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Author
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Topic: Liability insurance for gun owners
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BlueRoamer
Knowflake Posts: 1326
From:
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted January 31, 2023 01:55 PM
  
Required liability insurance for gun owners is correct.Guns are extremely dangerous, as are cars, cars require insurance, why not guns? This way when someone goes loco and sprays 20 children with an assault rifle, the insurance can at least compensate the parents. Make the gun owners pay for the risk of carrying a gun. If you want to have a gun, go ahead, but the more risk it carries, the higher the insurance you'll have to pay. Also gun safety training classes should be mandatory as well as wellness assessments. IP: Logged |
jwhop
Knowflake Posts: 18431
From: Madeira Beach, FL USA
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted January 31, 2023 02:26 PM
quote:
Originally posted by BlueRoamer:
Required liability insurance for gun owners is correct.Guns are extremely dangerous, as are cars, cars require insurance, why not guns? This way when someone goes loco and sprays 20 children with an assault rifle, the insurance can at least compensate the parents. Make the gun owners pay for the risk of carrying a gun. If you want to have a gun, go ahead, but the more risk it carries, the higher the insurance you'll have to pay. Also gun safety training classes should be mandatory as well as wellness assessments.
Requiring liability insurance for gun owners would infringe on American's right to 'keep and bear' arms. IP: Logged |
teasel
Knowflake Posts: 23641
From:
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted January 31, 2023 03:56 PM
quote:
Originally posted by jwhop:
Requiring liability insurance for gun owners would infringe on American's right to 'keep and bear' arms.
But we require insurance to be seen by doctors, and keep us alive, which is ****** up. IP: Logged |
teasel
Knowflake Posts: 23641
From:
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted January 31, 2023 04:00 PM
quote:
Originally posted by BlueRoamer:
Required liability insurance for gun owners is correct.Guns are extremely dangerous, as are cars, cars require insurance, why not guns? This way when someone goes loco and sprays 20 children with an assault rifle, the insurance can at least compensate the parents. Make the gun owners pay for the risk of carrying a gun. If you want to have a gun, go ahead, but the more risk it carries, the higher the insurance you'll have to pay. Also gun safety training classes should be mandatory as well as wellness assessments.
IP: Logged |
jwhop
Knowflake Posts: 18431
From: Madeira Beach, FL USA
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted January 31, 2023 04:17 PM
quote:
Originally posted by teasel:
But we require insurance to be seen by doctors, and keep us alive, which is ****** up.
you're mistaken. You don't need insurance to see a doctor. They'll take cash. You don't have a 'constitutional right' to see a doctor. You do have a 'constitutional right' right to keep and bear arms...guns. IP: Logged |
BlueRoamer
Knowflake Posts: 1326
From:
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted January 31, 2023 05:17 PM
Agree Teasel, we have a right as tax paying citizens to some form of health careIP: Logged |
jwhop
Knowflake Posts: 18431
From: Madeira Beach, FL USA
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted January 31, 2023 06:56 PM
quote:
Originally posted by BlueRoamer:
Agree Teasel, we have a right as tax paying citizens to some form of health care
If you have a 'right' to healthcare, it's a state right.
Healthcare is not a federal issue. If you wish to argue that point with me, just point me to the clause in the US Constitution that even mentions healthcare of medical care. IP: Logged |
Belage
Knowflake Posts: 6534
From: USA
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted February 01, 2023 07:32 AM
Interesting concept, requiring liability insurance for gun owners...Can the proponents make a sound legal constitutional argument?Keep in mind that the same argument could be applied to owning knives, since knives can kill...But I am just being snarky here, lol. IP: Logged |
Belage
Knowflake Posts: 6534
From: USA
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted February 01, 2023 07:43 AM
The constitution states the right to bear arms. Of course, that right has been regulated. For instance, there are age limits on buying guns. So requiring liability insurance could be pushed as just another "regulation"?Ok. Lets say you pass this regulation. While this would make gun ownership more expensive for the law abiding person, the real criminals, the mass shooters, those intent on using their guns for killing innocent people are not going to care about getting or maintaining liability insurance. The same way you have senseless people driving around without car insurance and getting into accidents, you will have criminals owning guns and using them without liability insurance or with a liability insurance that has lapsed. And whatcha gonna do bout that? Have gun insurance companies flagging every gun owner who didnt pay his liability insurance, and send the police to his house to seize the guns? That's a pipe dream... IP: Logged |
BlueRoamer
Knowflake Posts: 1326
From:
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted February 01, 2023 07:58 PM
This idea problematically doesn't' apply to illegal guns, but the overwhelming majority of mass shootings are done by legal guns:Harm reduction is better than no harm reduction https://www.statista.com/statistics/476461/mass-shootings-in-the-us-by-legality-of-shooters-weapons/ The same thing that happens to people who don't own car insurance, a fine IP: Logged |
Belage
Knowflake Posts: 6534
From: USA
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted February 02, 2023 10:45 AM
Your big concern is mass shootings, and that's understandable, but mass shootings make up a very small percentage of gun deaths/wounded in this country.2021 30 killed 7 wounded
2020 19 killed 0 wounded
2019 74 killed 110 wounded
2018 80 killed 66 wounded
2017 117 killed 463 wounded
2016 71 killed 83 wounded
2015 46 killed 43 wounded
2014 17 killed 28 wounded
2013 31 killed 13 wounded
2012 67 killed 68 wounded
2011 18 killed 21 wounded
2010 8 killed 2 wounded From: https://time.com/4965022/deadliest-mass-shooting-us-history/
IP: Logged |
Belage
Knowflake Posts: 6534
From: USA
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted February 02, 2023 10:49 AM
Let's compare deaths by mass shootings vs death by knives.In 2021 alone, deaths by knives: 1,035. https://www.statista.com/statistics/195325/murder-victims-in-the-us-by-weapon-used deaths by mass shootings: 30. So, let me ask you again, shall we require people who own knives to get liability insurance since statistically, we are more likely to die by knives than by mass shootings? IP: Logged |
Belage
Knowflake Posts: 6534
From: USA
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted February 02, 2023 11:02 AM
2017Year with the greatest number of death by mass shootings: 117 deaths 463 wounded That same year, deaths by knives: 1591. https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/2017/crime-in-the-u.s.-2017/ta bles/expanded-homicide-data-table-11.xls Mass shootings are horrible, and I wish they didn't happen. But I am just trying to bring some perspective here. The argument that any harm reduction is better than no harm reduction is a slippery slope and could serve as a trojan horse for all manners of unconstitutional measures. IP: Logged |
Belage
Knowflake Posts: 6534
From: USA
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted February 02, 2023 11:11 AM
Instead of trying to unconstitutionally disarm law abiding people, how about restricting the coercive power of the government? The right to bear arms was written into the constitution to be a counterweight to dictatorial governments, a taste of which we have unfortunately gotten in the past couple of years, with coercive mandates and lockdowns, medical censorship, and the othering of half of the population for not agreeing that the elections were won fair and square.... Your DOJ has labeled concerned parents exercising their rights to protest and be heard at the schools their children attend, domestic terrorists. Let that sink in... IP: Logged |
BlueRoamer
Knowflake Posts: 1326
From:
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted February 02, 2023 01:36 PM
yeah but most gun deaths and stabbings are related to (arguably) avoidable factors like gang violence, crime, domestic disputes. Mass shootings are random and involve completely innocent bystanders. Also guns are not a natural occurrence in a home, knives are needed for kitchens, guns have only one purpose, to kill an animal or human. I actually experienced donald trump as more dictator like and scary, and trying to place himself as a king, we have a very different perspective here. Biden's moves were in line (actually less restrictive) than many many countries, nothing that out of the ordinary there. Ie most of europe, canada, japan, australia. Only undeveloped countries were less resctrictive due to lack of organization IP: Logged |
Belage
Knowflake Posts: 6534
From: USA
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted February 02, 2023 07:21 PM
I am not understanding the point you are trying to make about gang violence, crime and domestic disputes being arguably avoidable. Avoidable in which way? They also frequently involve innocent bystanders...Are you saying the victims could have avoided being killed in those incidents. I am confused...IP: Logged |
Belage
Knowflake Posts: 6534
From: USA
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted February 02, 2023 07:32 PM
Regarding Trump, he has personality traits that are understandably a turn off for many people, but I think reasonable people have to learn to separate their personal feelings about someone from the reality of what that person actually did.If I were to ask you to give me 5 things that Trump did that qualify him as a dictator or Hitlerian fascist, what would you tell me? Whereas I can give easily 5 things Biden did that easily qualify as dictatorial. From the censorship of medical dissent, to censorship of political dissent, to the collusion with big tech to censor people on the right, from the blanket mandates, And to blame his dictatorial moves on Covid control, I simply don't agree. And I am not going to compare the US to Canada or Australia. These 2 countries sunk into dictatorship and have no constitution to protect them against tyrans. Whereas, we do. IP: Logged |
Randall
Webmaster Posts: 167676
From: I hold a Juris Doctorate (J.D.) and a Legum Magister (LL.M.)!
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted February 02, 2023 09:58 PM
About 35 percent of Republican voters for President Trump have no problem with his personality.IP: Logged |
jwhop
Knowflake Posts: 18431
From: Madeira Beach, FL USA
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted February 03, 2023 12:50 AM
"Also guns are not a natural occurrence in a home, knives are needed for kitchens, guns have only one purpose, to kill an animal or human."I call bullshiite!
When I go to the gun range, I'm not shooting at a human silhouette. I'm shooting at a bullseye and attempting to group my 5 shots into a less than 1" group. People who know nothing about guns or shooting, shouldn't speak on the subject. IP: Logged |
Lindaland
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