posted September 18, 2003 04:35 PM         

I think your question is actually about the wisdom or ridiculousness of promising sexual fidelity during marriage until death.

posted September 18, 2003 04:41 PM         

UGH!

posted September 18, 2003 07:16 PM         

And oh my but you will find polarized opinions on this! We are all individuals, we have different answers for ourselves.

Personally, I think it's difficult, if not impossible, to project so far into the future that I can make a promise like that here and now...I'm not against marriage, or exclusive partnerships, at all. But, I think they take work to maintain...and because we change with time, our preferences can change as well. It's less about failure, than it is about change.

On the other hand, some people just like to screw around.

I've read your posts, you're an insightful person. I'm not an astrologer, but I don't know that you can pinpoint with certainty any particular sign that is given to 'cheating,' (I'm not fond of that word when it comes to infidelity), though there may be some aspects in an individual's chart that indicate it.

posted September 18, 2003 07:51 PM           

The power grid works because people are employed to run it, the computer in your office works because millions of people put in hours to design it so it runs efficiently.

posted September 22, 2003 06:47 AM         

First...They go into it thinking they can "Change" the person they are marrying into what they want them to be.

You have to LOVE and accept WHO you are marrying. If not,you both are miserable.

Secondly...
Women will use the "Sex" card against the man.They are programmed to have sex. They are
from MARS!!!hahaha
Seriously, once this happens and you find yourself only having sex every couple of months,or longer. Women get into a funk where it gets easier not to, but the Men are still thinking about it every 45 seconds!

You should keep that part seperate from daily fights.What better way to get out all your pent up aggressions!! Also,they are much happier, and it only takes 20 minutes, and I can get the trash taken out, the house swept,laundry put away....

Thirdly?.....

Keep the past ....there!
Don't give explicit details of past indescrections. Noone wants to picture their loved one having sex with someone else. Unless there is a hubby or someone they know about,or medical reasons, keep that in the past.
Whatever you did to get to where you are is just what you had to do to get to be the person they love right now. Don't feel guilty. Live and Learn!!!

Fourthly??........MONEY IS SHARED!!!
It's not your and mine, It is ours!!! Equally share this responsibility, or if a stay at home mom, respect the budget. Ask for what you need, and you will eventually get what you want.Don't fight over money, you are one after marriage, act like it!

5. Check out their parents... if mom and dad are in the state hospital, you may want to rethink this!!

posted September 22, 2003 07:23 AM         

I do believe in exclusive sexual relations, it just too dangerious out there any other way.

Just my thoughts

posted September 22, 2003 08:05 AM           

I think that everyone has to come to their own conclusions on this question.
I mean, I was in the middle to watch and occaisionaly be dragged into the crumbling of a marriage - and am still around to feel the continuing shockwaves of the dissolution-, but I still think that an exclusive union can work.

Yeah, I think that I've lost what I was going to say. It was something about how, yeah, commitment to another takes work, but that the dividends are deep understanding and trust - the effort put in is compensated by reward and growth (the latter not always being "pleasant" in the normal sense of the word, but immensely fulfilling in the long term). In contrast, a one-night-stand, say, has immediate physical rewards, but there's a reason that many feel emptied of themselves afterwards. Even college students - arguably the most hedonistic people on earth - refer to the exit the next morning as "the walk of shame", and not because they've been bred to be that way; the feeling of profound emptiness (I didn't want to use that word again, but it fits so well) that's experienced when one sleeps with someone not loved, even if that action takes place in the context of a "relationship" (of the hollow "I'm just with you b/c I don't want to be alone" variety), is too deep to be conditioned away. The only remedy that I've found for it is to make love wholly, to share and open yourself completely to another who's doing the same for you - and that kind of extreme vulnerability is made easier in the context of some sort abiding commitment, a promise made that neither you nor your partner will betray the trust of the other.

posted September 22, 2003 08:17 AM         

"I don't think either of us is a typical Taurus and a Leo for we have only had three arguments these past 7 years together."

posted September 22, 2003 10:31 AM           

Rules That I Learned From My Parents
Or: Learning What to Do by Seeing What Not to Do
* If at all possible, don't hold grudges & don't go to bed angry.
* Air your fears if you need to (better than letting them fester), but don't do so in an accusing way; try your ever-lovin' hardest to convey to them that these are your unfounded fears, but that they eat on you. Ask for their help in addressing them, and be able to know that they'll do the same for you.
* Talk, fer chrissakes - no matter how mad or misunderstood you feel at the moment, talk with the other. If you feel yourself getting riled up again, step back and allow yourself to calm down; barring that, take a break. Try your best to see the other's perspective, even if you don't think that you'll agree, and then voice it back to them to see if you've got it right. Hug. A lot. For no apparent reason.
*When in an argument, do you best to consistently establish eye contact - it's easier to mentally and emotionally disconnect with someone if you've already done so physically.
* Don't ever, ever, EVER resort to calling the other person hurtful names.
* Avoid blanket or generalizing statements about behavior like the flippin' plague.
* Recognized that your partner's vulnerability to you is as great as yours is to them.
* I don't care how busy you are, make time for the other, moving heaven and earth if necessary. Make sure that it's time with your partner...no matter how much time you may expend on activities or priorities that take place *around* your partner, those things on which you have built your relationship will eventually transform or disappear. You'll then be left with a shell without substance, easier to break than you would have ever imagined.
* To reiterate an earlier statement, don't use sex as a weapon or as a tool. In a marriage, it's an expression of commitment and a reassurance of an enduring bond (well, among other things) - keep it that way. And if you're not in the mood, just say it - don't use excuses.
* Arguments happen, and if you have kids they're most likely going to know that something is up, but DO NOT involve them in the fight. Ever.
* Remember why you first fell in love with them while also realizing that people do change and some habits can become grating. Be sure that you love the core of them, not just the trappings.

And one, for my own personal use:
* I promised myself that I would not marry a man who drinks. I've just seen too much ugliness on that front to bear it in someone else that I love.
If my husband (shortly, Jason) were to get addicted to some substance or activity...I would have to separate myself and our children from the situation. I would still love him - and I'd do everything to let him know that that is so - and I would not leave...permanently, but I could not stay there for the time.
ed: Heck, I don't even know if I could leave unless it was absolutely necessary.

posted September 22, 2003 03:04 PM           

* Appreciate kindnesses from your partner. After a while, it's easy to take them and all that they do for you for granted; say, "Thank you."

posted September 22, 2003 04:17 PM         

It's been my experience and observation that so many relationships are lopsided. One party loves more than the other, one side does the majority of giving, and giving some more, while the other excels at taking. So while one side is trying to practice all the lovely things outlined by proxie and Annie, I've often seen the other side taking advantage and acting childish/selfish.

So many of our relationships are finite, whether friends or lovers. That's no excuse for being cruel or mean in a relationship, I'm just saying that sometimes we become betrothed to a person who might not be 'The One' forever. No matter how far you look into that crystal ball, the future remains uncertain.

That being said, I believe in love and its power within us to heal all and fix all. It may wax and wane, but its strength need not be in doubt.

posted September 22, 2003 05:50 PM           

There are very many people my age scared to death of marriage for that very reason: they've been through the heart-wrenching torment of seeing their own family split and splintered; and, as a result, I've heard most of them say at one point or another, "If I ever get married, I'm going to be sure...and once I am, I don't care what happens - we're staying married come hell or high water."
(Heh, but, then, many of the people that are "my age" have Pluto in Libra )
So, anyway, yeah - we've done a lot of hard thinking about this, as a rule.

(And just to make sure that this post has no coherence...geez, I'm tired today...)

posted September 22, 2003 06:24 PM           

I dunno...I know that there will be people that'll jump to the defense of this practice, but it just seems...hm...it just seems that more hurt than belongs in a relationship would be introduced with this. It seems like an inherintly unstable mix, if that makes any sense, and that - no matter how noble the intentions are - the result wouldn't be kosher.
Say all that you will about "cultural subjectivity", but I've heard and read enough anthropological interviews with women in polygamous societies, men in polyandrous ones, and from both in those that practice a really lose definition of marriage, and no matter how ingrained the tradition is there, strong contrary feelings always emerge.

posted September 22, 2003 07:15 PM         

I have known people who are very happy to be in polygamous (and by that, I mean more than one mate, not necessarily more than one wife) relationships. Is it for me? Nah, probably not...but I have personally have been in what I'd call 'open' relationships. They were men I loved, or cared for, but I was not in love with them.

What we've found is that these things vary from individual to individual. The most important thing is to be happy...and, to be happy for others who have found the one they love, even if their relationships don't fit our own definitions of what they should be.

I've known lots of folks, proxie, who also stay in relationships that seem to be over, or destructive, or unloving, whatever. None of us can begin to answer why they stay. I've watched women stay with physically abusive men--this isn't the 1950's, there are many ways to get out of those relationships. These are women with their own incomes, their own lives, and they stay. Why? Because, bottom line, they want to.

I have a very attractive friend who is living in Fla.; she called the other day, to tell me her BF just bought her a Jaguar. He's an older man, obviously well off, and he represents financial security to her. It's her typical MO. But she is good and kind to these men, supportive, and they both get something they want. So who am I to say it's screwy?

posted September 22, 2003 07:18 PM         

Goodness, but there are loads of wise women here, that's why I keep coming back with such regularity!

posted September 23, 2003 04:30 PM         

People have said that I'm very strong probably becuase of all the patience I have to endure. I believe there is a good reason for everything and things will work our for the best. I have a confidence that I'll marry and have children someday.

Are we all designed to have a monogomous relationships? Yes I believe thats how it was originally, from the intangible sense. Any other way would be empty and meaningless in my eyes. Don't you think our society has become more cynical, and more shallow over relationships?