posted April 10, 2015 06:41 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by tgem:
I was just thinking about this - could someone help me determine how a natal vertex in 8th house Cancer is supposed to manifest. What are they meant to experience? Thanks

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To be frank, tgem, my boyfriend's VERTEX is 8H (and in CAN), 2º conjunct his MERC, and my CERES-MENTOR-SCHRODINGER-NYMPHE (0º-2º30).

Well, his VERTEX is 0º00 square my SUN, even if the orbs expand to 2º30 including his MERC, and my 11H asteroid stellia.

We have a profound, deeply karmic, multidimensional relationship which has taught each other about sex, nurturing, and allows us to be free of the restrictions we place upon each other and ourselves (as a society). It's also quite serious and committed, even in spite of the circumstances (MERC is his 7R). We're also professional costars (his 10R, which is 0º conjunct his ACTOR) and met by sheer serendipity.

posted April 11, 2015 03:26 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Keela:
Thank you for getting back to these. I'll read what your other replies said after this. Quick commentary before more sleep:

As far as I recall whatever table on Astro had the East Point also square the MC so seemed pointless (so to speak) to require "calculations" if it was there. Have checked and seemed the square, although don't now remember what your EP post had for whatever would further pass for actual "calculations" beyond the Astro chart I recall. Or beyond just the "It's square" which it was in my case at least. I don't remember your thread emphasizing that there may actually be a couple of degrees of a difference, so it didn't occur to me that someone might actually NOT have it exactly square (when texts sold it to me as the square long long ago already). I don't use it that much per se but have to start checking for precision then if it's less accurate in other people's cases than appeared.

It's a natal draconic Sun opposite the same person's own East Point, conjunct West Point/Eq. DC , not synatry. I'll have to remind myself on what you wrote about those axis ends though, yes.

A synastry example with East Point would be a natal Eros conj own West Point, and a synastry Eros ~2 degrees from the East Point in "first house's" side opposite the Eros-WP -- although that's a different EP than the one in the first drac Sun example. This example's EP also has synastry of EP inconjunct Psyche exactly, but I'm not counting such for now. Well, I guess I could when the pattern is a returned aspect of the other Psyche ~2 trine the other EP as well to make it a Psyche-EP and EP-Eros style synastry "pair" contact, but anyway.

Peluches asked about a natal Pomona-Vertex connection as well if I recall, although further realize you already state you don't know much about Pomona. I have Pomona conjunct one of my two main name asteroids, and Ceres-Varuna-Aglaja (origin for Keela, as I learned after picking the name here) and more, but I couldn't say much about it since I never felt any maternal mother-nature type in the least, for the Ceres side at least. This with Ceres/Pluto and the two name asteroids both having their midpoints on my Ascendant. I can be pretty oblivious about possible suitors at times though, or not interested.

Off to read the rest.

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Hi Keela,

Just to give myself as an example, my Mc is at 3 Virgo and my Ep is at 7 Sagittarius. Technically they are within orb of a square, but there are a few degrees of difference there (4 degrees).

Here’s where to calculate the East Point/West Point Axis in your chart. You can find it at astro.com.

Choose > Extended Chart Selection > Pullen/Astrolog > Small format natal chart wheel, Pullen style > Add Lilith from additional objects list *somehow that shows up as EP* (it seems to be labeled incorrectly as Lilith, but I know it’s the EP, because I had my EP calculated on another software and it’s at exactly the same position). There you have it. When the image of your chart shows up, the EP is listed as the EP anyway. It’s only in the additional objects box that it’s listed as 'Lilith' for some reason. The West Point is always exactly opposite the East Point.

posted April 11, 2015 04:02 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by meissieri:
Great posts on synastry as always, Lotis. I didn't mind it being long, could read through it just fine!

I natally have Mercury parallel my 7th house Vertex, which, I realized with this and Aubyanne's thread, perfectly matches my 7th house ruler being conjunct Mercury.

Do parallels and contraparallels count for aspects? They'd be tight, so my gut says they could. Though in my case, it backs up something in my chart that was already there.

Vertex in Aries. Yes, people have shocked me with their bluntness and actions that were only in it for themselves. Like, people I never would've thought would do something (often bad) out of self-interest. Of course, in their eyes, it was just choosing something for themselves and they have other values. And of course it mostly shocked me since they wouldn't take me into account. But hey, it's my DSC sign, I need to own these traits more.

I don't really know if I have this "known all along" feeling about Libra, though, come to think of it, it does fit the negative example of someone doing/deciding something I feared they would (but really, really hoped they wouldn't). Especially in my social cicle actually - people at first seemed very welcome, accepting and nice to each other, only to find out, once I was closer friends with them, they gossiped a lot, would trash each other the second they'd left the room, etc. I just couldn't believe it - to people they called their best friends. But where does the "all along" thing come in? Because it scared me off. Once I saw what they did to others, part of me was always wary of them and yes, it always turned out they were just as brutal about me behind my back. Sometimes for things that could've easily been solved if they'd bothered to talk to me about it (like, we hung out a LOT, sure they'd have a chance to tell me if they really wanted to). And though I'm not proud of it, I once had a massive meltdown over it, flipping out at a couple of them who were at the wrong place at the wrong time, after months of trying to get along and please them. Of course I got a reputation after that and I got the sense they never truly gave me another chance.

Don't know how much that has to do with Libra. Maybe just the being more interested in looking like they were all a happy group of friends instead of trying to work out any problems (which of course means having to deal with the disharmony)?

A bit too personal to put out here, maybe, but I think it's good to give another non-romantic example of the Vertex and Antivertex.

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Thanks meissieri,

About aspects to the Vertex Axis. I'm not one of those that thinks only conjunctions and oppositions 'work' with the Vertex Axis. These might be the most potent connections but they are not the only ones that 'work'. I mean if the Vertex Axis is comparable to the Asc/Dsc, Mc/Ic, and the Nodes, then why only use conjunctions and oppositions? It doesn't make sense. We'd certainly take into account a trine to the Asc or the Mc, so what not the Vertex Axis? That's my stance anyway. Personally, I think any aspect to the Vertex Axis can work, it's just that some will be more powerful and influential then others. Even semi-squares seem to work to some extent. I've actually made a life-changing decision to move during a Vertex trine Moon transit. Ever since then I have not taken soft aspects to the Vertex Axis for granted. They do work. As for parallels and contraparallels... I'm not sure, but keep it in mind and see if it feels like it's working. I haven't looked into non-zodiac based aspects yet.

Oh, yeah, and the principles of the Vertex Axis can totally be applied to life event or synastry. Romantic or non-romantic. Except the Vertex tends to shock and surprise us, while the Antivertex kind of confirms our general suspicions. We can still be surprised by the details we get in Antivertex situations, but the general theme of what's happening tends to feel familiar to us in a way. We're not so shocked, just disappointed if it's bad, or excited if it's good.

I thought your examples using the signs of the Vertex and Anitvertex were pretty good. Vertex in Aries showing being surprised by selfishness kind of fits for the dark side of it. Selfishness and thoughtless bluntness tend to be the worst of Aries's stereotypical traits. Maybe the positive side of Vertex in Aries would be being surprised and impressed by courage and initiative in others. For the Antivertex, the negative side of Libra can be passive aggressive. They might smile at your face but vent about you when you're not around so as to avoid a confrontation (Libra's generally hate the unpleasantness associated with confrontation and often try to avoid it. Negatively, this can lead to talking about others behind their backs). So I can see how encountering pettiness in the social area could be the dark side of a Libra Antivertex. I think you were right in guessing this connection. It would feel more like a disappointing confirmation of your instincts rather then a total shocker (unless other transits indicated otherwise, like a Uranus transit of some kind). However, the details of who did what to whom would still be surprise. Perhaps the positive side of a Libra Antivertex would be people meeting your hopes in terms of how polite, kind, and fair they are.

posted April 11, 2015 10:57 AM            

I've spent the night watching teenage fans not get humour and am a bit tired by this stage now, but the info from the other thread was not a question of not getting something or it not being available there as it is already. And you likewise already stated the 4 degree difference between your MC and EP, same as me pointing out mine was exact. Redundant or unnecessary commentary both ways on that part. I offered the (other) chart details for clarification of something not tying to the mere checking of where EP is, the other bits being the relevant stuff. If anything is/was, which is always questionable. Your latest reply to me offered nothing *new*, unnecessary in that form.

What I tried to ask or draw attention to was the other stuff, like Peluches's question. I don't remember if we've had her around personally on this thread since that early one. As something new personally though, I need to check if Chiron was transiting square the VX-AVX now (or soon), although don't know how something like that would manifest either just now. Plus if it's square the angle, is it a foreseen conclusion or an unexpected thing then?

quote:

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Originally posted by Lotis White:
Hi Keela,

Just to give myself as an example, my Mc is at 3 Virgo and my Ep is at 7 Sagittarius. Technically they are within orb of a square, but there are a few degrees of difference there (4 degrees).

Here’s where to calculate the East Point/West Point Axis in your chart. You can find it at astro.com.

Choose > Extended Chart Selection > Pullen/Astrolog > Small format natal chart wheel, Pullen style > Add Lilith from additional objects list *somehow that shows up as EP* (it seems to be labeled incorrectly as Lilith, but I know it’s the EP, because I had my EP calculated on another software and it’s at exactly the same position). There you have it. When the image of your chart shows up, the EP is listed as the EP anyway. It’s only in the additional objects box that it’s listed as 'Lilith' for some reason. The West Point is always exactly opposite the East Point.

There's also a free astrology software called astrowin, that calculates the East Point (it also does a large variety of other astro-calculations). I downloaded it years ago, and have been using it ever since.

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posted April 11, 2015 03:58 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Aubyanne:

I think anyone with an 8H VERTEX (especially in a Water sign) is going to be confronted with powerful experiences regarding sex, intimacy, and deep transformation. He's certainly been going through that, and by extension, so have I.

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I have that, in Cancer in 8th house, conjunct Eros exact. opposing Sun/moon-mp, Saturn widely conjunct (4 degrees), Destinn also (2 degrees). Exact conjunct Pan.

posted April 12, 2015 06:36 AM            

It`s like saying Sun and IC (as Moon-point) are a soulmate pairing. While Sun on the IC is TREMENDOUSLY important, it is not a soulmate pairing like Sun-Moon.

The DESC is NOT Venus, the ASC is NOT Mars, even though there are of course similiarities.

But the planets and asteroids are players, the ASC are the setting of the stage, and actually GIVING the players a stage to act on.

posted April 12, 2015 07:16 AM            

There was definite Vertex-action when I first met and talked to Mr Sag.

Though it was more through progressions for me

pr Mercury and pr Venus conjunct pr AVX on 18 Aquarius, with my natal Moon on 17 Aquarius - oh I see more the Antivertex kind.

This is also relevant as they are my 5th, 7th and 8th house rulers.

Interestingly, since my Mercury is going to turn retro next year or so, it means that he will once again touch my Antivertex, just this time on 25 Leo, and being followed by pr Moon conjunct pr Vertex in july next year.

well to be precice 11th july 2016
pr Vertex 25°15 Leo
pr Moon 25°15 Leo
pr Mercury 25°11 Aquarius

(funny enought that is the degree of Mr Sag`s and my davison Isis-Osiris-conjunction and our composite Vertex is on 25°27 Leo).

Well for him it`s not much going on, just pr Uranus on 25°00 Scorpio.

As for transits when I was meeting him.

Just Tr Jupiter on my n Antivertex

though the transiting Chiron-NN-conjunction was widely conjunct my pr Antivertex (2-3 degrees).

--------------------------------

Looking up 3 weeks ago
(seems weird, but seeing that musical then, I don´t know maybe cause ont he equinox, the day after the ecclipse, but it feels like something was going on).

Well pr Mercury is already in orb for conj. my pr Avx (0°25), and in fact on the degree of my natal Psyche and mean Lilith (24 Aquarius)

Tr Mars was square my n Vertex (which of course always includes my Sun/Moon - mp and EROS, as they are on the same degree-axis)

I wonder how it will feel when Tr Uranus will get in orb for squaring that!

In fact I was looking up the transits for july (this is when I have tickets for the musical "Paradise of Pain", and the last one scheduled so far for seeing Mr Sag this year), and by then Tr Uranus will clearly be in orb (under one degree applying to square my Vertex-axis). additionally Tr Jupiter will be EXACT conjunct my pr Vertex (and our composite Vertex).

It is actually funny how our progressed chart angles relate to the composite, though in different ways.

posted April 12, 2015 07:27 AM            

A Houseboat Party
(I naturally met him after a performance, and there was a bit of a crowd there, so it fits I guess. lol)

A Forest Fire Is Being Subdued By The Use Of Water, Chemicals And Sheer Muscular Energy
(yeah, Forest Fire seems about right, and it took a lot of force to keep it subdued. lol)

And now I am going throuh pr Vertex on 24 Leo

A Large Camel Is Seen Crossing A Vast And Forbidding Desert
(definitely feels like that. lol)

Gotta go through thta to reach the pr Vertex and pr Moon on 25 Leo though

After The Heavy Storm, A Rainbow

I suppose the only way is up

For him is pr Uranus is on the verge of crossing from 24 to 25 Scorpio

An X-Ray Photograph

American Indians Making Camp After Moving Into A New Territory

His pr Vertex is at 27 Libra, having just separated from the square to n Venus on 25°55 Capricorn,

A Man Becoming Aware Of Spiritual Forces Surrounding And Assisting Him

posted April 13, 2015 05:10 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Lotis White:
Thanks meissieri,

About aspects to the Vertex Axis. I'm not one of those that thinks only conjunctions and oppositions 'work' with the Vertex Axis. These might be the most potent connections but they are not the only ones that 'work'. I mean if the Vertex Axis is comparable to the Asc/Dsc, Mc/Ic, and the Nodes, then why only use conjunctions and oppositions? It doesn't make sense. We'd certainly take into account a trine to the Asc or the Mc, so what not the Vertex Axis? That's my stance anyway. Personally, I think any aspect to the Vertex Axis can work, it's just that some will be more powerful and influential then others. Even semi-squares seem to work to some extent. I've actually made a life-changing decision to move during a Vertex trine Moon transit. Ever since then I have not taken soft aspects to the Vertex Axis for granted. They do work. As for parallels and contraparallels... I'm not sure, but keep it in mind and see if it feels like it's working. I haven't looked into non-zodiac based aspects yet.

Oh, yeah, and the principles of the Vertex Axis can totally be applied to life event or synastry. Romantic or non-romantic. Except the Vertex tends to shock and surprise us, while the Antivertex kind of confirms our general suspicions. We can still be surprised by the details we get in Antivertex situations, but the general theme of what's happening tends to feel familiar to us in a way. We're not so shocked, just disappointed if it's bad, or excited if it's good.

I thought your examples using the signs of the Vertex and Anitvertex were pretty good. Vertex in Aries showing being surprised by selfishness kind of fits for the dark side of it. Selfishness and thoughtless bluntness tend to be the worst of Aries's stereotypical traits. Maybe the positive side of Vertex in Aries would be being surprised and impressed by courage and initiative in others. For the Antivertex, the negative side of Libra can be passive aggressive. They might smile at your face but vent about you when you're not around so as to avoid a confrontation (Libra's generally hate the unpleasantness associated with confrontation and often try to avoid it. Negatively, this can lead to talking about others behind their backs). So I can see how encountering pettiness in the social area could be the dark side of a Libra Antivertex. I think you were right in guessing this connection. It would feel more like a disappointing confirmation of your instincts rather then a total shocker (unless other transits indicated otherwise, like a Uranus transit of some kind). However, the details of who did what to whom would still be surprise. Perhaps the positive side of a Libra Antivertex would be people meeting your hopes in terms of how polite, kind, and fair they are.

As for platonic examples, the general principles of fateful surprises, and fateful confirmation of suspicions, can be applied to any situation. Business, friendship, opportunities, communicating messages. Anything really. If you read my first response to Keela I give an example using a hypothetical business deal. Maybe that will help clarify.

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Thanks Lotis!

Yes, I'm starting to look at all Vertex aspects as well. If you can feel its influence, it's probably there, so I don't like these restrictions on the Vertex aspects either. True, it's been described as an axis on some websites, so it just makes more sense if they work together. As for the parallels, hmm. I think I can feel it, though it gets hard to tell this apart from the 'Mercury conj 7th house ruler' thing.

Love that distinction. Now I'm really starting to see the difference, and I'd agree with what you said on feeling similar to the ASC and DSC. I can still feel shocked by the Antivertex, but that could be your suggestion about Uranus transits. But what would a square (which is to both ends) or semisquare & sesquisquare do? Some sort of conflict with both in the nature of the planet that makes the squares?

Wow, you're right again, that fits for Libra and being positively surprised. Ironically, I've found that the people who were the most genuinely kind and fair to me - Libra-ish - in crisis had very strong Aries placements or Scorpio/Pluto. Pretty much the exact opposite of who you would expect to be tactful and sensitive. But they were and turned out to be a much better match for me than those polite, fair types that I looked up to so much at first. Lol or is that that Aries Vertex again?
But yes, oh boy do I know about avoiding unpleasantness and shaking things up. Though I try hard to either talk to someone or to just keep it to myself when something's bothering me, I do really struggle not to be evasive and avoid confrontations. I clam up when other people overwhelm me with "stuff that needs to be settled right now omg" all of a sudden, but it is a good lesson for me and it has made me try to be more honest... and to patiently point out that getting right into someone's face might have the opposite effect of what you wanted (and they get scared off).

Hmm, I'd love to read of anyone here who has it the other way around: Vertex in Libra with an Aries Antivertex. If they face similar challenges.

Oh, yes, I think I read that. About the woman seeing it coming because the aspect was to her Antivertex, while the man was completely shocked, right?
Loved that as an example. I like seeing how the Vertex plays out between people who aren't in a relationship.

Mm... maybe a Venus transit to your Vertex could be finding the perfect shade of lipstick in your favourite shop or a type of dress you've been looking for for a while. Or handling a conflict with someone which you've been putting off very well - and you didn't think you would. And for Mars... maybe someone takes you to this new kind of sport/exercise they're into and you're surprised to be so natural at it (and/or enjoy it as much as you do).

posted April 14, 2015 02:58 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Ceridwen:
oh and my EP is still at 4 Cap and conjunct my Venus on 6 Cap (and your Sun, Lotis? )

There was definite Vertex-action when I first met and talked to Mr Sag.

Though it was more through progressions for me

pr Mercury and pr Venus conjunct pr AVX on 18 Aquarius, with my natal Moon on 17 Aquarius - oh I see more the Antivertex kind.

This is also relevant as they are my 5th, 7th and 8th house rulers.

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Hi Ceri,

Yeah, my Sun is at 5 Capricorn on your EP. My EP is at 6 or 7 Sagittarius, I think on your Asc. Interesting synastry interplay.

I was wondering if you've been able to decipher the difference between the VX and the AVX in your encounters? That is, the AVX is a feeling of familiarity and knowing that occurs in a way that seems fateful, while the VX is paradigm shifting shocker that occurs in a way that seems fateful.

Hmmm... With your AVX in Capricorn, the AVX represents things that you kind of suspect, as well as things you hope for. So it shows you're not surprised by issues to do with practicality, and finances (you kind of expect them and understand their significance), and that you consciously long for certain things associated with the sign Capricorn, and what it’s ruler Saturn is doing. Saturnine strength and security would be an important part of what you long for. When you encounter this energy it’s like you ‘recognize’ it as having personal meaning to you, especially if the conjunction is tight.

With the VX in Cancer, what can blindside you is emotional issues. Like perhaps you can be shocked by your own reaction to things, or by the reactions of others. The VX is where we make discoveries that turn out to be a game-changer. So fateful shocks and surprises have an emotional tone here, and the Moon would show more details on this.

Weirdly I think you chart has some overlap. Vx in the 8th house and AVX ruler in the 8th house. AVX in the 2nd house and VX ruler in the 2nd house. My only conclusion here is that there’s sometimes overlap between what you expect and what blindsides you. Kind of like you get a bit of both mixed together at times.

Oh yeah, and when it comes to romantic attraction, one thing I’ve started to notice is that the VX and the AVX tends to show scenarios, situations, and relating dynamics, that press our buttons rather then personality traits to which we are drawn like the 5th, 7th, and 8th houses. The 5th, 7th, and 8th houses show our ‘type’ in personality while the Vertex Axis shows more the types of love ‘storylines’ that resonate with us.

Like when we’re attracted to someone that activates our 5th, 7th, or 8th houses, it’s because we love some aspect of their personality and style.

When we’re attracted to someone that activates our Vertex Axis, it’s because they bring experiences to us in a way that feels fated, and because we have a certain dynamic with them that feels ’right’. The connection plays out in a way that feels meaningful. I think we can appreciate that traits associated with our Vertex Axis, but this is largely because these traits allow us to have certain kinds of experience with the person influencing our Vertex Axis.

The AVX shows how things play out when we get the kind of love ‘storylline’ we were expecting or yearning for. The VX shows what happens when something crazy unexpected happens in love and we have to adjust to a knew way of understanding things. Both experiences have the fated, meaningful vibe.

Of course sometimes there’s an overlap between the symbolism of the 5th, 7th, and 8th houses, and the Vertex Axis. So in this case there is both the personality based attraction and the scenario based attraction.

I also have a theory on why some people are more attracted to their AVX while others are more attracted to their VX. Those more attracted to the AVX tend to have strong expectations about what they think they want, and to some extent are meant to get what they hoped for. Those more attracted to their VX tend to be more open to whatever fate brings them, and are to some extent meant to be surprised what they get, and to be excited about learning how to appreciate new things.

Personally, I think I’m more of an AVX type of person. I’m pretty opinionated about what I want. I even have a planet (Uranus) conjunct my AVX. Oddly, I expect a certain amount of surprise with Uranus on the AVX. I’m not completely opposed to attracting my VX energy though. I’m just more AVX oriented in general.

posted April 14, 2015 03:10 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by meissieri:
Thanks Lotis!

Yes, I'm starting to look at all Vertex aspects as well. If you can feel its influence, it's probably there, so I don't like these restrictions on the Vertex aspects either. True, it's been described as an axis on some websites, so it just makes more sense if they work together. As for the parallels, hmm. I think I can feel it, though it gets hard to tell this apart from the 'Mercury conj 7th house ruler' thing.

Love that distinction. Now I'm really starting to see the difference, and I'd agree with what you said on feeling similar to the ASC and DSC. I can still feel shocked by the Antivertex, but that could be your suggestion about Uranus transits. But what would a square (which is to both ends) or semisquare & sesquisquare do? Some sort of conflict with both in the nature of the planet that makes the squares?

Wow, you're right again, that fits for Libra and being positively surprised. Ironically, I've found that the people who were the most genuinely kind and fair to me - Libra-ish - in crisis had very strong Aries placements or Scorpio/Pluto. Pretty much the exact opposite of who you would expect to be tactful and sensitive. But they were and turned out to be a much better match for me than those polite, fair types that I looked up to so much at first. Lol or is that that Aries Vertex again?
But yes, oh boy do I know about avoiding unpleasantness and shaking things up. Though I try hard to either talk to someone or to just keep it to myself when something's bothering me, I do really struggle not to be evasive and avoid confrontations. I clam up when other people overwhelm me with "stuff that needs to be settled right now omg" all of a sudden, but it is a good lesson for me and it has made me try to be more honest... and to patiently point out that getting right into someone's face might have the opposite effect of what you wanted (and they get scared off).

Hmm, I'd love to read of anyone here who has it the other way around: Vertex in Libra with an Aries Antivertex. If they face similar challenges.

Oh, yes, I think I read that. About the woman seeing it coming because the aspect was to her Antivertex, while the man was completely shocked, right?
Loved that as an example. I like seeing how the Vertex plays out between people who aren't in a relationship.

Mm... maybe a Venus transit to your Vertex could be finding the perfect shade of lipstick in your favourite shop or a type of dress you've been looking for for a while. Or handling a conflict with someone which you've been putting off very well - and you didn't think you would. And for Mars... maybe someone takes you to this new kind of sport/exercise they're into and you're surprised to be so natural at it (and/or enjoy it as much as you do).

Anyway, I'll be paying more attention to Vertex transits for now.

---

Thanks for the response meissieri,

Yeah, I'm actually about to post a section on how to interpret aspects to the Vertex Axis. All aspects, not just hard ones.

posted April 14, 2015 03:27 AM            

Aspects to the Vertex Axis

It’s my experience in synastry that we can look an just about any type of aspect to the Vertex Axis to gauge it’s impact. When it comes to natal aspects to the Vertex Axis, these too impact the types of experience we have with Vertex & Antivertex encounters. I’d advocate using way more then conjunctions and oppositions when studying the Vertex aspects in synastry, natal charts, and transits. All aspects do seem to have some subtle influence to the quality of experience to be had.

When not much was known about the Vertex Axis it made sense that we’d only look at conjunctions and oppositions to study the crux of the what the Vertex Axis means. These days, I think we are past that beginning phase. Personally, I’ve noticed that trines, squares, sextiles, and even semi-squares, can show patterns to how we encounter Vertex & Antivertex people and situations in our lives. I’ve noticed this with synastry, transits, and natal charts. Yes, I believe trines and sextiles to the Vertex Axis have valid important meaning. To me there’s no logic to only using hard aspects for this Axis, when we use ALL other aspects to any other Axis in the chart. Why the difference? I think it’s just a tactic used for studying the Vertex Axis in the early days that’s become ingrained. It’s no longer necessary to stick to this convention. We know enough about the crux of the Vertex Axis and it’s meaning now that we can confidently use any aspect to it for analysis. That’s my take, anyway.

Sorry Aubyanne, I guess we have to agree to disagree when it comes to the influence of soft aspects to the vertices. I have both the trine and sextile strong in my natal chart, and so I can pick up on that energy very easily. I feel them quite keenly to the Vertex Axis. My experience with synastry is that the person trining/sextiling this Axis is able to harmonize well with my fated experiences. They fit in well with the changes and circumstances that occur, and add a sense of meaning to them. It’s a gentle process where you feel supported and encouraged in the personally significant changes you need to make. The person can tune into things that feel relevant for you and kind of echo them back to you, but with their own take on it.

Squares to our Vertex Axis can indicate dramatic, dynamic circumstances to how we experience both Vertex and Antivertex encounters. Squares tend to rock the boat and create a big drama. There may be something somewhat disturbing or upsetting about how fateful events occur, however they will also be great motivators for us to jump into action, and become enthused. With a square to the Vertex Axis, even when something good comes to us in a fateful sort of way we might be weirdly conflicted about it. Part of us may not believe what we get though the square is ‘real’ until we’ve had time to process it. It takes us a while to figure out how to deal with it, fit it into our lives, and generally accept it. Hard aspects take effort. They can be stressful but also very rewarding. A square to our Vertex Axis makes us feel as if we’ve grown and changed a lot as a result of what happened. There may have been some growing pains but ultimately we feel as if we’ve gone through some type of dramatic transformation.

* A planet square the Vertex Axis strongly activates BOTH ends of the of this Axis. We get both some things that we were expecting, and some things that are shocking. There’s a mixture suspicions being confirmed, and surprising curve balls tossed our way. Either way, there’s a kind of meaningful, fated, electric vibe to what’s happening.

Trines and sextiles are interesting here. I’ve noticed that trines to the Vertex indicate a strong resonance with Vertex type encounters (unanticipated opportunities), while trines to the Antivertex indicate a strong resonance with Antivertex type encounters (suspected or hoped for opportunities). Trines flow, and so a trine to flows more easily into the point in question. When a planet is trine/sextile the Vertex Axis as a whole in the natal chart, the point that is trined will be more powerfully influenced, with a little bit of input also coming from the sextiled point. The sextile provides a supportive influence.

* A planet trine the Vertex will give you a lot of the unexpected, and a little bit of what you already suspected or hoped for.

* A planet trine the Antivertex will give you a lot of what you already suspected or hoped for, and a little bit of the unexpected.

Trines/sextiles to the Vertex indicate that the fateful turning points in your life tend to come about in a smooth and harmonious manner, rather then with a sharp jolt (as with hard aspects). We are readily able to assimilate them, and figure out how to incorporate them into our lives. Trines and sextiles to our Vertex Axis tend to bring a light happy feeling to how we 'turn corners' in life. We almost can't believe how readily it happened, or our luck at the opportunities we chance upon.

Last but not least…

posted April 15, 2015 01:19 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Ceridwen:
To be honest it doesn`t sit right with me to use Pomona and Vertex as soulmate pairings, the myth might fit, but they are very different things astrologically- astronomically.
Vertex is a calculated angle, Pomona is an asteroid.

It`s like saying Sun and IC (as Moon-point) are a soulmate pairing. While Sun on the IC is TREMENDOUSLY important, it is not a soulmate pairing like Sun-Moon.

The DESC is NOT Venus, the ASC is NOT Mars, even though there are of course similiarities.

But the planets and asteroids are players, the ASC are the setting of the stage, and actually GIVING the players a stage to act on.

It`s not Romeo and Juliet in union, but that would be like Romeo connecting with the stage itself. While very important, not a soulmate story per se, unless Julia also connects in that way with Romeo and the stage.

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posted April 15, 2015 04:04 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Aubyanne:
I'd have to say then, Lotis, that if you have trines and sextiles to the VERTEX natally, you may feel them. I personally don't. But conjunctions I can feel easily within 4º.

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posted April 16, 2015 03:14 AM            

Once again a very big thank you for a great thread.

posted April 17, 2015 04:13 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Ceridwen:
mr sag`s Venus is conjunct my Avx by 4°28.
I am always on the fence about this one. Valid or not?

(also paralle by 0°56)

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Hi Ceri,

posted April 17, 2015 04:25 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Eternalone:
Great Thread.
LindaLand is the only place where one gets all the answers and its continuosly evolving place too.
Lot of hard work put in by lotis white.Thank you so much for your efforts regarding Vertex-Antivertex, you have added lot of new information in a very simple language to understand. your style of writing is quite unique.
I wanted to ask you one question though, How do you think draconic vertex-antivertex respond ?doesDraconic-Draconic synastry, draconic-tropical synastry should be considered while reading a synastry chart?

Once again a very big thank you for a great thread.

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Thanks Eternalone,

posted April 17, 2015 04:48 AM            

When there are links from the Draco to the tropical VERTEX, there's a specific area of our soul that's being tugged towards growth and development, which can be harnessed via the Draco points contacted, once we activate them through enough work in our tropical. (I've come to see how the tropical is actually preparing us to unlock certain features in our Draconic.)

So, as you'd imagine, the dVERTEX is on a whole other level. These experiences are at the seat of our soul. They offer growth that's not only fated, but can help us further along towards true ascension and oneness. It is, after all, the VERTEX's most evolved and high-minded form. Anytime it's hit in the tropical, that point carries with it a special resonance. If we can master its traits or function, it's a 'cheat code' to unlocking the power of the dVERTEX, and bringing its operation from the fifth into the third dimension.

This has been the theory thus far.

I agree we can widen orbs for 'the electric axis'. It's pretty powerful. Asteroid orbs suffice, and mathematically calculated points orbs are ideal. Nonetheless, 3° and 4° tend to be clearly felt here.