posted April 04, 2014 07:04 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by FireMoon:
I was trying to explain that I know personally that MN, IA, WI, etc. are all very "family oriented" states regardless of their "liberal" policies, it's practically part of the Bible Belt... So there's no use arguing with ppl like you and deep freeze who want to come and just clog up the thread and antagonize everyone

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Speaking of culture shock I recall when my Californian family came to pick me up from my Granny's, and they hung around for awhile. A lot of it was funny to me. And I did try, as best as I could, explain it to them.

But I also had to explain the doublespeak of some of the bumper stickers (like what "pro family" actually means) and the like around there, too, as well as explaining how one is (passionately) "pro gun" and "pro God" at the same time, a concept they found puzzling. One funny part is my partner mentioning my granny had 4 guns in easy view (and access) in her room and then did a double take when I replied, "Yeah, she's never been much into guns, I think those had all been handed down to her or given as gifts." Then I realized to her that four was a lot (I had to calm her about my bringing my Glock into her home) and she was also confused why Granny had guns but no air conditioning in the horrid heat wave that reached a 110F/43C.The culture supports it, though, and on the farm you need guns (varmints, protecting livestock, and vicious wild dogs & hogs aren't completely unknown, especially before I was born, and many also hunted, an important skill back in the Great Depression and still enjoyed by many for self-sufficiency).

What my partner really found strange and disturbing was how so many of the plentiful Christian stickers were tied into ideas of discrimination (especially against gays), politics, and guns...but not a single one promoted feeding the hungry or the golden rule. There was ONE bumper sticker like that, only it was a quote by Gandhi on how an eye for an eye makes the whole world blind. She said it was like Texas was another country and then I told her that one of the tourist slogans was exactly that. But yeah, different areas have different mindsets (not that it's so easy as to determine that by state alone).

Yet it's not just there, there was a guy at a gun range in California I used to go to who "knew" I was a Christian because I was a gun owner "and by your fruits you shall know them." I didn't correct him as he'd just told me to be prepared to "shoot to kill" any lesbians before they rape me (based on an absurd FOX News report) so I humored the crazy (armed) man. Of course he may not have been a native to California either (though I didn't recognize any accent on him). But at least in California I was surprised by it whereas in Texas I wouldn't have been.

posted April 04, 2014 07:06 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by I'm so cappy:
If I ever marry, my husband will be an alien. Have I mentioned I like to fantasize about losing my virginity to a handsome Nordic?

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posted April 04, 2014 07:45 PM            

Firstly, I'm going to apologize for being abrasive at times.  That's how I can be (minus family and loved ones).

If any of you want to carry on any hard feelings, you can. I personally will not. This is all not worth that kind of burden to me. I do hold grudges, but will not over this.

We don't see eye to eye, never will, but we can carry on and be civil to each other anyway. That's what I plan to do.
I honestly, genuinely, just don't feel like continuing this debate/discussion/argument.
So I'd rather end it in peace than throwing dirt at each other.

Please don't read something silly into all of this. I'm really being genuine here.

posted April 04, 2014 10:35 PM            

I will end with a sincere "ditto".

posted April 05, 2014 09:53 AM            

Exactly. People seem to miss this simple point. Thanks for your post, SSS!

------------------
Want To Ask Any Question About Bible Prophecy? Go For it. It is Free, of course.

posted April 05, 2014 10:19 AM            

@Desiring Shadows
Would you feel like a chat with me?

posted April 05, 2014 11:31 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by StarlightSmileSupreme:
Cappy a Christian is supposed to be forgiven for their sins through Jesus. That's the whole point. So even if you think homosexuality is a sin, Jesus is the divine forgiver who died for the sins of mankind so people's sins are between them and God through Jesus not between them and other people.
This is why Jesus talks about judgment so often in the gospels. You can be Christian and a sinner its just most people don't truly understand Christianity and if they did, they probably couldn't deal with this idea, that it is expected for them to be sinners. They are born into it.

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I feel like I want to add but no one wants a preacher.
Very well put though. That's a perfect simple explanation.

Part of the reason why when people point out my sins back at me I'm like, "so? What's your point?" lol

And for the record, not to argue, but I never did, never would, say that homosexuals (or anyone) is going to hell. Idk. No one knows. Moses was a murderer and he worked for God.

posted April 05, 2014 12:23 PM            

It took my mom a while, as my step-dad was a bigot and a homophobe (for lack of a better word, as most people aren't actually afraid of gay people, and so on). She was way too influenced by his opinions for many years, although not quite as vocal about it. At any rate, I always found it disgusting to listen to either of them speak.

My mom's family can unexpectedly bust out with some pretty ignorant and appalling comments, and my mom and I will just sort of sit there with our mouths gaping, and then change the subject. Like "Uhm...did you actually just SAY that??" And then crickets chirping.

But then, my mom's side of the family are sort of the stereotypical "hypocritical Christians" that no one wants to be around. They don't practice tolerance or acceptance, or not judging people, like SSS and Ami have mentioned.
They judge, judge, judge, and have no tolerance or empathy for anyone outside their little bubble. So I just don't get on the subject with them. It's pointless. (Not saying that anyone here is that way, just my family and their um..."specialness".)

My cousin is gay, had a longtime significant other for many years, and they adopted two children together. And yet that side of my family is still like "Gee, I wonder if they're really just friends?" They separated before gay marriage became legalized in my state, and share custody. My family = Derp.

posted April 05, 2014 01:42 PM            

My Mother was a professional psychic, for yrs, her specialty was reading for mostly gay men at a time when such was hidden away.

Cannot relate what I heard, she insisted i sit in on the sessions.

INOW, what i say is not based on dogma, or doctrine..though doctrine has proven true from what I've seen

posted April 05, 2014 01:51 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Padre35:

A wee vignette for you Violets:

My Mother was a professional psychic, for yrs, her specialty was reading for mostly gay men at a time when such was hidden away.

Cannot relate what I heard, she insisted i sit in on the sessions.

INOW, what i say is not based on dogma, or doctrine..though doctrine has proven true from what I've seen

Judgy? Perhaps, to not warn is to simply allow w/no counter point

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Not sure what you're getting at here, frankly.

I'm going to hope that you didn't think I was directing my comment at you (or anyone here for that matter, as it seems that most people have come to some sort of middle ground or at least made an attempt), and I haven't read through every single comment in this thread.

In other words, I'm not clear on what you believe regarding this topic, but I'm not really trying to debate anything.

posted April 05, 2014 03:09 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Padre35:

A wee vignette for you Violets:

My Mother was a professional psychic, for yrs, her specialty was reading for mostly gay men at a time when such was hidden away.

Cannot relate what I heard, she insisted i sit in on the sessions.

INOW, what i say is not based on dogma, or doctrine..though doctrine has proven true from what I've seen

Judgy? Perhaps, to not warn is to simply allow w/no counter point

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posted April 05, 2014 09:40 PM            

Registration of a Civil Union to allow for rights non-straight couples. By this I mean a registered de facto relationship that will allow couples access to the Family Court - property settlements, custody issues. That way no one falls through the cracks and is dealt with by the law, this is the issue that bothers me most and these arrangements need to be recognised on some level for the rule of law to apply. This also allows power of attorneys, next of kin issues and inheritance to stand for non-straight couples, just like straight couples.

I don't agree with it being it legitimated as a marriage or called as a marriage. I believe in the traditional definition of marriage, that is, between man and woman for life for the purposes of procreation or the potential of procreation (for the childless).

Having a civil union will allow recognition by the State and therefore an officialness to it. There would be no need to seek a decree nisi from the Court, that is, no order sought from the Court to dissolve the relationship.

posted April 05, 2014 09:47 PM            

- How do we define a human and alien?
- What is an adult in an alien?
- What is the gender of an alien? (This matters here where I am)
- How to define the age of an alien
- How to define consent from an alien, what is consent from an alien?
- Does an alien have cognisance to understand what is
A. A relationship;
B. what consists of marriage or commitment?
- Does an alien even understand what law is and are they willing to be bound by it?
- If this has all been satisfied, there's then issues as to what to define the child is, what is it's state?
- Then there is the minefield of divorce or separation and settlement.

posted April 05, 2014 11:29 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by 23:
Registration of a Civil Union to allow for rights non-straight couples. By this I mean a registered de facto relationship that will allow couples access to the Family Court - property settlements, custody issues. That way no one falls through the cracks and is dealt with by the law, this is the issue that bothers me most and these arrangements need to be recognised on some level for the rule of law to apply. This also allows power of attorneys, next of kin issues and inheritance to stand for non-straight couples, just like straight couples

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I personally don't care what it's called, but I do think it's silly that some people get wrapped up in that word, or act as if marriage was the domain of religion when atheists get married all the time and don't require a church for it (and then there are churches, including Christian ones, who don't have a problem with gay marriage and they shouldn't be prevented by other churches from living according to their beliefs). But as long as all the rights are recognized and they're FAMILY then call a rose by any other name. In some countries it is identical, and I'm okay with that, especially as I figure it would only take a couple of generations before people stop getting hung up on the word.

posted April 05, 2014 11:42 PM            

Given that I've avoided the issue in my head, I'm proud that I have come this far; I come from a traditional European background and have much older parents than others of my generation.

I'm not here to please you, I have come to this reasoning for my agonising purpose. I am genuinely concerned about people falling within legal cracks and I consider issues differently on here than others because of my professional background. The problem is a lot more difficult for me than simply screaming out "rights, rights, rights!" because of this, I'm trained to see colours where you see only black and white.

Quite frankly, I realise you are part of the interest group and that you are fighting for your rights of your group, but do you care about the Sorbs of Germany?

This is my last post to you, I won't allow you to engage me in this anymore, I won't feed your combinative nature so go ahead and rubbish me and defame me as well.

Fiat justitia ruat caelum and may I be forgiven by God for my sins.

posted April 05, 2014 11:58 PM            

I wasn't being combative. You said you found civil unions acceptable and I said so did I under certain circumstances, but pointing out what you described is not true of the USA (and therefore unacceptable here for that reason). That's not attacking you, that's stating fact. As for sharing how I felt about the word marriage I was sharing as I saw you sharing. Were you attacking anyone when you stated your opinion? I assume the answer is no, and that's just as true of me. ('Course if you WERE being combative then no, I wasn't being the same.)

But as for my sharing, perhaps my own background as an author and my Scorpio Jupiter is involved here. I like to understand people and I assume they want to understand as well. I often read long posts when they describe what it's like to be them (and sometimes ask questions for clarification or even more detail). I'm currently helping an author whose story is getting to runaways living on the street to make it as accurate as possible. Back when I did a fic where the cops and legal system were very important I interviewed a few people and did research and greatly appreciated an ex-cop reading my draft giving his input, and I sincerely tried to reflect a cop's reality and how many cops (as individuals) could see the world, from the truly helpful to the bullies, what frustrates them and what gives them job satisfaction, etc. I suppose you have different placements so you can't see what I posted as anything other than an attack.

posted April 06, 2014 12:42 AM            

You're not insulting anyone, in their face, or being outright antagonistic in any way as far as I'm concerned.

This is obviously a personal topic for you, and I think that you've handled yourself very well. I'm sorry that people are so unaware of how hurtful and damaging their words and even their thoughts can be in the greater scheme of things.

Not that I'm assuming that you're hurt by their words, but I personally would be. It's quite thoughtless, imo.