narrow my perspective down to the neighborhood, the town, the watershed... the macro-view can be so terrifying and disorienting, I prefer to ignore it as much as possible, but I know I can’t afford to ignore it entirely. Developing selective attention, choosing to invest your energy in ways that are most likely to have a positive impact... it’s hard!

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The real reason why democracy is breaking down in the USA, UK, EU and other western societies is summed up by the following sentence in your above comment, Chanterelle :-

"Throughout my adult life, most of my peers have rarely bothered to vote and largely considered politics a pointless, irrelevant sideshow."

Those who are not voting do not understand the foundation upon which democracy is based. So, in accordance with the law of cause and effect, their failure to maintain/take-care-of those foundations is resulting in them now crumbling.

posted February 25, 2021 07:35 AM            

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Originally posted by Graham:
The real reason why democracy is breaking down in the USA, UK, EU and other western societies is summed up by the following sentence in your above comment, Chanterelle :-

[b]"Throughout my adult life, most of my peers have rarely bothered to vote and largely considered politics a pointless, irrelevant sideshow."

Those who are not voting do not understand the foundation upon which democracy is based. So, in accordance with the law of cause and effect, their failure to maintain/take-care-of those foundations is resulting in them now crumbling.

[/B]

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... that, and allegations of election fraud, or at the least, manipulations of the system.

I completely understand why people in America may not vote in that climate. There is no democracy if said democracy can be so easily manipulated or violated. Even allegations of this, proven or not, will dissuade people from voting.

posted February 25, 2021 10:48 AM            

Is it not more like the response of a child to his/her disempowerment by parents/authorities?

In the USA ... money talks ... yet the people continue to meekly hand over their taxes to governments which they believe to have been elected via a corrupted system of voting.

Not voting/doing-nothing is the easy-option cop-out. ... And the people of the USA are now paying the price for having chosen that easy option.

posted February 25, 2021 12:12 PM            

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Originally posted by Randall:
If this were an attempt to overthrow the government, there would be a lot of dead people instead of only one, and that one wasn’t due to the mostly peaceful protesters. In fact, not a single weapon was recovered. Only one gun was fired and from a trigger happy cop. And that is being called an “armed insurrection”?

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posted February 25, 2021 04:37 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Graham:
Please explain how not voting is the key to resolving these issues in the USA?

Is it not more like the response of a child to his/her disempowerment by parents/authorities?

In the USA ... money talks ... yet the people continue to meekly hand over their taxes to governments which they believe to have been elected via a corrupted system of voting.

Not voting/doing-nothing is the easy-option cop-out. ... And the people of the USA are now paying the price for having chosen that easy option.

It is a part of the USA psyche for individuals to persuade themselves that "this is not my fight" ... until something happens to show them all that it actually is (like the attacks on Pearl Harbour and The Twin Towers).

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I’m not suggesting that not voting is the preferable option —I do vote, I’m glad that I’m less in the minority for knowing my Congressman’s name than I was a decade ago, and I hope that people can at least be confident in the election process next time around.
Thinking about what you said, though... “It is a part of the USA psyche for individuals to persuade themselves that “this is not my fight”... that’s exactly what I’m getting at! Lots of people have finally decided that it is, and some of them are being very stupid about it.
My point is, lack of faith in the political process itself is the fundamental issue, and I feel like I’m always the one reminding people not to throw the baby out with the bathwater. How much cynicism is warranted, and how much of it is deliberately cultivated?

posted February 26, 2021 03:28 AM            

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Originally posted by shura:
When did voting for corrupt politicians become a virtue?

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When did not voting become a mechanism for virtue signalling?

In a democracy, those who regard none of the candidates as being worth voting for still have a responsibility/obligation to vote. ... And they should register their concern by clearly spoiling the ballot paper.

Those who passively choose to not vote are registered as "disinterested/apathetic" ... Those who actively choose to spoil their ballot paper are registered as "disgruntled/protesting".

Claiming to not vote because no candidate is worth voting for is just a cop-out.