posted January 20, 2014 07:28 PM            

It is charisma said through words, like speeches. It is a great leadership quality such that people will follow the personal power of the individual.

Hitler had it in a square. I think one of the cult leaders had it, too.

It can be used for good or bad. The asteroid just denotes the POWER of the person's charisma and leadership. It does not tell how it will be used.

Do you have it, Randall?

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posted January 21, 2014 08:37 AM            

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Originally posted by Ceridwen:
I found Varuna very consistently appearing in the natal charts of my mum, dad, my both brothers and me - always in close dynamic aspect to a luminary (in my case on the DESC conjunct asteroid FAMA. lol) along with Atlantis being on an angle in ALL five cases!
my youngest brother and me also share natally Atlantis conjunct angle conjunct nodal axis conjunct Neptune.
For him IC and SN, for me ASC and NN.

Our family has a history of water accidents and (almost) drowning. Both the drowning, but also the rescue in last minute.

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Do you think Atlantis on an angle could make one prone to drowning, Ceri?

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posted January 21, 2014 08:38 AM            

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Originally posted by summerlite:
i think of Varuna as groundbreaking.

Varuna conjunct Isis on DSC.

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Yes, the person is very individualistic. That is a big part of it, too. Good point, S!

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posted January 21, 2014 09:15 AM            

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Originally posted by Ami Anne:

Do you think Atlantis on an angle could make one prone to drowning, Ceri?

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I don´t know if that is a "rule".
It was just a strong pattern in my own family (especially maternal side) AND then this consistency relating to the angles and luminaries came up. Though with VARUNA we have to use very tight orb as it moves so closely, I wouldn´t consider anything outside the range of 1° to 1°30 max. because of that. Still, Varuna might be very slow, the angles and the Moon and Sun are not.

I have told the story already, but I suppose the first thing of that kind happened when my maternal great grandmother was supposed to go onto the "Gustloff" with her two daughters. They did not make it, as they were too late.
The ship was sunk. So they were "lucky" to have that narrow escape. Instead they joined the treck across the frozen baltic sea.

So they lived.

The brother of my mother fell into a ditch at the age of about 2 years, and died. My mom was alone with him, but she couldn`t help him, she was only about a year or 2 older than him.

When she was 17, her mother died; no, she did not drown. She was having a thrombosis leading to a pulmonary embolysm and died at the age of 36 (i once read that this kind of embolysm feels like you are drowning).

When I was roughly 2 years old, I jumped into a swimmingpool and drowned. My father dived in right after me but could not find me. He still doesn`t know what happened,b ut suddenly I was lying right over his arm "as if someone had placed you there" (he once said), and luck had it that my body instinctively had closed my lungs, so I did not even cough too much water. I was very very lucky. i blame it on (or thank it for rather9 the fact that I have ANGEL on my ASC.

Many years later, my youngest brother fell into a pond. We wouldn`t even have known it if my middle brother, who has the Down-syndrome, had pulled him out of there and they both came home totally wet, but healthy and alive.

A bit later I remember I was standing with my youngest brother on my arms on a sandbank and looking at the ocean. But apparently I had not really been carefully watching,c ause the flood was very quick, and I had to march against it for a few metres to the beach. Luckily I was not THAT far out (I have a very high respect for water,e ven to this day. lol).

also, on the tour back from ireland with my class, our ship got into a major storm. It was quite dangerous, but as you can see we were lucky.

Oh and a few years ago I was in the Netherlands, in a mall, and suddenly a thunderstorm was loading all the water onto the earth. Even the mall was overflown with water (I had to march through it to get out, when it was almost at the height of my knee at certain spots). The weird thing was it was ONLY that mall that was being flooded, nothing else. I suppose it was just the lowest spot.

But yeah water-history. Definitely. I am careful about that. lol

posted January 21, 2014 09:30 AM            

ASC: 7°01 Sagittarius
Angel: 7°31 Sagittarius
Poseidon: 7°53 Sagittarius
Atlantis: 8°15 Sagittarius
Neptune: 9°56 Sagittarius
NN: 10°10 Sagittarius

DESC: 7°01 Gemini
Fama: 6°51 Gemini
Varuna: 6°08 Gemini

In my case Varuna is not aspecting a luminary, but on my DESC and also conjunct Draconic Moon.

My Dad`s Chart

Atlantis: 15°50 Virgo
ASC: 18°07 Virgo
Saturn: 18°48 Virgo

Varuna: 0°09 Taurus
Moon: 1°25 Taurus

(BTW he was serving with the navy, maybe in his case that was the expression of the water symbolism).

my Mum:

DESC: 12°51 Capricorn
Atlantis: 12°33 Capricorn

Varuna: 4°11 Taurus
Sun: 3°34 Scorpio

my middle brother:

his placements are not fitting that strongly

Atlantis: 16.23 Virgo
Neptune: 15°07 Sagittarius
(on his MC: 12°29 Sagittarius)

Varuna: 8°29 Gemini, I wouldn´t really count it, but notice its proximity to the IC.

However his Draconic chart is freaky

he has Draconic Atlantis conjunct his tropical ASC (right on my Moon btw)

Draco Fama conjunct Angel (his tropical Angel is conjunct his DNA and conjuncts my IC)

Draco Varuna conjunct Fama

But I admit he doesn`t fit the pattern. Though when he was a child, he was swimming like a dolphin. I mean it. He wasn`t swimming like most people are trained to do, he was doing tricks under water and very playful. Spend most time with his head below the surface, and seemed to not even need the oxygene. lol

my youngest brother:

Atlantis: 27°35 Gemini
IC: 28°05 Gemini
NN: 1°10 Cancer
Neptune: 29°03 Sagittarius

Varuna: 16°03 Gemini
Sun: 15°07 Pisces (in 12th house. lol)

the family composite has:

Varuna: 24°59 Taurus

Neptune: 24°51 Scorpio

NN: 23°49 Aquarius

Pluto: 24°14 Virgo
Uranus: 25°30 Virgo

posted January 21, 2014 09:38 AM              

In this respect, it has some attributes of the 12th house -- the house of overwhelming or incomprehensible aspects of life that act out of sight or in the deep background; but the 12th house makes direct contact with the 1st house, which contains the most basic attributes of who we are. Varuna helps us explore the relationship between the vast world and that of the individual. In this respect he bears some resemblance to the Aries Point, another symbol bearing resemblance to the ascendant.

Varuna is named for a supreme pre-Vedic creation deity who was demoted to the lord of waters by subsequent kingdoms. He then took up residence as a cult figure rather than a top-level creation deity. There is no way to actually demote a god, but we can pretend that something is less important than it is. His name evokes reverence in some people even today.

My keywords for Varuna include the great equalizer. Though it may not seem reassuring, he is often depicted carrying a noose. He warns us that life and death are under the purview of God, and we need to respect that and act ethically while we are on Earth. One of Varuna's themes, both astrological and mythological, is the punishment of liars and those who do not honor contracts.

It has nothing to do with charisma. The only tie to MLK is the fact that he said he was there to "cash a check" in his famous speech, which alludes to the "not honoring contacts" described in the above quote (and link).

I know people say that looking up meanings for things is somehow "bad" or "unoriginal" but I think that's just anti-intellectualism at its worst; yeah sure, you can come up with your own meaning for something, a meaning that isn't from a book, but that doesn't mean it's RIGHT/correct.

posted January 23, 2014 07:26 PM            

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Originally posted by Gemmy:
Interesting,it's conjunct my Sun by 1 degree.

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Interesting, Gemmy. Do you relate to what I said?

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posted January 23, 2014 10:22 PM            

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Originally posted by Ami Anne:
Interesting, Gemmy. Do you relate to what I said?

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posted January 23, 2014 10:36 PM            

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Originally posted by Gemmy:
I haven't embraced that part of me.I think I underestimate myself too much.I have a lot of Saturn going on.But I'm making a conscious effort not to.So not yet.Not much charisma from me.Although I do get the feeling certain people are intimidated or threatened by me.It's kind of annoying.

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You need a mentor Gemmy dear, someone who will help you find your voice. I offer myself. People did it for me. If you need anything, write to me, my Friend

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posted January 23, 2014 10:52 PM            

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Originally posted by Gemmy:
Thank you Ami,I will.

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I mean it, Gemmy dear. Please do. Just write when you want to talk. It does not have to be a huge deal!

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posted January 23, 2014 11:01 PM            

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Originally posted by teasel:
I think I have it conjunct my vertex, widely conjunct my Moon, Venus and South Node.

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posted January 24, 2014 04:56 PM            

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Originally posted by olgatheo:
It's conj. My Gemini Asc and BML .

Word witch ?? ;-)

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You can lead and persuade people with your personal power and charisma imo

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posted January 24, 2014 05:04 PM            

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Originally posted by Ami Anne:

You can lead and persuade people with your personal power and charisma imo

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posted January 24, 2014 05:10 PM            

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posted January 24, 2014 05:24 PM            

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Originally posted by Ami Anne:
Aww That is so cool, Olga! xx

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