posted March 07, 2014 01:45 PM              

quote:

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Originally posted by micole maree:
Should I delete that post? I do NOT want to hurt anybody's feelings here!

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whose feelings have been hurt?

Not mine, definitely not.

posted March 07, 2014 02:21 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by tgem:
I'm here...just reading. My last post got me pretty emotional so I'm dealing with that "dark side" today. The side where the pain has just really creeped in and the tears won't stop flowing...but I'm following. A lot of questions just keep bombarding my thoughts like crazy today.

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Hang in there, Tgem. I've been there this week as well. {{{{{HUGS}}}}}

posted March 07, 2014 02:32 PM            

Anyway, if any of you have more to add on that planet/point/asteroids set-up, that would be welcome. I'll have to check back later.

posted March 07, 2014 02:35 PM            

Here, we are in control. We have power, and we feel good about it. We're in charge. Not unconscious, unseen forces, but us.

Paradoxically, the sign and placement of the AVX embodies what we find most attractive, and seek out, in others or in general. That which we muse dreamily upon, wishing we could be those things. What we don't know is that we are! These qualities and features already exist within us, and we have total control over them.

Here, the AVX acts like an unconscious North Node. Rather than destiny, it's our personal power. The 'Freewill' part of the Fate versus Freewill axis. It's also where we're totally accountable, so if we don't like where our life is heading, check and see what the AVX is doing.

It also works in tandem with the fateful and predestined feeling of the Vertex. If the Vertex represents our soul's past, then the AVX shows us, like the North Node, where our soul is going - and what tools it already has to get there. As such, utilising the toolbox provided by the AVX gives us all a leg up when completing the missions handed us by the North Node.

As to be expected, the axis itself is the ever fluctuating state we call the present. Your AVX/VX Midpoint therefore shows crucial life lessons, hurdles, and points over which we must have mastery in order to succeed in our present lives and clear any necessary karmas. Think of it like being a willing instrument of your own fate. Taking control - and being in charge - of your destiny. It's possible here. Whereas the VX tosses us to and fro, the AVX shows us that we're driving. The Midpoint can then be the map we take to get to where we're going.

Now, few of us, if any, ask about fate and destiny entirely separately from relationships. So, what on earth does the AVX mean synastrically?

In synastry, the AVX is empowerment and, again, control. Accountability. But what does that mean when another is involved?

We can act like a bit of a faux-Vertex here. If you're driving, then your partner isn't. These may also be areas in your relationship where you have a firm sense of expertise or feeling that this is your domain. Maybe your partner has terrible jealousies and insecurities. A heavily-aspected Pluto here would show how you've come to help teach them about power and control. YOU'VE come to embody their own personal Vertex. And, not everybody likes that, so when playing Fate, remember to play nicely.

Here's the trick, though, and is best experienced when someone's something hits our AVX. Few consciously take upon themselves the role to dole out destiny, and yet it happens. Time and again. How? Why?

At the AVX, we've also stepped upon Destiny's Playground. This is the stuff WE built long ago before we even got here. When we have an AVX contact, it's the sense of finding a long-lost friend swinging on the monkey-bars we ourselves constructed before we can even remember. We just know they're ours - and now someone's all over them, enjoying them, swinging away, having a grand old time.

There's an undeniable sense of joy in the AntiVertex. Since it's what we built, we don't fear being out of control. Not like the Vertex. Here, it brings happiness to us to see someone gain such satisfaction and pleasure from that which doesn't scare us, over which we have control.

Where they're found, these are the contacts which shape everything. We stand back and take notice, asking: 'is this truly possible?' But it isn't a fantasy world, merely one of our own creation. The apex of karmic achievement. Your gift from the Fates.

You've suffred through learning lessons, and your dues are paid here. It's a karmic reward of the highest order. We are fulfilled.

Now you may be saying that that hasn't been your experience at all. You've shed a lot of tears and quite possibly cursed your fate, and everyone else's, at this point.

That's when you need to breathe and take a step back. A big step back. Back, to the beginning.

In that place where we all were before, long before we got here, we made choices. Much like filling out a lesson plan or making a schedule, we had a grand to-do list.

Some of those items are invariably 'take out the laundry' and 'mow the lawn' and 'do the dishes'. If we don't have fresh clothes, we won't make a nice impression. Mowing the lawn shows that we care for the place we live in, and, failing to the dishes means we won't have any that are clean when it's time to enjoy a meal.

We don't like them. Sometimes, they feel like a waste of time and energy. But they are necessarily evils, if you will. They make us able to get what we need.

Sometimes, it's losing a job we loved because something awful needed to happen there, or we had to be free to take the one which would align us with our true destiny.

Sometimes, it's losing someone we love, for similar reasons. That was a relationship of learning. Now, it's time to move on and meet the bigger, better things.

It hurts, and it's very hard, but these are the pipes and chains and grasses and sand that you contributed yourself. This is your playground. And it sometimes can feel very lonely in between.

Ultimately, the AVX is a point of freewill, karmic rewards, and where we are most in control, in charge, and capable. Drawing from its lessons will allow us to become the best that we can be - and enjoy the fruits of our labours from before while we're at it.

Aspects to the axis, the AVX directly, and its Midpoints will show us the best ways we can incorporate these values, lessons, experiences, gifts, and talents.

Good luck, and good journey.

posted March 07, 2014 02:36 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Ceridwen:
whose feelings have been hurt?

Not mine, definitely not.

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Which post? I'm confused now. Lemme catch up. I know MY feelings haven't been hurt in any way. But it's hard to do that.

posted March 07, 2014 03:06 PM            

So now I'm sitting with your words (playground comes to mind) about AVX. My Moira conjunct and his NN conjunct. (His Venus is 5.0 degrees away but I think I remember a 2.0 conjunction on points, no?)

And if the planet opposing Saturn is the freedom point, wouldn't AVX be in that freedom point as well? I've got to go and read that thread that IQ wrote on the freedom point now...

********

Okay, I'm back. This little chunk of a larger quote from iQ:
"...Pluto opposition will be a terrifying "forced Kundalini" type freedom." Because it just dawned on me while reading this that Jace's Saturn opposes my Pluto. HIS freedom point is my PLUTO?

OMG.

posted March 07, 2014 03:55 PM              

very profound

synastrically speaking Mr Sag`s Venus is widely conjunct my AVX (4°27); It is also parallel my AVX, which is why I even consider such a wide aspect.

That and the fact that composite Moon is conjunct his Venus AND my AVX, so sort of pulling them togethe.

his Pluto squares my Vertex-axis by 5 minutes of orb, so his Pluto sits on my VX-AVX-midpoint.

Well, his Pluto is ALSO conjunct my DNA-SAPPHO-MUSA-conjunction on 20-22 Libra.

AND composite NN-AMOR-CUPIDO on 20 Libra, and composite Mars on 23 Libra.

On the other side is my CHIRON on 20 Aries.

It seems like I (and the composite) triggers his natal Venus-Pluto-alignment, while he (and the composite) triggers my VX-AVX-axis, in alignment with Chiron (and the mentioned asteroids).

Probably it is not even a coincidence that both sides are triggered by the composite Moon and nodal axis, two lunar symbols, just one a planet, the other an axis.

posted March 07, 2014 04:03 PM              

quote:

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Originally posted by micole maree:

The poor guy has every reason to fear me. And not just because of those astral projections.

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LOL.

Saturn-Pluto is tremendous though. not easy by any means, but serious deep stuff.

Interestingly Saturn rules my AVX and is conjunct (loosely) and parllel my VX.

Also my Saturn is on 16.57 Cancer, so freedom would be on about 16 Capricorn, right?

that is the exact degree of the composite Venus (and also composite Arthur, Circe and Proserpina).

posted March 07, 2014 05:29 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by tgem:
I'm here...just reading. My last post got me pretty emotional so I'm dealing with that "dark side" today. The side where the pain has just really creeped in and the tears won't stop flowing...but I'm following. A lot of questions just keep bombarding my thoughts like crazy today.

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:hug: Something's going on today. I was where you were for a few days, solidly, up until today. Terribly emotional, and it wasn't hormonal! Bizarre.

I'll explain my theories more in another post, as it seems bigger than that.

posted March 07, 2014 05:33 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by tgem:
I remember when I had our synastry first read, they said, "wow he really touched your sexuality!" Uhhh, YEAH!!!! It was like the intensity between us lit something in me that has been dormant my entire life...what it feels like to be that ultimate feminine figure...an Aphrodite...the intensity was so HOT everybody could just see it...

Eventually, that was one of the reasons I cut it off as well. Both of us being married and all...I knew he and I would be an all or nothing...not just a casual friendship...and the scariest part? That I didn't TRUST MYSELF if I were ever to be alone with him! That says a lot because I pride myself on having tremendous self control and will power. So funny...for once it wasn't about not trusting the guy wouldn't step over the line...it was me!!! I mean things would come out of my mouth that were completely subconscious! Then the shock on my face would clearly express to him, "OH MY GOD...did I really just say that??"

How can two people have a platonic friendship being married to two seperate people and continue to avoid that magnatism? It was torture...especially since we both were missing something significant in the bedroom at home...he has a lot of Scorpio as well.

Interestingly IQ told me we had been husband and wife before....possibility several times. Oh ok...so you mean to tell me we've come into this life with so much passion for eachother and we're NOT supposed to end up together??!! That's like.....torture!!!!

Sigh...I don't know..

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tgem,

posted March 07, 2014 05:35 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by summerlite:
Maybe it takes you to date other men (not foolishly or rashly but wisely) and still find yourself be uncomfortable with it to realise how much you want him, or finally take action.

The catalyst effect.

I think mel mentioned catalyst in TF videos, but can't remember what it was about.

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posted March 07, 2014 05:44 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Ceridwen:

Oh yeah. Totally understand what you mean.

In fact I think it was important for me to meet him to realize that I am not AS controlled and indifferent and "floating above" as I liked to picture myself.

The thing is I never was attracted to anyone, with the attraction sort of "overpowering" my reason (at least not since I left puberty). I have always been able to do the "switch-on/switch-off" thing (Aquarius Moon with Moon parallel Uranus); with him the chemistry I feel is instant, immediate and simply doesn`t ask my mind what it thinks of it. It just happens, even if I donīt want it or try to control it or push it back or sublimate it, like I have had been an expert in doing before.
The only thing i can control are my actions, barely keeping myself from running towards him and hug him, which is what I would instinctively do. lol

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Yeah. Fate brought that out in me, too, for the first time, really.

I think I'm supposed to explore tantra with my costar; I remember a few years ago, he really wanted to add it to his repertoire, so to speak, but we didn't have a sexual relationship yet.

Now if I can JUST get to a comfortable place, building the right foundation with Fate, I can continue a physical sexual relationship with my husband (which he finds satisfying), learn tantra with my costar, (which I'm feeling like I NEED now), and trust that when the time is right, I'll know what to do about my relationship with Fate? ... Maybe?

posted March 07, 2014 05:52 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by tgem:
I'm here...just reading. My last post got me pretty emotional so I'm dealing with that "dark side" today. The side where the pain has just really creeped in and the tears won't stop flowing...but I'm following. A lot of questions just keep bombarding my thoughts like crazy today.

---

posted March 07, 2014 08:25 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by micole maree:
Indigo, I'm loving what you wrote. Were you REALLY a teenager? Sheesh. You're insightful and a gifted writer NOW but for that age? Sheesh again!

So now I'm sitting with your words (playground comes to mind) about AVX. My Moira conjunct and his NN conjunct. (His Venus is 5.0 degrees away but I think I remember a 2.0 conjunction on points, no?)

And if the planet opposing Saturn is the freedom point, wouldn't AVX be in that freedom point as well? I've got to go and read that thread that IQ wrote on the freedom point now...

********

Okay, I'm back. This little chunk of a larger quote from iQ:
"...Pluto opposition will be a terrifying "forced Kundalini" type freedom." Because it just dawned on me while reading this that Jace's Saturn opposes my Pluto. HIS freedom point is my PLUTO?

OMG.

The poor guy has every reason to fear me. And not just because of those astral projections.

---

I was. If the time-stamp on the file isn't lying to me, that was right after The Summer of Crazy, Part I (July 1995), so I was, excuse me, fourteen. I remember starting my research and work into the Vertices between 1993 and 1995, so I was either thirteen or fourteen. And FEARLESS. I had stuff to say, and damn it, I was gonna SAY it.

I loved the Internet, needless to say. I was giving lectures on #Pro-Astrology on IRC, and a ChatHost on AstroNET (on AOL). I LOVED the fact that nobody knew (or cared) about my age. I felt so free.

Augh. What happened? Heh.

As to the interpretation, maybe it's Ceri's influence but I've gotten to where I really value my orbs being the tighter the better.

For example, along an axis, I might allow wider orbs if one part of it is exact - or near to exact.

If something is exactly conjunct the VX, then something could be as wide as an aspect to a luminary. That's the ONLY reason I consider the ASC/VX DW to be as it is; his to mine is exact, mine to his is 8.

Otherwise, I tend to stick with 2-3 degrees at absolute most.

posted March 07, 2014 08:35 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by micole maree:
Indigo, I'm loving what you wrote. Were you REALLY a teenager? Sheesh. You're insightful and a gifted writer NOW but for that age? Sheesh again!

So now I'm sitting with your words (playground comes to mind) about AVX. My Moira conjunct and his NN conjunct. (His Venus is 5.0 degrees away but I think I remember a 2.0 conjunction on points, no?)

And if the planet opposing Saturn is the freedom point, wouldn't AVX be in that freedom point as well? I've got to go and read that thread that IQ wrote on the freedom point now...

********

Okay, I'm back. This little chunk of a larger quote from iQ:
"...Pluto opposition will be a terrifying "forced Kundalini" type freedom." Because it just dawned on me while reading this that Jace's Saturn opposes my Pluto. HIS freedom point is my PLUTO?

OMG.

The poor guy has every reason to fear me. And not just because of those astral projections.

---

So, wait, PLUTO oppositions are 'forced Kundalini' type aspects?

Wow. If I think of it that way ...

Then my costar's MOON-BML-NYMPHE opposite my SUN-BML-PLUTO would be what exactly?

posted March 07, 2014 09:27 PM            

"Here's the link to iQ's thread...it's a great read!"

"True Freedom: The Opposite Point of Saturn"
http://www.linda-goodman.com/ubb/Forum24/HTML/216032.html

He starts off with the signs. About a third of the way down the page, he mentions this Kundalini effect. I got a bit lost in his talk about Uranus, Neptune and Pluto because I don't understand enough about astrology. He also mentioned transits but the thread focused on the Freedom Point.

posted March 08, 2014 12:07 AM              

'Here, the AVX acts like an unconscious North Node. Rather than destiny, it's our personal power'

posted March 08, 2014 12:16 AM            

I was alone, and it was a quick and hard jolter. All is well. My cat was alarmed, and it knocked me over.

Jeez.

Remind me to tell you about the fact we shifted back into 2012 today. Sounds crazy, I know, but Mars Retro is doing some very kooky things, and one of them was making us confront 2012 issues.

posted March 08, 2014 12:45 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Astro keen:
I am confused with regard to AVX. My vertex conjuncts my NN, so AVX in on my SN. Same midpoints (am i right?). Some of what Indigo said wouldn't apply here.

'Here, the AVX acts like an unconscious North Node. Rather than destiny, it's our personal power'

If NN conjuncts vertex, could the AVX be like an unconsciousness NN?

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Actually, AK, it's a helluva gift, to have your AVX and SNODE conjunct. You're extraordinarily in charge of your karma.

Granted, the SNODE is everything we brought with us; that which feels familiar, and safe. So, surely, it'd be within our control, right?

Since the AVX is about freewill, and the SNODE regards our karma, those traits and behaviours are important for you to integrate into your toolbox. It's not that you should be moving towards the SNODE, per se; the NNODE still must be developed for maximum potential realisation, but you might find the task less arduous.

Something I hadn't yet explored when I wrote that piece was how the AVX can also function like a destiny-driven Ascendant. I know, it sounds kooky, but in my experience, it's linked to our higher mind and greater consciousness.

I've found when I meditate on this point, or have contacts to it, it helps me to become what I need to be. It gives me the reins to put those things into play.

I take it upon myself to develop the traits of the AVX, much like I try and work towards the NNODE. For me, there's an alignment there. One works in tandem with achieving the goals of the other. AVX helps with my NNODE realisation.

Now, having VX on the NNODE shows that fate is a crucial part of your destiny. Your understanding and relationship to fate, predestination, synchronicity, and all those things we can't tangibly understand are essential for you to realise your maximum potential. This differs from moving towards your karma - which is 12H. You need to TOTALLY let go and trust the higher forces of destiny at work to help you get where you're needing to go.

So the MPs would then be AVX/SNODE and VX/NNODE.

Think about it.

Your Freewill / Karma is united with your Fate / Destiny.