posted March 27, 2009 02:57 PM         

I tried.

I did my best.

You don't care.

About truth.

About honesty.

About justice and fairplay.

What sort of a person are you, anyway?

I thought you were better than that.

posted March 27, 2009 02:57 PM         

quote:

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Classic 26Taurus.

Maybe its not time to let it go, yet?

Maybe for once you shouldnt let it go?

Maybe its time to follow through?

Take responsibility for your part and your words?

Yes, I think so.

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posted March 27, 2009 03:07 PM         

(looks better on him)

you know i love him right.

what the crap is that all about

almost offended here.

posted March 27, 2009 03:09 PM         

if i could jam with john mayer i would quit smoking cold turkey.

posted March 27, 2009 03:14 PM         

none of us have to partake in threads we are not interested in.

try to remember that hot pants.

yeah i called you hot pants.

posted March 27, 2009 03:19 PM         

sorry, i was elsewhere.

have i mentioned how funny i think you are before?

also, john mayer is not my cup of tea for some reason... at all. especially in kim's underwear.

posted March 27, 2009 03:52 PM         

You are a truly amazing light in this world. I hope that I can be half the mother you are someday.. Thank you for your wisdom, as always.

HSC,

Thank you for apologizing. I apologize for striking back with alluding to what you said to me and for namecalling. (No, that's not what I was talking about that you said, it was kind of more knowing the circumstances and saying what you did that bothered me.) I'm so used to tiptoeing around sensitive people's feelings that I didn't have the heart to outright tell you I was offended. My b. I have since learned to be blunt and honest with people about my feelings. Hence this thread.

I'm sorry, really, that you still cannot see. But, I guess we're all guilty of it from time to time. I guess I'm just dissapointed at the degree of your insistance to be right. Since I really don't like banging my head against walls, I will stop trying to bring up my point. If it is supposed to become clear to you someday, then I guess it will. Probably not by me, probably not any time soon, but maybe... someday...

And yes, I do see where you are coming from in many ways. I'm sure a lot of people do. I just personally feel that you hide behind the martyr routine to justify your life and what you say to other people when you are in a rage, and that's a bit much to ask for everyone to be okay with and forgive but not give the same credit to them. That's all. I can see that you try, at times, to see the other side, but come on. I have been reading your posts for years now, and you really don't ever concede. I am one of the worlds biggest conceders, so I can tell when somebody cares if they have gone too far. You don't. If you were hurt, you would stop, or at least back off, but you don't.

That, to me, lacks empathy or compassion. Of course it's not big of any of us to throw stones at stone throwers, but that is a knee jerk reaction, and I will admit it. I did that. I said I'm sorry, I have laid out my feelings on this subject (that really isn't about your thread T, sorry again)and I am trying to see some reasonable resolution but finding it hard.

I just cannot believe what I'm reading from you and what others are reading from you and how you cannot seeeeee what we're talking about, you just keep circling back and turning the tables to avoid it.

I am trying, HONESTLY.

posted March 27, 2009 04:31 PM         

You continue to earn my respect.

I know you are trying, honestly.

I hope you can see that I am honestly trying, too.

quote:

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I'm sorry, really, that you still cannot see. But, I guess we're all guilty of it from time to time. I guess I'm just dissapointed at the degree of your insistance to be right. Since I really don't like banging my head against walls, I will stop trying to bring up my point. If it is supposed to become clear to you someday, then I guess it will. Probably not by me, probably not any time soon, but maybe... someday...

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I just want to ask you, nicely, to reread this.

What if I were to write this to you:

"Ghani, I'm really sorry that you still cannot see.
What bothers me most is your insistance that you are right.
Maybe, someday, if and when you are ready to see it,
you will come to see that I am right and you are wrong.
Probably not any time soon,.. but, maybe, someday."

You see it, too, don't you?
I'm not crazy, am I?

But, yeah, let's both stop banging our heads against this wall,
particularly, if we are not willing to offer arguments on the issue.

What's the point of just going back and forth like this,
if we are not systematically digging to the roots of our disagreement?

I'm sorry if my perspective reflects poorly on anyone else.

posted March 27, 2009 04:31 PM         

I liked what you wrote about mob mentality.

So, okay, let me try to clarify this.. again.

Superficial fun can be wonderful.
I just think sometimes it can go too far.

If we were posting pictures of other knowflakes,
and cracking jokes at them, even good-naturedly,
do you think that would be okay?

If I posted one of your pictures,
and made a joke about your outfit,
or about your haircut, or your face?
That would not be okay, right?

So, why is it okay when its a celebrity?

This is the question I have tried to pose.

I received a few very brief answers,
which I objected to with my own points,
and these points have been ignored.

People may think that I am not showing respect,
but I think my willingness to dialogue about this
says something about the respect I show to people's views.
No, not respect in the sense that I think they are correct,
or well-put, or that I will not try to cleverly debunk them, but,
at least, the respect to acknowledge and respond to them directly.

If anyone wants to continue the discussion,
maybe we can try to do so with more civility.
I will make an effort to be more tactful and considerate.
It would be nice if others would make an effort to address
my objections, and tell me why its okay to poke fun at celebs;
but not okay to post pics of knowflakes in order to joke about them.

posted March 27, 2009 04:57 PM         

there are m ore than one way to look at stuff and you show me that through your eyes all the time. lighten up and relaize they dont give a crap, until it becomes really really invasive, but look at certain ones, kurt russell, goldie hawn, who dont really make the headlines of myrth, they lay low. if the kitchen gets too hot, get out of it. ya know.

if they said, kc has a big nose, i say, so what i got a big butt too. dont feed the wolves and they wont come to your door when they get hungry.

posted March 27, 2009 05:30 PM         

26T, I don't know what is wrong with your health. Is it posted somewhere, did I miss it? It has been a lousy couple months. I want to know what is going on with you though.

sunshine, you said something that gave me a chuckle back there.

posted March 27, 2009 06:00 PM         

quote:

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hsc - to answer your question

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Bless your heart.

quote:

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with every choice we make there are consequences.

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Of course. Sometimes very painful ones, for others.

quote:

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if we choose a career that puts us in the lime light - we have to accept the crap on e news tonight that comes with it.
unless we live out of the lime light,like some celebrities try to do.

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Hmm...

Well, let me ask you this:

Suppose the Nazis decide that,
if any Jews want to live in Germany,
or pass through Germany's borders,
the consequence is internment.

Is that cool?

Should Jews just stay out of Germany,
or accept their fates in the crematoria?

Its an extreme example, yes,
but therein lies the clarity.

Should celebrities have to hide somewhere,
in Montana, or in the south of France?
Should they not be permitted to walk in Los Angeles or New York,
without being ambushed and accosted and ridiculed?
Should they have to live far away from where they do their business?

quote:

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like if my job was cleaning porta potties i cant very well say, the smell of crap is horrible, i shouldn't have to smell it. it is part of the job.

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I agree, it is part of the job.

But is being ridiculed part of being an entertainer?
More to the point, does it have to be? Is it right?

Cr*p and toilets go together like... cr*p and toilets.
But does entertaining have to go with being a laughing stock?

And does it give people the right to cr*p ALL OVER the toilets,
and to make more stink for the man whose job it is to clean them?

It may not be possible to clean toilets without getting dirty, --
after all, we cannot ask the cr*p to not be so stinky, can we?
But it seems possible to entertain without getting ridiculed, --
after all, we can ask one another not to be so inconsiderate, can't we?

quote:

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everyone with a mediocum of intellegence knows that half of the stuff written is made up.

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Most of the insults people sling are made up,
but they still sting, and some people will believe them.

In fact, I think you underestimate how many people out there
do not have a modicum of intelligence.

Stories about Kurt Cobain claimed he left his baby in a taxi cab,
because he was strung out on heroin; this was a blatant lie,
but, nevertheless, it was accepted by a lot of readers.

Why must these magazines make mean things up to make a buck?

And what about the stuff that is not made up?

Is that better, or worse?

quote:

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it all keeps thier name in the media, making them, a hot topic

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The "any press is good press" defense?
I have not found this to be the case.
I think plenty careers are ruined by bad press.

But even assuming it is true...

Many celebs can survive on raw talent and effort.

As for the ones who need bad press to make it in the bizz, --
do they really belong in the business, anyway?

Let them make it on account of their merits,
not on account of their ability to make an easy target.

quote:

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yes it is mean.

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Agreed.

Isn't this the end of the debate, lol.

quote:

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no they dont much mind.

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Many of them certainly claim to.
If we take them at their own words,
it is a hell of a cross to bear.
Not a moment of privacy.
Can't go out in public w/o
being hounded by paparazzi...

How about what happened to Princess Diana?
Was that just par for the course, too?
Part of being the Princess of Wales?
To be chased by obnoxious paparazzi,
and to crash and die in a tunnel?

quote:

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they can laugh or cry all the way to the bank.

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Or cry all the way to the poorhouse?

Did you see that photo of Tara Reid?
I wonder if she will ever get hired again.

Do I dare mention Joaquin Phoenix?
Sure, more people are coming to his shows,
just to laugh and mock at his performance.
See him jump off the stage at some heckler
who thinks it is his right to heckle.

Thats another one. Heckling.
Some people think that comes with being a comic.
But, really, its like someone coming to your job
and interrupting you and trying to rile you up.

The stuff you are defending isnt really different,
except that they are being hounded in their free time, lol!!
When they are not at work!! In other words, what free time?

Another word about Joaquin..
He goes on Letterman to promote his music,
and because he is soft-spoken and serious,
Letterman jumps at the chance to make fun.
He doesnt interview him about his music,
or about his reasons for leaving hollywood.
He just makes him a laughing-stock on live t.v.

quote:

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how can anyone make fun of me when i will do it first and harder?
what material you got now? do you seriously think kinm kardashian doesnt know she has a fat Ash?

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I'm sure most people with fat ashes know they have them.

I'm sure that wouldn't make it any less painful, though,
if someone were to plaster shots of it across the globe,
with captions about how fat it is, and so on.

quote:

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kurt russell, goldie hawn, who dont really make the headlines of myrth,
they lay low. if the kitchen gets too hot, get out of it

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Haven't seen them working much lately, either.

quote:

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lighten up and relaize they dont give a crap,

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listen up, and hear them telling you that they do give a crap.

quote:

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until it becomes really really invasive

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Define really, really invasive?

Following you in a car everywhere you go, taking picures?
Trash-talking about your most personal flaws and insecurities?
Making up all sorts of lies about you, making you sound like a junky,
or a child-beater, or a million other things they love to say?

quote:

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if they said, kc has a big nose, i say, so what i got a big butt too.
dont feed the wolves and they wont come to your door when they get hungry

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So...
Unless someone has as thick a skin as you do,
they deserve to be hounded and devoured by wolves?

Try to see it through somebody else's eyes.
Just because you can laugh it off,
doesnt mean everyone can,
or "should" be able to.

The reality is that many people are highly sensitive,
and artists/entertainers tend to be these sorts of people.

I dont think you realize how much courage it takes for so many of them,
to get up in front of people and just try not to embarrass themselves,
when it comes to their performance. But then, to be ridiculed for their butts?

quote:

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example -
john travolta
the media was disgusting when his son died.
family laid low and didnt partake.
the wolves moved on.

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Yes, a perfect example.
The wolves always move on.
After the damage has been done.

posted March 27, 2009 06:32 PM         

quote:

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Another word about Joaquin..
He goes on Letterman to promote his music,
and because he is soft-spoken and serious,
Letterman jumps at the chance to make fun.
He doesnt interview him about his music,
or about his reasons for leaving hollywood.
He just makes him a laughing-stock on live t.v.

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