posted August 28, 2007 03:04 PM         

"I took the road less travelled" and all that. This man obviously was abused horribly as a child or else he wouldn't have done it to another child. He chose to continue the cycle instead of breaking it. Does what happened to him suck? Yes. Does that give him the right to do it to someone else in order to get rid of his poisons? No.

The worst part about it, is that even after this man is dead it won't bring her back. I personally think he ought to be kept alive and made to see pictures of the coroner's reports, video of this little girl. Every day. All day. Until he can't stand it, and then be made to watch some more.

Peace,
GG

posted August 28, 2007 03:06 PM         

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Now bring on the cheerleading squad to help you in playing the poor, misunderstood martyr.

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I thought we were calling it his "t-shirt girls" at one point....

If I am part of this perceived "cheerleading squad" that is always brought up because I often resonate to what a person has to say, and sometimes choose to say so, so be it!

Can it be that simple?

He didnt ask me to come in here and say anything. I did so on my own.

There are a hell of a lot more of these little so-called "cheerleading squads" on this forum, dont forget.

posted August 28, 2007 04:06 PM           

As to the sex offenders list.

It is not a fair list.
It needs much rewriting of it.

I just read a few days ago about a young man, age 17, tried as an adult, who will be labeled a sexual predator for life and has been sentenced to prison for a minimum of 10 years.

His crime?
Mutual Oral sex with his 15 year old girlfriend. Not forced at all.
But rich mommy and daddy did not like it and now this young man's life is ruined.

posted August 28, 2007 06:58 PM         

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Your emotions are clouding your judgment.

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What you're saying is absolutely true. Cooler heads may prevail and all that, but the little girl will still be gone. All the wisdom and higher perspective in the world won't bring her back, and probably won't stop the same thing from happening again. It's an emotional thing.

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Thanks for putting yourself out on the line.

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Agreed. It certainly isn't easy to step back from this and look at the bigger picture... but we'll always stay exactly where we are if we don't.

Sucks that justice is, it seems, invisible.

posted August 29, 2007 03:58 AM         

I think 26T is right- we should focus on the intention behind a person's words.

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Do you really wish to end senseless rape and violence?
Then do not contribute to it with your own bloodlust!

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By reacting to 'evil' with 'evil', you only make 'evil' stronger.

I'm not saying I am totally against killing people like that. Back in the tribal days, the families and friends of the victim would have sorted the person out themselves. This would have ensured protection for the innocents in that community and that the same horrific thing didn't happen to any other by the hands of the same sicko. There are some people who enjoy being sadistic and will never stop lying; you can't reason with these kind of people, but I do believe eventually that their souls will be redeemed and evolve.
These days, we have prisons so it is not necessary to kill to protect.

What I am completely against is the idea of torturing a person for punishment and revenge, ie, the electric chair (SICK). This will not cure their evil. This IS evil!!!!!!

(If people think it will teach them a lesson, to know what pain feels like- it is likely that they already know what pain feels like as they have often been abused themselves. It's a power thing- no empathy. If an abused person has empathy in them, their experiences will not cause them to abuse).

The idea that fear of the consequences would deter someone as sick as that from their actions has never shown to work either. The state of mind that requires such atrocities is beyond their sense of reasoning.

Protect the innocent by all means, but I feel very strongly that you can't fight or destroy evil with more evil.

We never have.

posted August 29, 2007 04:29 AM           

We have not judged the man. He was judged by a jury of his peers. We have not sentenced the man. The judge did, following the recommendation of the jury who heard all the evidence.

What we are happy about is that for once justice has been done in favor of that child and her parents. For once someone had to take full responsibilty for their actions.

Pediphiles cannot be rehabilitated. They cannot be cured of their twisted sexual urges. Anyone who thinks they can should read up on the psychology of pediphilia.

Society is not responsible for "making" this man the way he is. No one makes anyone the way they are. It is precisely as Goatgirl described. We choose to either let things that happened to us in our lives make us a monster and take it out on others or we choose to overcome it and lead a productive life. No one is responsible for the actions of other people. We are only responsible for our own actions.

Since Jesus was brought up in this thread he was not exactly easy on those who harmed children. He once ( in Scripture) sat a child on his lap and told those around him, " anyone who harms or leads one of these little ones astray, it is better for him that he have a millstone hung around his neck and be cast into the sea" in comparison to the judgment of God he faces. So it is not we who have to worry about what this man will do to us in the astral realm. In the astral realm he can't hurt anyone. It is he who needs to worry about the astral realm and about what kind of judgment he faces there. It may be a whole lot worse than being put to death by lethal injection or any judgment of him we might make.

How many people have you heard of who were actually rehabilitated in prison? Very few. Most people come out of prison worse than when they went in. How many people have you heard of who spent time in prison and when released committed the same or worse crimes? Lots!!!! Our society has been way too lenient on pediphiles and they will always be repeat offenders. It's time, as Zala said, that society sends out a new message to those who prey on children.

I am like Zala. I will take my chances on being judged by Jesus for being happy that this man is going to be put to death so he can't hurt anymore children in comparison to the judgment facing this man for the many children he has hurt and the one that he raped and buried alive.

posted August 29, 2007 05:55 AM           

Right now I am just not ready to forgive this man. That will come in time. After all, in time I forgave the man who sexually abused me. And my experience did not make me grow up to be a monster who sexually abused and murdered children.

Let me tell those who would judge me and the others here for being happy that justice has been done for that child, that unless you know how a child feels in that situation, how terrifying it was for her even before he put her under the ground alive, you have no right to judge the emotional reaction of anyone else towards the man who did this heinous act. They feel as they do out of empathy.

It's easy to take the moral high road when it's someone else's child. It would not be that easy if it were your own child. It would not be easy if you were ever sexually abused as a child. Mainly because you do have empathy knowing how it feels to be a small child and put in a completely helpless and frightening situation like that.

Others can be saints. I am content being a mere imperfect,flawed human being trying to slowly become a little bit better as a person each day with the help of God and his grace. Jesus isn't done with me yet.

It's wrong to say that Jesus will automatically forgive this man. It doesn't work that way. Jesus will forgive him if he is sincere and contrite and asks God for forgiveness. So yes, there is a chance that no matter how horrible his crime was or what horrible things he has done in his life, he can and will be forgiven if even with his dying breath he is sincerely remorseful and contrite and asks for forgiveness from God. If he doesn't he will be judged because God is loving, forgiving and good but he is also a God of judgment. We tend to forget that little aspect of God.

This is all I intend to say about this. I do agree with what everyone has said here. I haven't exactly lived for 61 years with my head in the sand so I do know a few things about spirituality and religion and especially Christianity and the teachings of Jesus. I got an A in moral theology. Believe it or not.

posted August 29, 2007 08:39 AM         

Death is not the end, and I don't believe prison would help. There are few individuals in the world, such as that man, who are too far gone to be rehabilitated- that will come in another life time. Like I said, if we didn't have prisons (we need better prisons), death of the psycho to protect innocent children is justified. We all have to face up to the consequences of our actions and this man took that little girl's life. We should show zero tolerance to that sort of behavior- to protect the innocent. All I was saying was I was against 'bloodlust', though I can understand those feelings to be a natural reaction to something horrifying. Protect the innocent children. When we are children, we feel things so much more acutely.

The 'soft approach' on criminals doesn't work. I agree with the middle road. Murders who came from rough backgrounds could be rehabilitated with the right care, but pure, psychotic sadism and those who abuse the innocent is completely different The death sentence, if used at all, should only apply to such individuals.

I would like to see animal abusers being punished too. Something has to be done to protect the innocent. That's the only way we can evolve as a human race.

On reflection, I do believe in 'free will'. We do have the power to make choices. I think that when we make the wrong choices, we sink deeper and deeper into ignorance (forgetting who we really are)......when we make the right ones we are drawn closer to the light.....the 'light' being heightened spiritual awareness.

What was that film called.....about the little black girl who was raped and murdered, but they weren't getting justice?
I must admit, when I watched that film, it felt good to see the father shoot the killer!

What I'm saying is I agree that you can't let torturers get away with their actions, however, I disagree with any sort of revenge which is purely sadistic, etc.....it only corrupts the souls of those inflicting it.

posted August 29, 2007 01:27 PM           

I agree LTT and that is how I feel about capital punishment. There are some crimes such as preying on the innocent that should be mandatory death. I feel that way even if it's the parents who harm the child with physical and sexual abuse. We have to rid society of these people. It is, as you said, the only way we can protect our children.

What GG described is why evil is and probably always will be perpetuated in our society. It's perpetuated because there is little or no attempt on the person's part to break the cycle. That's why the responsibility lies completely in our actions. We are guilty as HSC says in the sense that each and every one of our actions aids in making the world the way it is.

Speaking for myself "bloodlust" has little to do with my happiness over this man being removed from the world society. I think that reference was a bit over dramatic. Justice and the strong message it is sending out as to what the rest of society will tolerate is what I am happy about. Do I think the man is a "monster?" Yes. To that little girl he was a monster. He was her worse nightmare come true. Ask yourself, could anyone but a monster do what he did to that child? To any helpless and innocent child?

We cannot redeem people. Only God is capable of redemption and God is only capable of doing it if the person is open to it and wants to be redeemed. Well, barring a miracle because God is capable of doing anything good. Mostly though, God chooses to work with us, with us making the effort. That's why he gave us free will. It's why he said, " I set two choices before you. Life or death. Choose life." I take it he was speaking of life of the soul since we all die physically but our soul is eternal. Couey made his choice. So it was he who chose death. And he alone is responsible for the choice he made. We all are solely responsible for the choices we make. Couey is not a young man. He is pretty old and he had a lot of years open to him to be redeemed and overcome whatever may have contributed to twisting his mind and corrupting his soul. He chose to work it out on others rather than inwardly work it out. His life is ending according to the choices he made. He chose his own death. More than that he chose the death of that child at the age of only 9 years. It would be misguided and misdirected compassion on my part to feel bad that his own physical death was chosen by a judge, jury and the State of Florida. Mainly because he had already chosen the death of his soul and conscience.

I don't really care how other people judge me or my actions. Because I only have one judge that really counts and who will ultimately judge me and my actions for all eternity. It is only that judge that any of should be concerned about. Any judgment that I make of the character of another person is always going to based strictly on my own perceptions and biases without knowledge of the state of a person's soul. That pertains to all of us. Only God can see into the souls of all of us so only his judgment matters.

posted August 29, 2007 01:35 PM         

That's an interesting perspective you bring up. I have something I'd like to speak with you in private along this line of thoughts, when you have a moment.

Hugs,
GG

posted August 29, 2007 01:42 PM         

This has just become a debate/ discussion on the whole issue of what the answers really are to try and "solve" these sorts of things.

I think every person here has made some very interesting points- I think all are valid; it is just a matter of putting it all together.......

I have been thinking about this issue some more today, since I put my last reply in. I have been re-viewing things.

posted August 29, 2007 01:53 PM         

I think you do have an interesting point.

It is not only 'bad' people who can become possessed. There are spirits who hang around who are so desperate to gain access to a physical body. It can happen when people are emotionally, physically, mentally run down or when under the influence of drugs and alcohol.

I have been thinking today that rehabilitation for all is the way forward. Some individuals are more difficult to rehabilitate than others. We just don't have the resources, psychiatrists and healers who can accomplish this right now.....as far as I know. One day. One day our attitudes will change and things will be possible. But first there are mountains to climb.

The study of psychology, counseling, etc and anything which teaches understanding is, I think, a step forward for humanity. We can get there. A Utopian world of perfect empathy

Has anyone heard of that thing about 100 monkeys? Apparently, when enough members of a species learn a skill, the others manage to pick it up by instinct, without being taught.

posted August 29, 2007 02:24 PM         

It's totally sick, what he did. His soul must be so incredibly dark to do something like that. I doubt he even knows what love is. Just a monster.

We don't have the means to heal/cure people like that right now. Maybe in the future. As for the issue of limbo/possession.....it doesn't necessarily mean all monsters like that all try to possess someone. Sometimes, probably. Others will move on and find out what it is they can do to pay off their debts.

posted August 29, 2007 04:38 PM           

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Fayte,

That's an interesting perspective you bring up. I have something I'd like to speak with you in private along this line of thoughts, when you have a moment.

Hugs,
GG

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Write me and I will reply as soon and as best I am able.
{{{HUGS}}}
Love
Fayte

posted August 29, 2007 04:58 PM         

Love,
GG

posted August 29, 2007 05:10 PM           

quote:

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Fayte,

I think you do have an interesting point.

It is not only 'bad' people who can become possessed. There are spirits who hang around who are so desperate to gain access to a physical body. It can happen when people are emotionally, physically, mentally run down or when under the influence of drugs and alcohol.

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quote:

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I have been thinking today that rehabilitation for all is the way forward. Some individuals are more difficult to rehabilitate than others. We just don't have the resources, psychiatrists and healers who can accomplish this right now.....as far as I know. One day. One day our attitudes will change and things will be possible. But first there are mountains to climb.

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posted August 29, 2007 06:42 PM           

quote:

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It's easy to take the moral high road when it's someone else's child. It would not be that easy if it were your own child.

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It would not be easy if you were ever sexually abused as a child. Mainly because you do have empathy knowing how it feels to be a small child and put in a completely helpless and frightening situation like that

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quote:

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I agree LTT and that is how I feel about capital punishment. There are some crimes such as preying on the innocent that should be mandatory death.

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quote:

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Pediphiles cannot be rehabilitated. They cannot be cured of their twisted sexual urges. Anyone who thinks they can should read up on the psychology of pediphilia.

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quote:

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Pediphiles cannot be rehabilitated.

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quote:

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As to the sex offenders list.

It is not a fair list.
It needs much rewriting of it.

I just read a few days ago about a young man, age 17, tried as an adult, who will be labeled a sexual predator for life and has been sentenced to prison for a minimum of 10 years.

His crime?
Mutual Oral sex with his 15 year old girlfriend. Not forced at all.
But rich mommy and daddy did not like it and now this young man's life is ruined.

---

quote:

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There are some crimes such as preying on the innocent that should be mandatory death.

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LTT

quote:

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The idea that fear of the consequences would deter someone as sick as that from their actions has never shown to work either. The state of mind that requires such atrocities is beyond their sense of reasoning.

Protect the innocent by all means, but I feel very strongly that you can't fight or destroy evil with more evil.

We never have.

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Only a deranged madman could do what he or others like him did.
So by that virtue all human "monsters" are insane,
because no sane person would ever commit such vile acts upon another person.

Again I submit;
We must find a way to find and identify these human "monsters" when they are children,
or babies, before they become monsters, or prevent them from becoming such creatures.
All were babies once. Something happened.
What?

posted August 29, 2007 07:13 PM           

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Right now I am just not ready to forgive this man.

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That will come in time. After all, in time I forgave the man who sexually abused me.

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quote:

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There are some crimes such as preying on the innocent that should be mandatory death. I feel that way even if it's the parents who harm the child with physical and sexual abuse. We have to rid society of these people. It is, as you said, the only way we can protect our children.

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