posted April 18, 2003 11:49 PM         

Does anybody have any suggestions for dealing with someone who is doing some big-time harassing?

Some background: About 7 months ago I ended a lifelong "friendship" with a person that I, between my spiritual seeking and therapy, came to recognize as a very toxic influence. She was extremely negative and did all the taking while I did all the giving, proving to be emotionally and psychically DRAINING. She did not take this well at all. She over time involved my entire family and other acquaintances of mine (which was reported back to me). All I did was withdraw from her and she's shown no regard whatsoever for my need to focus on me for once in my life and take care of myself. No matter; I have held my ground and am all the stronger for doing so.

The REAL problem concerns her daughter and my older daughter. They too, were lifelong "friends" due to their mothers' association (me and my ex friend). When the break occurred between me and my friend, I made it clear that both my daughters had to make their own decisions regarding their continued contact with my ex friend and her daughter.

Well, my younger daughter has stayed out of the mess completely, trying to remain as neutral as possible under the circumstances. My older daughter however, decided to reconnect with my ex friend's daughter and it has been completely disastrous. After a few weeks of hanging out with her, my daughter decided on her own that she, too, no longer wanted to associate with this young woman or her mother (my ex friend...still with me?)

In the interim...this person had a break-up with her BF and has gone quite ballistic. She is accusing MY daughter of causing the break, saying she seduced him and that she has the digital pics to prove it. Her mother (my ex "friend") e-mailed my brother with a letter that could be called nothing less than a defamation of my girl's character. My daughter swears she did not do what she's accused of. Unfortunately, during the time she was hanging out with this person, some pics were taken with a digital camera of my daughter, but nothing compromising at all. This person has a lot of know-how regarding working with computers. She knows how to hack into accounts and send viruses; she also knows how to tamper with and alter digital pics to make them appear different from the originals.

A few weeks back, this person went to my daughter's place of employment and attacked her verbally in such a vicious manner that security had to be called, and then the police. The officer paid this person a visit and gave her a warning. Then...just today, my daughter received a phonecall at home from her boss informing her that the person in question called another employee at work, saying the same horrible things about my daughter that she's been saying for a while now, adding that she intends to contact my daughter's BF as well. The employee is a close friend of my daughter's and was very upset. My girl's BF knows all about what's been going on, so there is no real danger of harm coming to their relationship. However...with all that's been happening and continues to happen...MY daughter is becoming a nervous wreck and very depressed. Then just tonight my younger daughter and I were driving home and as we turned onto the street we live on, we saw this young woman pull out and speed like a demon around our car. She'd obviously driven by our house, and my younger daughter was so upset she was convinced this person broke into our home and killed our cat...or something equally harmful. This whole thing is getting out of hand!

One more thing: this person is a practicing witch. The "magic" she does is the manipulative kind though; she has bragged to me in the past of the spells she cast and the results she got. My girls and I all sense that this person is now performing negative magic of some kind to hurt us.

posted April 19, 2003 12:46 AM         

Secondly, the first thing I'd do is inform the proper authorities. Let them know what is going on, tell them the name of the woman and any other info on her if they request and/or require it. If possible, get a restraining order. This woman is definately out for something, and I'm a bit worried.

If you feel the need to get it all off your chest, please feel free to e-mail me. I'll always be around to help you, even if it's just to listen and offer support.

Zauberin

posted April 19, 2003 03:09 AM         

Thank you for responding in such a caring manner and for suggesting I e-mail you. If you give Randall your permission to send me your address, I will write. Or, you can ask him for mine; either way. If you should decide the latter, please let me know who you are in the subject line so I don't delete it, okay? Thanks again.

posted April 19, 2003 03:42 AM         

1. This is slander. This woman is slandering your daughter, and causing defamation of character. This is punishable by law.

2. This is harassment. She is harassing your daughter, and by her actions threatens her employment and personal security, and peace of mind. This is also punishable by law.

3. This is threatened blackmail. Fake or no, this woman's computer skills are sufficient that she could publish your daughter's doctored pics online (this would be "libel"). This is also punishable by law.

4. This woman believes herself beyond reasonable and legal limits. Perhaps she is sociopathic or psychotic; certainly she seems unhinged. She is looking for any loophole to hurt your family. She has crossed many lines and must be stopped or she may cross more.

5. This is no time to be stoic. You, the only adult in this situation apparently, need to set some strong limits and take action. You have to take back the control this woman has been stealing from you all.

Depending on your daughter's age, she, or you and she together, must talk to her boss and explain you wish an office groupmail/memo be sent (or posted) to the effect that someone (the woman) is trying to disrupt the workplace, and advise they not give this woman the time of day, and that they report any breach in security right away. It's not too late for this-- clearly the attack was sucessful in that the worry is still in effect for your daughter, her co-workers, and maybe the boss. Don't let this vicious lying woman win this battle. Work with the boss on how is best to approach this. It's in the company's best interests to address this, and the boss should at least wish to set the tone. If nothing is done your daughter's reputation will have a shadow around it. People feel better when they are involved and have a plan for what to do in these uncomfortable situations in case it happens again or escalates, so honesty and an upfront approach are vital.

Explore your legal options immediately. A letter from your attorney, or sheriff, or legal aid office will go a long way to make clear to the woman that her behaviour is unacceptable and must cease. One of those "Without Prejudice" letters might do.

WHILE the above is taken care of, ask a Wiccan for help in how to approach the problem from a witchcraft or spiritual protection point of view. WychofAvalon is a Wiccan, maybe someone has her email. You and your daughters can hold protection and cleansing rituals at home -- walk with a white candle around the house, bless the rooms, etc.-- create a safe space again.

Liars are hard to beat-- but they can be beaten. But do not let her crap go unaddressed -- she has done damage, done serious boundary crossing -- this abuse needs healing action --and letting the woman have the last lying word just gives all your, and your daughters' power away.

Don't let her madwoman/bogeyman dance scare you. We do really have laws against these things. And frequently the best way to clear the Dark is to involve other people in the story a little (not too much, none of you have anything to hide, but keep brief and dignified)-- in that way lighting the torch of Truth, so all may see and judge for themselves.

Peace and much, much Light, dear Twin Lady,

posted April 19, 2003 04:10 AM         

I think Zaubarin and Lunargirl are right on target. Contact the authorities sooner rather than later, before it gets any worse.!

On the witchy matter..

Here's a good spell for protection -

quote:

---

A Psychic Protection Spell

Tools you will need are:
Protection Incense (herbs or oils work fine also)
Black 8" Taper Candle

It is best to find a work area that you can leave untouched for three days. If you must put away your tools, try to at least keep your spell candle out in the open. This spell is used to protect yourself from mental attacks. Read over this spell and customize it prior to use-the work will go much smoother. Prepare your work area by setting up any tools you may use in addition to your spell candle. Love or protection incense is recommended (herbs or oils can also be used).

While setting up your area, CONCENTRATE on the purpose of your work. Just prior to your work, bathe in purification herbs, or with your favorite bath salts. While you are bathing, concentrate again on the purpose of your spell. Do not let negative thoughts enter your mind.

After bathing, go to your work area. Cast a circle and light some incense.

Envision a large, white ball of light surrounding you, your work area, and your home.

Hold the candle between the palms of your hands and direct all of your positive energy into the candle. Place the candle in its candle holder. Prior to lighting the candle, say (either aloud, or to yourself): "This candle represents protection over me in all things" Light the candle and say (either aloud or to yourself): "As the light of this flame grows, I can feel the light and positive energy around me. As this candle burns, everything around me is blessed with light and love. I am blessed with light and love. Negative energy is being banished."

Sit back and watch the candle burn. Keep visualizing the white ball of light and protection around you. Envision your Higher Power blessing you and protecting you from harm. See yourself blessing whoever or whatever it is that brings harm to you. Bless them so that they may be happy and will no longer wish to cause you harm. Feel the peace and love.

When the candle had burned 1/3 of the way, say "As the flame of the candle is extinguished--evil, negativity, and harm towards me is banished" and extinguish the candle.

Repeat this for two more nights.

On the last night, after the candle has burned away and the leftover wax has cooled, discard the wax in the garbage to symbolize throwing away that which causes you harm. You have been blessed with Light, Love, Peace, and Protection. Whatever was causing you harm will no longer do so.

---

There's more where I found that - http://zsuzsana.com/psychic_self_defense.htm

Do a search on psychic protection and there will be all sorts to choose from. The one above just happens to be a favorite of mine, it's pretty simple.

posted April 19, 2003 05:07 AM           

I guess the most important thing I think is to arrange an appointment with your local police and discuss the situation with someone there. Explain your concerns/worries and ask them to pass by your house when they are patrolling that area. They could probably have a chat to the family involved and remind them that they do not have the right to threaten and defamate people.

Don't pay any attention to anything this person does or says, just ignore it all to the best of your ability while keeping close friends/co-workers etc informed of the trouble you are having and to be on the watchout.

Move on from these people, they sound more like trouble makers than an actual threat and I am guessing that if you take the appropriate steps with the police etc they will realise you are not going to stand for their bull**** and give up.

posted April 19, 2003 12:53 PM         

Your responses remind me once again how glad I am to have found Lindaland. Here's what's been done so far:

After the attack at my daughter's place of employment, the police was contacted, the woman was paid a visit by an officer and given a warning. My daughter was given a number to call should anything more occur and she has made a follow-up one since this began, asking about her options. She was told there isn't a whole lot she can do unless/until actual physical harm is inflicted and more "evidence" is collected. We are going to find out more about a restraining order.

Last week my brother stopped by with the printed letters from this woman's mother (my ex friend) about my daughter. In her anger over my daughter contacting the police, she was quoted to say that SHE would have taken her chances with the law and slapped my daughter silly! At first my brother was going to block e-mail from her (as I had done months earlier) but then decided against it; feeling that if he kept the lines open and she should send any more defaming letters, this could be used against her -- if not with the police (she moved out of state a few years ago) then at least towards having her removed from her ISP.

My daughter spoke with her boss more extensively on this matter, fearing the situation could jeopardize her job. Her boss assured her this was not the case and he already posted an alert to the other employees regarding the problem. He also told my daughter the next time this woman attempts to harass her or anyone else working there he would call the police himself. However, my daughter works in one specialized department of a place open to the general public and was told that having this woman barred from the premises was not possible.

As to my role in all of this: because my daughter is an adult, I am limited legally to that of a supporter; not an easy position to be in since my maternal instinct drives me to want to take control and strike back wherever possible. But I AM good at support and feel confident that working WITH my daughter rather than FOR her will be effective. Emotionally...I am more angry than afraid and agree wholeheartedly about having fear and giving one's power away...I am stressing this emphatically to my daughter now.

Something I find ironic is the fact that the mother (my former "friend") has complained and carried on endlessly to me in the past about what a pathological LIAR her daughter is, including my witnessing first hand in my own home a few years ago, a screaming match between the two of them on just this topic. Yet now all of a sudden because she is p****d at me she is willing to believe her daughter and join her in spreading lies about mine.

Harpyr, thank you for the link; the articles were very helpful. We are going to do the protection spell as soon as we acquire the materials; I'll probably have to order the candle online.

In closing, I'd like to share that my daughter has read these posts and wanted me to extend her heartfelt thanks for all of your caring. She was struck by your sensitivity and intuitiveness about this situation and told me this. I replied, "That's why I'm there, Honey." I knew you guys would help; not just with practical advice but in a spiritual vein too. My daughter also commented on her perception of advanced evolvement on this forum and was very comforted by the reassurance that not everyone is like the person who is trying to destroy her. Love and thanks from both of us.

I'll post any ongoing developments.

posted April 19, 2003 02:13 PM         

Do you read the Tarot? I ALWAYS consult the cards before I take a step towards someone magically. I invariably find things I had not considered in my unsettled, harrasssed or confused state (depending upon the problem). The cards have enlightened me to situations and the solutions many, many times--sometimes I have been told to wait it out, that things were about to happen that would bring relief on its own, or that someone was already working on the problem, or there were forces at work I was not aware of, or something about the person I did not know that was causing his/her behavior which put me at an advantage in handling the situation--sometimes there was no need for magical intervention and sometimes there was.

posted April 20, 2003 02:51 PM         

Harpyr's ritual and link are very helpful, too - I bookmarked that page!

Very glad to hear more about what your family is doing -- and if I forgot to mention it in my very (naturally! ) Arien-style post, your daughter is lucky to have such a great, supportive, information-seeking MOM.

Keep us up to date.

posted April 20, 2003 11:54 PM         

Last night my daughter told me that she will be going "into hiding" for the coming week. She will be staying with a friend that this "person" knows nothing about...name, address, phone number...nothing. She tells me she needs time away from everything so she can think this through. She is also going to speak to her boss about taking the week off from work - - her "nemesis" has been seen several times at my daughter's place of employment, wandering around and obviously looking for her, thinking she would be working Saturday. To top this off, she has in addition been calling my daughter's workmate/friend (the one who was called while working the other day)...on HER cell phone...a total of 13 times yesterday. No one knows how she even got the cell phone number. Now my daughter is afraid to go to work and this week will be looking for another job.

I feel so helpless. Last night I spoke to her father (my ex-husband) about it and he simply said that this is our daughter's problem and only she can fix it. (?) The trouble is, she is afraid to fix it. I tried to tell her that by hiding and not going to work, this person is accomplishing exactly what she set out to do and my daughter is giving her control over her life, but she just says this is what she feels she has to do for now. Her BF is being very loving and supportive, but he is worried about her too.

This is so hard. I can't believe things have escalated to this point...and why? Because my daughter wisely decided she would rather not be involved with someone's craziness and obsessions. BTW...this person is so delusional that she has been projecting her own guilt onto my daughter...it was SHE who cheated on her BF and this (along with her lying to him about everything) is why he left; not because of anything my daughter did!

Please keep her in your prayers. Other than working on Harpyr's suggestions, my hands seem to be tied. This has got to be one of the toughest parts of parenting: having to stand by and watch your child (and they're always a child to you, no matter what the chronological age) make mistakes and get hurt is painful enough, but it's agonizing to have to worry about their physical and emotional safety as well.

posted April 21, 2003 04:47 PM         

People!!!!!! Sometimes, I just don't know...

Twin Lady, you can only do your best. If I could FedEx some fightin' courage to your daughter, I would, but you're right, only she can act. Maybe what is playing out here is larger than our comprehension - karma at work - and I hope your daughter will make peace with her oppressor some way. I just don't believe one can ignore somebody else waging war on them.

I want to mention a technique I have read about elsewhere on the 'Net for helping stop those with bad intentions. At the very least, it might give your daughter a laugh, and being able to laugh at a bogeyman is a way of breaking their power.

Your daughter could hand out a few disposable cameras and notebooks to the other people being harassed (family, friends, colleagues). Every time this woman shows up, they could take her picture, and write down the time, what she said, etc. This would probably enrage this woman (scary in the short term), but would empower your daughter, and send a strong message that people are not taking her garbage behaviour, as well as helping your daughter document the incidents of harassment to take to the police, or convince a judge of the need for protection.

Bullies who rely on silence and fear just _hate_ having their photo taken, and their activities brought out into the public eye.

I do realize that this woman is quite unwell -- perhaps she needs our healing energies too -- but I do not like bullying behaviour of any stripe.

Meantime I hope your daughter gets the respite she needs, but also that she continues to reach out to people. If she seeks them out, perhaps she'll be able to connect with others who can advise her. Sometimes we just can't act on the love and info from our parents. Do you have a trusted family friend she could talk to? Maybe she could find a mental health professional who could try to assess the situation.

Maybe some kind of mediation is possible -- again, a mental health professional or a legal advisor of some kind. Because the way you've described the situation, this is an endgame for the woman where maybe even she has no clear idea of what she wants from your daughter. Maybe it's also based in her need to be heard and validated and witnessed, too (whether distorted or not!).

Maybe this is a job for Dr. Phil!!!! ( <-- I'm serious)

Meantime, dear Twin Lady, do all you can to take care of yourself. I'm sure you are.

posted April 21, 2003 05:54 PM         

Also...the technique you mentioned, re taking her pic whenever/wherever this person shows up and documenting the time of her calls: I hadn't shared this previously, but in fact my daughter goes to college with a friend who happens to work at one of those anonymous hotline places and he gave her the very same suggestion. She has the advantage of knowing him personally so was able to call him at home, then meet him for breakfast the next day, plus she told me he wouldn't mind meeting me too if I'd like to discuss any of this with him.

She came away from her conversations with him feeling somewhat better, and glad to have someone like him in her corner, given his experience with similar (and worse) situations.

Please believe me when I say that the support we've been receiving from the people here is really helping. I just finished speaking with my daughter on the phone and she asked me again to convey her thanks to everyone.

I'll continue to update, and continue to be most grateful for the caring shown us.

Till then...

posted April 22, 2003 05:00 AM         

I just want you to know I'm thinking of you and wishing you all the best.

no energy to write or read lengthy posts (personal issues), I just briefly read your post, and since I know your problem from before, here's another idea: visualise this woman in your thoughts and cross her out (just like you cross a word on the paper) and push her away. Do this whenever you think of her and notice that you are being disturbed by what she has done. And imagine a white protective light around you and your daughter. That is, if you feel frustrated and feel that you can't defend yourself otherwise. But it helps either way, one just has to be persistent in practicing this. It makes you feel stronger and protected. And if you feel strong inside, nothing can really hurt you because you emit that kind of energy field around you. Try it, it works.
I didn't have time to read all the posts, sorry. But I'm so glad that you and your daughter are back together again. See?

posted April 22, 2003 08:30 AM         

Good to see you again! Thank you for the suggestion; it's a good idea and I'll begin right away.

I hope you're doing okay and that whatever you're dealing with isn't too serious. Please know that if you ever need to share, I'm here...you can ask Randall for my e-mail address...and remember the drawbacks of keeping things inside, especially for us Lunar Scorps. I'll respect your feelings either way; just wanted to let you know you've got a shoulder here.

About my daughter: she called me early this morning to tell me she's hemorrhaging. It is "that time" and she has a history of problems with this, but she began the pill a few months ago which was supposed to help...and now she's worse than ever! I suspect at least part of this is related to all the stress she's been under and she does have a Dr. appt. Friday...but I'm worried sick about her! PLEASE...send her some healing light.

posted April 23, 2003 07:07 AM         

Twinlady, I'm sending her healing light and above all strength and protection because I feel this is what she really needs. Yes, her hemorrhaging is probably due to stress, I've had some friends who experienced that. I've read your posts and from what I see, this person (the daughter) is being nothing but a big time nuissance. What is your daughter so afraid of? Does she have a secret she doesn't want her to reveal or something like that? Does she feel she will hurt her physically? If not, then she better ignore her because this woman is getting exactly what she wants - she is forcing her to become a nervous wreck. And this woman can not keep doing this till kingdom come, she has her own life too, doesn't she? This will pass, even quicker so if she sees that she is causing no effect. Your daughter's reactions are encouraging her and giving her energy for further harrassment. All this reminded me of voodoo: do you know why voodoo works? Because all the victims are informed beforehand that a spell has been cast upon them. Voodoo works via suggestion, using the fear of the victim to destroy her/himself. (You know how the victim always finds a chicken leg or something? Well, this is for the sole purpose to scare her/him.) The spell has no actual power, it's all the victim's doing. This is exactly what your former friend is doing, keep that in mind, dear Twinlady, and tell this to your daughter. Speak to her about what she is so afraid of and once when the logical thinking is out in the open, hopefully she will realize that her fear is irrational and it will go away. About the actual damage, it's all harrassment, and legally you can probably do nothing unless some real damage is done (hope not, I'm keeping my fingers crossed!). You know how dogs bite you only if you're afraid of them? They can actually smell fear (we're releasing hormones that emit a certain smell). Well, it's been established that we humans can also smell fear (just like we smell out an attractive person - don't laugh, this is all scientific fact ), and this woman is smelling fear from your daughter. Please try to make her understand that she can't harm her unless she herself lets her. This is a battle of wills more than anything else, and I think you'll win. Twinlady, use your awsome power you know you have. You know what I mean You can spread it on your daughter too. You two just stick to your guns and everything will be alright. And please tell your daughter not to blow this out of proportion, make her see this for what it really is, a person banging her head against her door. It should in fact amuse her that somebody is willing to go to all this trouble just to make a fool out of herself. See the humorous side of this and it will immediately be shown in a different light. Mind over matter. We all see what we want to see, a projection of our thought-patterns. OK, I'll stop preaching now. Twinlady, you won't believe this, but my thoughts are with you for these past few days, ever since I first read your topic, so please know that I'm sending you and your daughter strength and power and love to see you through!

And Twinlady, I can't tell you how much I appreciate you. Right now, only the notion that you are here for me helps me and keeps me here. Thank you! I'm having one of my "feeling alone in the world" periods and waiting for it to pass. Well, I'm sharing now, aren't I It'll be better soon. There are worse things in the world, right?

I'm sending you this link for some mental support:
http://www.linda-goodman.com/ubb/Forum2/HTML/000016.html

posted April 23, 2003 10:57 AM         

Morgana

Thank-you for your recent post; you are such a caring person!

To address some of your questions: You asked me what my daughter is so afraid of. I believe it is not so much any kind of secret that she doesn't want revealed, as it is the fact that over the past year and a half she has been through two horrendous, life-threatening experiences, both requiring hospitalization and follow-up therapy...and the memory of these is still very fresh in her mind. She is still so vulnerable and not fully recovered from them, so she is not as strong as she might otherwise be. Also, given the fact that her Moon is in Pisces, her emotions are fragile and her sensitivity to being hurt is very pronounced. I cannot go into the specifics as they are too personal but I can say that what she went through was so horrible and my role as supporter was so demanding that eventually I was driven to seek therapy too. THIS is why I am so worried about her. I know only too well what she has been trying to cope with, and to have this kind of harassment/terrorizing dumped on her from someone who was supposedly a "friend" has been taking my daughter to the limits of her endurance.

As for my daughter's fears of being physically harmed by this person, they are not unfounded. She has a history of physical violence, though nothing was ever severe enough to involve the law (not to my knowledge, anyway). One of the reasons my daughter decided she didn't want to associate with this person any longer was her witnessing the cruel abuse towards her (now ex) BF.

(continued)

posted April 23, 2003 10:58 AM         

I personally have handled everything, beginning with the mother (my ex "friend") and the daughter's harassment of me, up to what's been happening more recently with my daughter, by ignoring it as best I can. Every day, I get up to 10 or more phonecalls where no message is left on my answering machine; only hang-ups. I can't prove it, but I'm certain the majority of these calls are coming from either the mother (who is out of state) or the daughter (whose number is blocked), which prevents me from ID'ing them. I just don't believe THAT many calls are coming from solicitors. This is not an unfounded suspicion either because I've seen both mother and daughter "in action" re abuse of the telephone. Sick!

I agree you wholeheartedly about this woman accomplishing exactly what she wants when my daughter reacts with so much fear that it's affecting her emotional/physical health and now her job, and I've told her so numerous times. As for how long this could continue...I don't know...it's been going on from the mother for over 7 months now. The daughter does have her moon in Leo, (not meaning to offend anything Leo here! ) squaring my Moon within 1 degree and her own Ascendant within a few more...and I can't help feeling that she has a need to be seen, noticed, heard etc., and for the dramatic. Also, based on the fact that she lost her BF and my daughter's friendship at the same time, I'm sensing that she has little else going on in her life presently other than her job, so she apparently has too much time on her hands. It's pathetic really, because this is a very bright, very intelligent young woman, and it always saddens me to see someone misuse their talents in such a destructive way; to others and themselves.

You are right Morgana, this IS a battle of wills, and I am confident that at least I, with my Scorpio Moon will outlast this; I only hope my daughter's Scorp Ascendant aids her in doing the same. Believe me, I am talking with her as much as she will allow, and really emphasizing the strength of her Rising Sign, while fully understanding her sensitive Pisces Moon and Gemini Sun tendencies to get nerve-wracked so easily. Her youth works against her because she just hasn't had the years of introspection to process all that she is. I'm doing my utmost to explain this to her based on my own long struggle with these same tendencies with the hope that she may be spared at least some of the trauma...but I do realize this is her life and ultimately the lesson must be hers. I hate to admit it, but my ex-husband was right when he said that this is her problem and only she can fix it. And that brings me back to square one in realizing I can only do so much in my "supporting role". (Tell that to my Mars in Cancer, lol).

ANYWAY...I've rambled long enough. Again, thank-you for the advice, and I don't feel you are preaching at all; to the contrary, I can sense your caring in your posts.

Till next time,

posted April 24, 2003 04:14 AM         

I wish you and your daughter all the best and I'm ordaining all this harrassment to stop (see, it doesn't hurt to try ).