posted November 20, 2012 06:35 PM            

The government schools, the courts, and the like were never much of a friend of mine and I came to see them as the enemy...an apathetic enemy (as opposed to actually being after me) but they certainly were not my friend and I could expect no help or comfort or justice from them and generally speaking I expected them to make my life worse instead of better (nothing personal against me, that's just the way it was). The one group that sought justice on my behalf and kept me safe from enemies was a group of anarchist punks (not that they were recognized as part of the system, and as they flamboyantly defied the said system they did have to put up with a lot more harassment whereas I was content to hide & avoid encounters with the police, courts, etc). And then back in school, placed in a behavior program, having crap dumped on me by the school made possible because of Janet Reno and Gov. Bush (TX), and then threatened with a fate I literally considered worse than death by the school (thanks to a law Gov. Bush got passed) I ran, caught rides to CA when I was 16.

And then a predator, knowing I was a runaway (and thus a criminal by definition) tore me apart bad and obviously intended to kill me. I got away badly injured but I didn't go to the hospital because I knew they'd call the cops and I'd be sent back to TX (illegal aliens can use a hospital with less risk than an American runaway kid). I didn't report my abductor to the cops for the same reason. I had no government to go to, and viewed the government as an enemy (and they viewed me as a criminal for refusing to submit), and I still feared them sending me back to TX more than being captured by that predator, and so I thumbed north.

Long story short I was taken in by people who were also not accepting of government authority. And while I had sanctuary I was painfully aware that I needed to avoid police scrutiny as I had no documents, no ID (nor did the ones claiming to be related to me have proof, it was pure bluff, and one of them, btw, also refused to keep ID, security card, etc). I even took to carrying a gun though at the time it was illegal due to my age (many adults who likely could've gained a permit refused to even consider getting one for various reasons before they carried). It's complicated to explain what it was like for us, but we had a tendency to get along as no matter how much individuals and groups might dislike others we all had an enemy bigger than us all: government.

The TV show Firefly catches the attitude very well.

I like to think my independence made me stronger for the experience. But it has affected my worldview. For example, many worship soldiers for "defending our freedoms" but I know being free doesn't come from the military (who enforce the government and beholden to politicians they're actually more inclined to protect special interests like big business at the expense of the American people, and btw you might be surprised how little I care what language I was raised to speak), nor does it come from voting (it helps under the right circumstances, but it's often counterproductive and people like Hitler became empowered through democracy as well). I agree that freedom isn't free, but where I disagree with others is that I say it's not given to us by politicians or soldiers, it's SEIZED for one's self, and in defiance of the government (and thus politicians, cops, soldiers), and also comes from within...IOW, I thank myself for my freedoms, and I think most everyone should do the same (though I could share a caveat about strict pacifists generally being dependent on others willing to do violence on their behalf for them to exist in peace...). If I'm gonna thank anyone else (other than kindred spirits who helped) then it would be social activists, like those women battered, imprisoned, and tortured to help women gain equality in the system as an example (just how vile our government treated those women is glossed over today, but some suffered extreme abuse over it). That is I'd thank those who defied the government to give us more civil liberties than people fighting wars so big business can profit.

Of course I'm enfranchised now, but I haven't forgotten what it's like...or lost my distrust of the government. I even keep a BOB (bug out bag), not only in case of natural disaster but...just in case I need to disappear.

posted November 21, 2012 01:55 AM            

Although it strays away a bit from my OP i want to admit that i have deep respect for anarchists, the nonviolent ones of course. we consider ourselves to be autonomous, but in truth we are guided every step of our life. Freedom, is itself a big issue and usually i refuse to even discuss freedom unless a clear definition of what you mean by freedom is laid down. Personally i don't think the government or authorities can limit my freedom. imo, they can throw me in jail or threaten to cut my throat they can imprison my body but not my mind. social values, imo, are what threaten my personal freedom. Beliefs that are carved in my brain without my consent that control my every move. But in reality how can we be truly free if we are social beings?? Even social animals have restricted freedoms.

posted November 21, 2012 04:55 AM            

Without my papers it was hard, though once people I believed I was with relatives then I was mostly left alone (had the cops investigated they'd have likely figured out soon enough that I wasn't who I said I was, however, which motivated me to be extra careful not to draw their attention). Luckily I didn't ever need a hospital as that could've blown my cover.

My arrangements were made off the grid (and I started unschooling instead of going to school) and the jobs I worked for money were under the table. When I was 18 I became able to order a copy of my birth certificate without fear of being returned to TX.

And as a runaway in Houston at 15 (when those anarchist punks came to my defense) I was forced to turn to crime to survive. Of course I was a criminal simply for being a runaway in the first place. Granted, that was my age, but without any form of documentation an adult would be in the same boat as I was (neither able to get welfare or a job and even many private charities & shelters demand ID, and any cop who felt like it could arrest the person simply for being there, in my case for being underage and on my own, the stateless person as an illegal alien, since without documents they couldn't be here legally). That said, it's not that hard to get a fake ID (I'm thinking the pimps must've gotten them for the underage girls in their stables) though there's risk involved in using the black market.

But I do believe the UN (and thus most countries entangled with it, such as Canada) do have ways of handling "stateless" citizens who want to be citizens. I looked into all that years ago, but as it was like 10 years ago and I was actually more interested in learning how to be an expat (if I must) so I can't recall any details...just that I came across protocols for that, at least if you were in any danger from the government you were under (which presumably stateless individuals are, unless they made themselves stateless).

posted November 21, 2012 06:00 PM              

quote:

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Originally posted by Venus:
imagine that you don't have countries, or in other words that you don't belong to one, there is no need to have a citizenship anywhere. a fallen bird. nowhere to call home.. how would it feel like?

more importantly is it fair that some people exist this way?

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imagine that you don't a country. In other words that you don't belong to one, you are a citizen of the earth, whole thing. a free bird. Anywhere to call home.. how would it feel like? (let's go flying)

more importantly is it fair that some people exist this way? (depends, I think it would be nice to be able to move about freely.)

Man created the lines on the globe. (My Dirt, Your Dirt, else we fight about it!)

Having some sort of pride in the planet > Having pride in just one particular piece of it's dirt. *shrugs*

:Crosseyes:

Derp, Earthlings.

The artificial lines do keep cultures,races etc in place, for a time.

posted November 23, 2012 03:41 AM              

quote:

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Originally posted by Randall:
Great string.

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posted November 23, 2012 04:26 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Mblake81:

Man created the lines on the globe. (My Dirt, Your Dirt, else we fight about it!)

Having some sort of pride in the planet > Having pride in just one particular piece of it's dirt. *shrugs*

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yes Mitch you gotz a point imaginary lines been the cause of many ongoing disputes. but tell you what, in the circumstance that these lines do exist (as everyone but you and me seem to believe) is it fair to be denied the right to "belong".

and when you don't have proper identification you can't quite move around easily. you can't find decent jobs. NGOs will help around sure. but that's just a band aide, these situations need a permanent solution.

posted November 25, 2012 04:16 AM              

I am just pointing, saying, it could be better.

By definition,

Man creates everything here, all the systems, all the methods.

If man is having all these problems, naturally, he will seek a solution.

posted November 27, 2012 02:35 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Mblake81:

I am just pointing, saying, it could be better.

..even if it starts with dreams.

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posted November 05, 2014 10:07 AM            

A little more on the topic, although maybe in a different context.