posted May 19, 2016 05:18 PM            

He heavily overlays my 7th House though.
Does this always imply a onesided relationship?

posted May 19, 2016 05:51 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Lotis White:

I’ve noticed that the 5th, 7th, and 8th houses do determine who we end up with in terms of the signs they have in their chart. The partner needs to match the 7th house in some way for sure by sign… So if somebody has a Cancer Dsc with Jupiter in the 7th, and Moon in Virgo, that means the partner will likely have the signs Cancer, Sagittarius (for Jupiter in the 7th), or Virgo strong in their chart. Or the have a combo of these signs.

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Ah... ok... light bulb.

Been trying to determine for a while if my partner has cold feet because I don't fit his 7th house profile and am otherwise perhaps wrong for him... or because he's a slloooow-ass Venus and Mars-Mercury in Taurys individual with commitment issues to boot... could be a blend of both but I'm interested to know if I AM right for him after all as he seems to be coming around to committing...

Anyway, if you can give your two cents on this out would be most appreciated: he has a Sagittarius descendant with Jupiter conjunct Uranus in the 6th house conjunct the descendant by 7 degrees... and Neptune conjunct South Node in the 7th house.

I make 0 Ptolemaic aspects to his Jupiter/Uranus, and don't have anything in Sagittarius except Uranus (and my Draconic Sun, conjunct their Jupiter, and my progressed Sun in their 7th in Sag)..

But since his Neptune is the only planet in his 7th, this is part of his 7th house signature? Of course it is... i just always manage to overlook it. My Saturn is in his 7th--towards the end of his 7th--conjunct that Neptune. My Uranus is also conjunct his Neptune.

I have Moon conjunct Neptune (in his 8th house) and Venus in the 12th (in his 5th) natally. He also has Venus in his 12th natally (his Venus in my 7th), and his Moon (in my 5th) is square his own Neptune. His Ascendant and North Node are in my 8th house. So we have overlays in all the houses...

posted May 19, 2016 10:24 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by thegrinning_cat:
What if I just overlay his first Four houses strongly - but no planets in the 5th, 7th, 8th or 11th ?

He heavily overlays my 7th House though.
Does this always imply a onesided relationship?

The Rulers of both our 7th House Ruler are conjunct the other's Venus.
He has a strong Saturn/10th House Emphasis and my Moon is in his 10th (conjunct Sun and Venus)

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posted May 19, 2016 10:36 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Sunnya:
@Lotis White Does it count as an house activation when, for example, the IC falls on someone's 5th or does it always have to be a planet (or asteroid too?)?

Thank you .

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It would certainly have an impact, only more would be needed. Angles conjunct the 5th, 7th or 8th house cusp can be part of what attracts us to someone. We'd be drawn to them for that area of their life. But the positions of a person's planets show the deeper levels of their psyche and personality. If we're only attracted to them for a certain area of their life, but not to their actual personality then there is something missing for sure.

The Asc is in a category all on it's own here. The Asc is the surface level of hour personality, like our skin. Somebodies Asc in our 5th, 7th or 8th house can be a strong part of the attraction. Their natural spontaneous way of 'being' and outlook on the world would appeal to us, as would their mannerisms and appearance.

Of course more then one factor is always needed, even if we're talking about planets in the relationship houses.

Like I've outlined in previous posts, planets don't actually have to be in the 5th, 7th, or 8th houses, to attract us in that way. They can aspect the rulers of these houses, or match the symbolism of these houses (e.g. Venus in the 7th and being attracted to Taurus and Libra influenced people).

What I can tell from the above mentioned aspect is...

Ic conjunct someone's 5th house cusp means they'll admire the way you conduct yourself in private and at home. They may be impressed by your family background or home in some way.

posted May 20, 2016 12:08 AM            

I wonder if I'm reaching too far now with this?;

His Venus (in 7th) conjunct his Descendant in late Pisces (by 2 deg). A bit further in his 7th a Merc/Jupiter/NN conjunction in Aries.

But..
I have no Taurus (unless MC) or Libra (only Uranus) or Aries (just chiron) in my chart, nor an outstanding aspect between Venus and another personal planet. An aries influence might come from my Moon/Mars square.
Also NO planet in Pisces (though my Sun as ruler 12 in the 12th).

If I look at his secondary 7th, which is the 12th we see my Asc/Merc-virgo conjunction right on his 12th cusp (*in* the 12th).

No spectaculair aspects to his 7th ruler(s) either. Unless my Uranus opp. his Jupiter. Or Neptune quincunx my Sun exact.

On the other hand, his Venus/Desc makes an opp. to my Pluto (on his asc) and a grand trine to my Venus-Neptune/Jupiter trine (so his Venus/desc is the fill-in point of a KITE here).

Taking this all ^ into account when considering a 7th-match.. it doesn't look very promising, does it? Or are the aspects to that Venus/Desc only enough here... ?

Btw, it might be interesting to note he was totally in love with a Libra Sun/Moon conjunction not verry long ago.

EDIT@ Ow wait.. my Mercury exact conjunct my virgo Asc.. = Mercury in Aries (alike).

posted May 20, 2016 01:16 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by mir:
Lotis..

I wonder if I'm reaching too far now with this?;

His Venus (in 7th) conjunct his Descendant in late Pisces (by 2 deg). A bit further in his 7th a Merc/Jupiter/NN conjunction in Aries.

But..
I have no Taurus (unless MC) or Libra (only Uranus) or Aries (just chiron) in my chart, nor an outstanding aspect between Venus and another personal planet. An aries influence might come from my Moon/Mars square.
Also NO planet in Pisces (though my Sun as ruler 12 in the 12th).

If I look at his secondary 7th, which is the 12th we see my Asc/Merc-virgo conjunction right on his 12th cusp (*in* the 12th).

No spectaculair aspects to his 7th ruler(s) either. Unless my Uranus opp. his Jupiter. Or Neptune quincunx my Sun exact.

On the other hand, his Venus/Desc makes an opp. to my Pluto (on his asc) and a grand trine to my Venus-Neptune/Jupiter trine (so his Venus/desc is the fill-in point of a KITE here).

Taking this all ^ into account when considering a 7th-match.. it doesn't look very promising, does it? Or are the aspects to that Venus/Desc only enough here... ?

Btw, it might be interesting to note he was totally in love with a Libra Sun/Moon conjunction not verry long ago.

EDIT@ Ow wait.. my Mercury exact conjunct my virgo Asc.. = Mercury in Aries (alike).

Yea well.. probably a reaching too far example ;D

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Would need to see a chart to cover all the bases, as sometimes people overlook things in their descriptions.

posted May 20, 2016 01:42 AM            

And yes, I have an exact Venus/Neptune trine, see;

posted May 21, 2016 12:53 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Lotis White:
Hi Gemini30,

Firstly I want say that attraction is multifaceted. It really is a combo of 5th, 7th, 8th house symbolism, synastry aspects, and gender planet affinities (e.g. Guy with Venus/Neptune goes for women with Mars/Neptune, or Venus/Neptune, or a Pisces influence).

If any one factor is out of balance it throws the connection off kilter. If somebody puts all their planets in your 5th, 7th, and 8th houses but they hardly aspect your chart via synastry, the connection may fall flat.

If someone heavily aspects your chart but they are not your type via the relationship houses (5th, 7th, and 8th symbolism) you may really appreciate them but not in a romantic light. The just don’t press you’re buttons. This includes taking into account the house rulers as well, their position and aspects to the partner’s chart.

I’ve noticed that the 5th, 7th, and 8th houses do determine who we end up with in terms of the signs they have in their chart. The partner needs to match the 7th house in some way for sure by sign… So if somebody has a Cancer Dsc with Jupiter in the 7th, and Moon in Virgo, that means the partner will likely have the signs Cancer, Sagittarius (for Jupiter in the 7th), or Virgo strong in their chart. Or the have a combo of these signs.

However, I’ve also noticed that aspects to the gender planets in the natal chart are often reflected by partner. That is, the partner’s Sun, Moon, Venus and Mars. These are called affinities. If one partner has Moon in the 8th house, the other may have a Scorpio Sun or Moon. If one partner has a Venus/Saturn aspect in their chart, the other may have a Mars/Saturn or Venus/Saturn aspect in their chart. This is very common.

When comparing the 5th, 7th, and 8th house symbolism to affinities, it seems that both are true and both ‘work’. My thinking tends to be that we need both affinities and relationship house symbolism matching to really find the right match. I mean, how often to we deeply fall for somebody? It’s not so easy to find that level of connection. There are many we could be attracted to in a half-hearted way, like a crush. But not many feel like life partner material.

My thinking is that our deepest connections are with those that fit our attraction profile on multiple different levels. Not just one. The rest are just crushes, where they partly of fit.

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Thank you Lotis White! I love your analysis on "attraction and synastry."

So basically, a combination of planetary overlays, natal to natal aspects, and synastry between the relationship planets, you get irresistable attraction!

posted May 21, 2016 03:26 AM            

I also have moon, Mars, Saturn in his 5th (my 11th) aspecting his stellium there, plus my ASC and uranus in his 8th conjunct his Pluto.

posted May 21, 2016 04:19 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Sunnya:
Thank you Lotis White for taking the time to contribute and explaining everything so well.

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posted May 21, 2016 04:20 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Gemini30:
Thank you Lotis White! I love your analysis on "attraction and synastry."

So basically, a combination of planetary overlays, natal to natal aspects, and synastry between the relationship planets, you get irresistable attraction!

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posted May 23, 2016 06:41 AM            

Since you posted your chart first, I’ll look into your question first.

Okay so when I look at his 7th house in comparison to your natal symbolism, these are the things I find that match you to his 7th house…

* Your Venus Neptune trine matches to his Venus in Pisces in the 7th house.
* Your Venus in Cancer matches his 7th house ruler in the 4th house (the Cancer house).
* Your Virgo placements matches to his Mercury in the 7th house.
* Your Mercury conjunct the Asc, and Sun in the 12th house, matches to Pisces and Aries being on his 7th and 8th house cusps.
* Your Virgo Asc/Mercury matches to his secondary 7th house (the 12th) cusp in Virgo.

About aspects….

* His 7th house ruler looks like it’s trine your Mercury/Asc conjunction.
* The two of you share a lovely Venus/Venus trine in the water signs…. This is especially significant for him because his Venus in the 7th his looking for a very sweet affectionate connection with somebody, so when somebody aspects his Venus with their Venus it gives that type of connection and also gives his 7th house planets something to ‘do’ in the relationship.
* His Mercury/Jupiter in the 7th look like they are trined by your Sun and opposed by Uranus, again this is good relationship wise as it gives him something to ‘do’ with his 7th house energy. Jupiter and Mercury are both intellectual planets and so they’ll probably enjoy the stimulation of your Uranus.

Back to house symbolism… So when we look at his 7th house, and secondary 7th house, we can see an attraction to your Cancer Venus trine Neptune, and Virgo placements, quite strongly. For one relationship house that is enough, the rest of his attraction to you would show up in 5th and 8th houses. After all, it’s best to have all three represented. It can all show in just the 7th.

More on secondary houses… Usually I just look at the secondary 7th house because it’s an angular house, but it’s entirely possible to look at the secondary 5th and 8th houses too. His 5th house in particular is important here….

For a start, his has Aquarius on the 5th house with Moon in that house. This relates back very nicely to your Cancer Venus in the 11th house. Both have an Aqua/Cancer theme. Plus your Mars in Aqua sits smack in his 5th house.

Then we can look at his secondary 5th house which is the 11th…. Actually both his Aqua Moon (a female significator) and Aqua 5th house cusp symbolically point towards the 11th house as part of his attraction pattern. He has Leo on the 11th house ruled by Sun in the 8th house. This is exemplified perfectly by your Leo Sun and Moon/Jupiter in Scorpio. It’s always good to see the Sun and Moon showing in the attraction pattern. Pluto sextile Venus might tie in as well.

His secondary 8th house is again Virgo on the Asc. Sign wise this matches your Virgo planets again. And yes, I do think Moon Sq Mars in the natal chart would make the Aries part of his 8th house more drawn to you. His Sun in the 8th square your Venus would be a strong attraction aspect wise. And of course Sun in the 8th makes him attracted to Leo energy.

Back to his Moon…

Attraction wise, his Moon can be seen from two perspectives. From the 5th house perspective, with Moon in Aqua in the 5th house we have an attraction to Aqua/Cancer energy as I’ve mentioned above.

From a Moon perspective, Moon in the 5th house on a man gives an attraction to Leo influenced females. On top of this, as mentioned before, his Aqua Moon relates back to his Leo 11th house cusp too (his 11th house is also his ‘secondary Moon‘). You have a bit of both Aqua and Leo in you and so you fit this contradiction in his chart. Both his Moon and his 5th house/secondary 5th house have a thing for the Leo/Aqua Axis.

Yes, the secondary house method can be done using planets, as well as house cusps. I regularly do this with Mars and Venus when looking at attraction. Usually I check out Mars for women and Venus for men.

For example, in your chart you have Mars in Aquarius. This means that the 11th house is your secondary Mars…. The 11th would show more about the characteristics you like on men. You have Cancer on the 11th ruled by Moon in Scorpio, and Venus in the 11th house. This matches his Venus ruled Taurus Sun in the 8th house natally. This is important because I don’t see Taurus as part of your attraction pattern elsewhere in your chart. It comes from your secondary Mars house.

Your 7th and 8th houses love his Pisces Venus and Aries planets, and your 5th house loves his Gemini Mars (because your 5th house ruler Saturn is in Gemini), and your Aqua Mars in the 6th house loves his Aqua Moon and Virgo Asc. No Taurus showing unless you look at the secondary house of Mars.

In his case Venus is in Pisces referring back once again to his 12th house and your Asc/Mercury. Enough said here. He sure does love your Asc/Mercury.

posted May 23, 2016 07:23 AM            

I’d say yes you match his 7th house. Your Moon conjunct Neptune is a match for his Neptune in the 7th house… Plus, Saturn in Sagittarius rules your Moon/Neptune conjunction. Your Saturn in his 7th is more a match then is usual for this planet because of your Cappy Moon/Neptune. Uranus exact conjunct his Neptune is just icing on the cake, and he might not mind with his own 7th house ruler conjunct Uranus.

Also, with a Sag Dsc the 9th house the secondary 7th house. His 9th house is Capricorn ruled by Saturn in Scorpio exact conjunct your Asc, and sign wise your Scorpio/Cappy vibe is represented here. So yes, a definite valid match here for his 7th house. And his 8th too because the 8th and the 9th both have Capricorn on the cusp with a Scorpio Saturn ruling.

Your other relationship houses match well too. You have Venus in Libra in his 5th house. And since Virgo is on his 5th house cusp, then the 6th house is his secondary 5th house… All your Scorpio placement fall into his 6th. He also has a Saturn/Pluto conjunction in his 6th house again referring to Scorp/Cappy energy symbolically.

From your side Mars in the 5th house really attracts you to his Aries Sun/Moon and his Moon is actually in your 5th house. All his Taurus planets fall into your 7th house, and his Asc falls into your 8th house.

Your secondary 7th house is the 2nd house where his Jupiter, Uranus, and Neptune sit. However since his personal planets are already in your original relationship houses, he probably doesn’t need a super personal influence on your secondary 7th. It is interesting though that his 7th house ruler Jupiter falls onto your secondary 7th house.

What I can see is that there is an attraction there between you including all three of the relationship houses for both partners. This is good.

posted May 23, 2016 08:15 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by thegrinning_cat:

Thank you so much, Lotis!! <3

When the House Ruler Contacts are included, there is a connection, I never thought of that before!

His 5th House Ruler Uranus is exactly conjunct my DESC.
My Anti-Vertex is excacly conjunct his NN/Juno in the 5th House.

His 7th House Ruler is conjunct my Venus
(we have DW Hard Aspects, and it's also in the Composite)

His 8th House Ruler Mars is conjunct my Pluto
(also a DW, my Mars trines his Pluto exactly, and there's an exact sextile in Composite)

Does that compensate for not having "direct House Overlays" in his 5th, 7th and 8th?

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These factors are nice but they don't compensate. There are some other things I can see though that help.

I can see that he overlays your 7th and 8th houses quite well. His Mercury and Uranus in Cancer, and Moon and Pluto in Leo all fall into your 7th house, and his Sun/Venus in Cancer match your Dsc by sign (this counts too as a symbolism match). His Asc falls into your 8th house in Virgo, which also matches your 5th house, because Mercury in Virgo rules your 5th house cusp.

Also, with Cancer on the Dsc the secondary 7th house is the 4th house, and I notice that you have his Jupiter right on your Ic in Taurus. This is a nice positive and warm connection.

Your attraction to his characteristics is very straightforward, and yes, Uranus on the Dsc can give an electric attraction.

From his side, while there are no overlays to his relationship houses, there are some good symbolism matches to your chart.

His 5th house is Capricorn ruled by Saturn in Libra… And you have Asc and Jupiter in Capricorn and Venus in Libra. Also, with Capricorn on the 5th house cusp his secondary 5th house is the 10th house, where he has Gemini on the cusp… Your Moon in Gemini sits in his 10th house (secondary 5th house).

He has Pisces on the 7th house cusp and Aries on the 8th house cusp. There are no direct overlays again but his 7th house ruler Neptune in Libra matches your Venus by sign, and his 8th house ruler Mars conjunct your Pluto is a very magnetic connection.

His secondary 7th and 8th houses are his 12th and 1st houses. This works out well for you because your Virgo Sun and Mercury fall into his 12th and 1st houses. Nice to see your Sun especially find a place in his attraction pattern.

If your read my response to Mir you’ll learn about the secondary houses of Venus and Mars. They show more details about what characteristics men (secondary Venus) and women (secondary Mars) are attracted to in terms of gender behavior.

Your Mars is in Sagittarius, and so the 9th house is your secondary Mars house… It shows more detail about what you like from men. You have Libra on the 9th house cusp ruled by Venus in Libra also in the 9th house, and some of Scorpio in that house. He has a Venus/Sun conjunction in Cancer, and with Venus on the Sun it would give him some of that Venusian charm. His Mars in Scorpio also falls into your 9th house. This is a good match.

From his side he has Venus in Cancer, and so the 4th house is his secondary Venus house… It shows more detail about what he likes from women. He has Sagittarius on the 4th house cusp, no planets are in his 4th but he has some of Capricorn in the 4th house. Your Mars and Neptune in Sag, and Asc and Jupiter in Capricorn all fall into his 4th house. Another good match. Your Sag/Cap energy can give him that comforting feeling he’s looking for.

posted May 23, 2016 02:30 PM            

Thank you so much for taking the time to do that detailed analysis.. very very appreciated.

I think we're on the verge of being quite committed and serious, but with all his Taurus it is just taking him some time to really fully do so. He seems to have lots of time for the relationship.. he basically lives at my house... and seems to like me. My insecurity (and his) are the main things standing in the way of believing in the long term viability of a commitment but your post actually really helps me feel confident that I'm as good a match for himas he is for me. I didn't think about his Scorp/Cap resonance with Saturn/Pluto or the 6th being his secondary 5th... but of course.

posted May 23, 2016 05:06 PM              

quote:

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Originally posted by Lotis White:
For those who wondered about the 11th house...

The 11th house is the house of 'love received' and the 5th house is about 'love given'.

When we are in 5th house mode we are passionate about something or someone and feel the need to make a BIG deal about it.

When we're in 11th house mode we're on the receiving end of other people's passionate expression, and have the opportunity to judge we feel about it.

With synastry to our 11th house if it's positive, it's like the other person just knows how to treat us in a way that make us feel special (even if it's sort of accidental). We often feel a lot of appreciation, here. The 11th house describes nataly how we'd ideally like to receive love. How we'd like to be swept off our feet (for women), or how we'd like to be swooned over (for men).

With synastry to the 5th house it's all about how the other person inspires us, and how they are special to us, and how they make us feel, rather what we receive from them.

With synastry to the 5th, we fall in love with the other person, and feel and intense need to express towards them.

With synastry to the 11th house, we receive admiration from others, and can fall in love with how they treat us, and make us feel special.

With horrible synastry to the 11th though, we may receive something that we don't like, and could be repelled by this instead. But since we're talking about attraction here that's another story.

Of course all synastries are way more complicated then this polarity. So it's entirely possible to get both (5th house giving/11th house receiving) from one person, especially with house ruler synastry.

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posted May 23, 2016 08:16 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by thegrinning_cat:
Maybe it's not possible to answer it from the charts...but could these missing House Overlays show that he's not into me in the same way?
Or would you still consider the Synastry strong?

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That's not how I meant it at all. Sorry, didn't mean to give that impression. Direct overlays are not the only way to be somebody's type. I was actually using your comparison as an example to show how symbolic matches, and secondary houses, can be used to determine matches that are not obvious.

You both match each other in different ways, and I'd find it impossible to say confidently one way or another who would feel it more. You just mentioned you've got a Neptune t-square, and if so, that's another symbolic match to his Pisces Dsc via aspects in your natal chart.

Also, there are no gurantees astrologically with this kind of thing (that I know of anyway). I've actually seen cases where someone dumping a bunch of planets in the other person's 7th house have not resulted in a massive attraction from the house person. This is because some people prefer the sign of their Dsc ruler to their Dsc sign, or even the sign ruled by a planet in their 7th house. I've got Gemini on the Dsc, and Mercury in Sag, and I lean more towards Sag then Gemini. No Sag planets could be in my actual 7th house. And lets just say someone has Mars in the 7th, then they might go for Aries regardless of what Dsc sign they may have. The actual sign of Aries may fall on their 10th house, and the partner may fill up their 10th house while still symbolically matching the 7th house.

Your Capricorn Asc/Jupiter and Libra Venus match his 5th house. Your Moon in Gemini falls into his secondary 5th house.

Your Libra Venus again matches his 7th house (keep in mind Venus is in her dignity in Libra). And your Sun/Mercury in Virgo fall into his 12th and 1st houses which are his secondary 7th and 8th houses.

Saturn in Scorpio rules your Asc, and this matches his Scorpio Mars which rules his 8th house. Come to think of it, your Sun/Mercury in your 8th house matches this as well. Plus you give him Pluto energy in synastry by conjunction to his Mars.

It's worth noting that your Virgo Mercury also appears to be near his Antivertex, and his nodes are on your Vertex Axis. This give the relationship an slightly spooky 'fated' feeling, like something significant is happening for the both of you. Does not guarantee how things will end though. Just that it feels an important part of your journey somehow.

Another thing to keep in mind... The 7th house has more then one meaning (as do the 5th and the 8th)... It rules all kinds of partnerships and not just marriage, and it also rules open adversaries and rivals. Sometimes 7th house overlays are about more platonic types of partnerships, sometimes 8th house overlays are just about having someone to confide in, and sometimes 5th house overlays are just about having a friend to have creative fun with.

What turns such connections romantic is a complex balance between synastry aspects (attraction producing aspects like Venus/Mars or Mars/Pluto), house ruler synastry (aspecting the rulers of the 5th, 7th, and 8th houses), and gender planet affinities, mixed in with such overlays. We don't fall for everyone who overlays these houses or we'd be lovesick for every third person we met every time we left the house! Not realistic. In fact, if the synastry is right, and there are strong symbolism matches to the relationship houses, it's possible to fall more in love with someone who doesn't directly overlay these houses. Secondary houses come into play here as well.

My guess is that his reluctance is about the age difference, not lack of feeling for you. And if that's the case only the two of you can decide what's the best course of action going forward. Still feelings are unpredictable sometimes. The only real way to find out is to ask him what it is he's having doubts about. His connection to you or the age difference?