posted March 24, 2009 04:43 PM         

I enjoyed your thoughts as well, MVM.

The way I was envisioning it is:

If enlightenment does exist,
it is a neurosis-free state.

All other states are relatively neurotic.

All that we think, feel, do, and are
appears to be determined by our limitations;
that is, by blindspots and weaknesses;
by lack of omniscience and omnipotence.

This is the "sickness unto death",
and the pregancy unto enlightenment.

We have smaller pangs and births,
but, we continue to struggle,
until we give birth to the Self.

The "pregnancy" that endures without a sign of rebirth
may simply require a longer period of gestation,
and the rebirth may be exponentially greater, when it does come.

posted March 24, 2009 06:52 PM         

i'm not entirely sure why i am
so attracted to these issues.

partly for myself, partly for society,
and partly for the sake of the truth.

posted March 24, 2009 07:18 PM         

And yeah, the birth can be delayed with a time of longer gestation for sure, I think.
But in keeping with the whole birth analogy, wouldn't one know that it is gestation? That the pain isn't meaningless? Like when a pregnant mother knows her baby is in there kicking, or can feel it moving. She knows it's in there.
I realize you're male, so I might really be reaching here LOL
I think at some point too if the delivery is delayed one might need to get the salad spoons out to help out the process....unless you want the process to be all-natural. Ok...really pushing the birth analogy here. But I just remembered something really odd.
When my grandmother was dying about 4 years ago, I was watching her die for a week. While she laid there, before they put her in hospice and injected her with morphine, I watched her body writhe, and I had the weirdest thought that it looked like she was giving birth. I could actually SEE her getting UP and OUT of her body. Like someone lifting themselves up from a really soft, comfortable chair they've been sitting in for a lifetime...the exertion was so clear.
It kinda freaked me out.
Maybe that exertion is the pain of delivery. I don't know.

posted March 24, 2009 07:32 PM         

quote:

---

When my grandmother was dying about 4 years ago, I was watching her die for a week. While she laid there, before they put her in hospice and injected her with morphine, I watched her body writhe, and I had the weirdest thought that it looked like she was giving birth. I could actually SEE her getting UP and OUT of her body. Like someone lifting themselves up from a really soft, comfortable chair they've been sitting in for a lifetime...the exertion was so clear.
It kinda freaked me out.
Maybe that exertion is the pain of delivery. I don't know.

---

posted March 24, 2009 09:26 PM         

TINK,

quote:

---

No one can give you evidence. How would you prove to a blind man that red is different than blue?

---

posted March 24, 2009 09:57 PM         

Here is the sum of what I have for you...

I think enough has panned out over the ages to give some merit/"proof" to "as above/so below" so what I was thinking of mostly had to do with a butterfly only being able to emerge in a transformed state after the proper amount of time in the cocoon. Without the proper amount of time in the cocoon the energies would not be be in the state they were working toward (kind of like interrupting the process in the middle of Beaming Up Scottie) and things would not end up a viable finished product.

Have you ever used a Ouija board? Do you believe in ghosts?

I mean, not everything has the same process but it is all "becoming" whatever it is becoming and some things have a more difficult route... like a baby who pops out before being fully "cooked" might not have everything traditionally "needed" for optimum survival as we see it... but that happens for a reason too then. Which I often feel I have gathered enough "proof" of, based on different experiences of my lifetime and how they worked out as wrong as they might appear to be to someone outside looking in... or even as wrong as they appeared to me. It seems I always eventually get to see the beauty in so much of it and the lessons so many learn... and how the coarser energies are eventually transformed...

And if you want some real proof...
when I had Rosie and held her in my arms and then stayed awake looking at her all night and she looked for hours into my eyes...
she wasn't saying to me, "Grrr Dayam Woman, why did you drag me into this existence!?!?"
She was saying to me, "Oh HELLO HELLO!!!! I am SO GLAD TO SEE YOU! I love you. I love you too. You are beautiful too. I am so happy to be with you."
Well, the transcript would take hours... but you get the idea. :.)

posted March 24, 2009 10:48 PM         

If only our lives could be spent cradled in a loving mother's arms.

posted March 26, 2009 05:19 PM         

Of course, now that I think about it, I might've also been bringing up the point that people that have been born blind are often much more able to extract evidences from conceptual thinking...simply out of their own practice of the craft.

And just for the sake of it, here's a cool article:
http://www.near-death.com/experiences/evidence03.html

posted March 26, 2009 06:46 PM         

quote:

---

Of course, now that I think about it, I might've also been bringing up the point that people that have been born blind are often much more able to extract evidences from conceptual thinking...simply out of their own practice of the craft.

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posted March 26, 2009 10:35 PM         

Isn't that one of the coolest quotes ever?

posted March 27, 2009 12:27 AM         

Thank you again, nosis.